LNers: Your Views of the Missed Shot?

[Steve Taylor]

Your?s is not a LN scenario. But ignoring that, how high up the fire escape of the Dal-Tex building would you think the shooter would be?
Level with which floor?
He needs to be high enough to clear the follow up car with the standing Secret Service agents on the running boards.

I've got a suspected shooter on the 2nd floor, and it looks like he threaded the needle or possibly shot on the right hand side of the SS car.  It used to be clear to me that 2 shooters are on the 3rd floor, but last year I was told by a photo analyst that I'm wrong.  Not quite sure on that one now.  Zapruder's 4th floor and above also have some windows visible in different photos.

 

[Nicholas Turner]

I've got a suspected shooter on the 2nd floor, and it looks like he threaded the needle or possibly shot on the right hand side of the SS car.  It used to be clear to me that 2 shooters are on the 3rd floor, but last year I was told by a photo analyst that I'm wrong.  Not quite sure on that one now.  Zapruder's 4th floor and above also have some windows visible in different photos.

Why do you think those are 'shooters'?

[Jerry Organ]

Thanks for the info Jerry.  Then why was there a need to change from the FBI 3 shot scenario to the SBT with 2 hits and 1 miss in Tagues direction?  The WC seems to disagree with your theory.

The Tague trajectory graphic I provided is an illustration of the claim that the curb strike originated from the head shot metal fragmentation.

The WCR could not decide between the two explanations in my post.

    "Even if it were caused by a bullet fragment, the mark on the
     south curb of Main Street cannot be identified conclusively
     with any of the three shots fired. Under the circumstances it
     might have come from the bullet which hit the President's head,
     or it might have been a product of the fragmentation of the
     missed shot upon hitting some other object in the area."

So you now can fault them for not concluding anything about the Tague hit, just as you would fault them if they had concluded something.

With reference to your graphic, LNers generally do not contend the Tague hit was a direct-line shot from the SN window.

[Dillon Rankine]

Then why was there a need to change from the FBI 3 shot scenario to the SBT with 2 hits and 1 miss in Tagues direction?

The FBI initially believed (upon accepting Tague?s story) that it was a result of headshot fragmentation, and a few variations of a SBT were proposed at the autopsy. The SBT stands for a few reasons, chief them was the existence of only two bullets and the torso wounds to JFK. Despite weirdly prevalent assertions to the contrary, a ?shallow back wound? is physically impossible.   

[Steve M. Galbraith]

The FBI initially believed (upon accepting Tague?s story) that it was a result of headshot fragmentation, and a few variations of a SBT were proposed at the autopsy. The SBT stands for a few reasons, chief them was the existence of only two bullets and the torso wounds to JFK. Despite weirdly prevalent assertions to the contrary, a ?shallow back wound? is physically impossible.   

Which "variation" of the SBT was proposed during the autopsy? I've never read that happened. From what I've read the autopsy doctors never considered the wounds on Connally. Why would they? Their job was to determine the cause of the injuries to JFK not Connally. Moreover, Humes said (the JAMA article, for example) they couldn't figure out where the bullet that entered the back went to. It wasn't until the next morning when he called Perry and learned that the tracheotomy covered a wound to the throat that he concluded it had exited there.

The FBI summary report didn't have access to the autopsy report and doesn't mention a bullet exiting JFK's throat/neck (as we've asked critics of the SBT: where did that go?). They relied on the Sibert and O'Neill account of the autopsy, an account which was incomplete and didn't mention a throat exit wound (because the autopsy doctors didn't consider it during the autopsy). From that the FBI concluded two shots hit JFK and a separate shot hit Connally. No SBT at all. No missed shots. Three shots, three hits.

FBI report is here: https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10402#relPageId=3&tab=toc

JAMA article is here: https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/arrb/master_med_set/md22/html/Image00.htm

[Micah Mileto]

There is photographic evidence for Kenning reacting to some severe external stimulus as he was lowering his arm from waving for the last time, between frames z190-224.

From the 1971 paper in the Journal of Forensic Sciences, Photographic Evidence and the Assassination of President John F. Kennedy by Don Olson and Ralph Turner: http://jfk.hood.edu/Collection/Weisberg%20Subject%20Index%20Files/J%20Disk/Journal%20of%20Forensic%20Science/Item%2001.pdf



The Warren Commission believed that frames 225-230 represented the President's reactions to a shot fired somewhere in the interval of Zapruder frames 210-224, while the President was behind the road sign. However, certain observations in the Zapruder film will be noted here to indicate that the first wounding of the President may not have been blocked from the record by the road sign. The transition in the President's appearance between frames 183 and 230 (described above) in fact seems to begin with certain reactions in the intervals of frames 194-206.

First, a general trend in the frames 194-206 may be noted. Beginning as early as frame 194, the President's body seems to undergo a motion forward and to the left. This motion, which can be visually approximated to be on the order of six or seven inches, seems to begin in frame 194 and continues through about frame 200. The President seems to move away from the seat back and tilt to to the left, away from the window ledge.

[...]

"Study of the frames reveals further information. Recalling the descriptions above, it is clear that between frames 183 and 230, two specific changes occurred in the President's position. First, the President turned his head and shoulders back from the crowd until he was facing forward. Also, the President's right arm moved from a position with the elbow below a chrome strip on the outside of the car, into a position with the arm and elbow well inside the car and raised almost to chin level. These frames and motions have been described in such great detail because both of these specific changes in Kennedy can be observed to occur in the "early Zapruder frames," i.e., those before the President disappears from view behind the road sign. In this context, It happens that frame 204 is very important.

On the interval the President's body is seen to narrow somewhat to the view, indicating that he not only leans to the Left front, but also is rotated to the left. The rotation of the shoulders begins as early as frame 195. His head comes around at 200-202. By frame 204 the President is facing almost directly forward.

As the President moves and rotates to the left, his right arm is pulled back into the car. While his elbow has been resting outside the car, it comes up noticeably at frame 195. The President's elbow can be seen to cross the chrome strip on the side of the car at frames As President Kennedy disappears from view behind the sign, his right arm seems to he in a particularly unusual position the clearly visible gray of his suit coat indicating that his right arm and elbow have been raised at least to the level of his chin."

From the 9/12/1978 testimony of Calvin McCamy, spokesman for the HSCA photographic evidence panel: https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=81#relPageId=148&tab=page

There is considerable blurring at this point. The President's arm is up in a waving position. His head is still toward the right. At this point there is considerable blur, and by here, it appears as though his head is beginning to turn quite rapidly to the left. His head is now to the left. That is only one-eighteenth of a second from one frame to the next. He continues to look toward the left. One barely sees his right ear toward the camera. It is quite clear he is here now looking directly at his wife. He and his wife can be seen looking at one another in this sequence. He now goes behind the sign, and only a fraction of a second later we see his hands moving upward. He has a gasping expression. His hands are in a classic position of a person who has been startled. He now begins to raise his arms into what I would call a defensive position. He may be clutching at the throat wound.

From the HSCA photographic evidence panel's final report: https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=958#relPageId=22&tab=page

(64) (a) By a vote of 12 to 5, the Panel determined that President Kennedy first showed a reaction to some severe external stimulus by Zapruder frame 207 as he is seen going behind a street sign that obstructed Zapruder's view.

(65) (b) By a vote of 11 to 3, the Panel determined that Governor Connally first showed a reaction to some severe external stimulus by Zapruder frame 224, virtually immediately after he is seen emerging from behind the sign that obstructed Zapruder's view."

[...]

(69) During the period of Connally's initial rapid movement, however, no one else shows a comparable reaction. The President does not appear to react to anything unusual prior to Zapruder frame 190. The Panel observed, however, that at approximately this time, a young girl who had been running across the grass, beyond the far curb of the street where the limousine was traveling, suddenly began to stop and turn sharply to her right, looking up the street in a direction behind the limousine.

(70) At approximately Zapruder frame 200, Kennedy's movements suddenly freeze; his right hand abruptly stops in the midst of a waving motion and his head moves rapidly from right to his left in the direction of his wife. Based on these movements, it appears that by the time the President goes behind the sign at frame 207 he is evidencing some kind of reaction to a severe external stimulus. By the time he emerges from behind the sign at Zapruder frame 225, the President makes a clutching motion with his hands toward his neck, indicating clearly that he has been shot.

HSCA photographic panelist Cecil Kirk's testimony at the 1986 mock trial of Lee Harvey Oswald:

[Micah Mileto]

Which "variation" of the SBT was proposed during the autopsy? I've never read that. From what I've read the autopsy doctors never considered the wounds on Connally. Why would they? Their job was to determine the cause of the injuries to JFK not Connally. Moreover, Humes said (the JAMA article, for example) they couldn't figure out where the bullet that entered the back went to. It wasn't until the next morning when he called Perry and learned that the trachestomy covered a wound to the throat that they concluded it had exited there.

The FBI summary report didn't have access to the autopsy report. They relied on the Sibert and O'Neill account of the autopsy, an account which was incomplete. From that the FBI concluded two shots hit JFK and a separate shot hit Connally. No SBT at all. No missed shots. Three shots, three hits.

FBI report is here: https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10402#relPageId=3&tab=toc

JAMA article is here: https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/arrb/master_med_set/md22/html/Image00.htm

James Curtis Jenkins 9/23/1979 interview with David Lifton

[Part VI ? 1979: The Coffin/Body Problem], [Chapter 27 ? The Recollections of James Curtis Jenkins, et al.], [Interviewing Jenkins]

Jenkins had vivid recollections about the controversy concerning the neck trajectory. The wound at the front of the throat, throughout the autopsy, he said, was assumed to be a tracheotomy. Yet, said Jenkins, the civilians who seemed to be in charge seemed to be trying to get Humes to conclude that a bullet passed from back to front through the body. Jenkins had a clear recollection that that wasn?t possible. He remembered very clearly Humes? probing the back wound with his little finger. ?What sticks out in my mind,? Jenkins told me, ?is the fact that Commander Humes put his little finger in it, and, you know, said that . . . he could probe the bottom of it with his finger, which would mean to me [it was] very shallow.? He had another recollection. After the body was opened and the organs removed, Jenkins watched the doctors probe it again. ?I . . . I remember looking inside the chest cavity and I could see the probe . . . through the pleura [the lining of the chest cavity]. . . .?

LIFTON: Explain that to me. You could see the probe that he was putting in the wound? You could see it through the pleura?

JENKINS: You could actually see where it was making an indentation.

LIFTON: . . . an indentation on the pleura.

JENKINS: Right . . . where it was pushing the skin up. . . . There was no entry into the chest cavity . . . it would have been no way that that could have exited in the front because it was then low in the chest cavity . . . somewhere around the junction of the descending aorta [the main artery carrying blood from the heart] or the bronchus in the lungs. . . .

LIFTON: Did you hear Humes say he could feel the bottom of it with his finger?

JENKINS: Yes, I did.

I told Jenkins that Humes testified that he found a bruise atop the upper lobe of the lung, and that was the evidence for the bullet going all the way through. Jenkins told me he had no recollection of any such bruise being examined the night of the autopsy.

I was unwilling to believe that Humes made that up out of whole cloth; and, anyway, photographer Stringer told me he had photographed it.

I asked Jenkins what conclusions he had expected the au- topsy report to state based on what he saw while he was there. He said he assumed the report would have concluded that the President had been shot once in the back from behind ??and that they could not find the bullet?? ?and that the second shot, to the head, came from the front.

I asked Jenkins how he explained the autopsy report that was written. Jenkins minced no words. He said that Humes was a ?super-military type of person??? not in the sense that he was authoritarian , but that he was concerned with his next promotion and his career in general. ?He was the type of individual that would do anything anybody above him told him to do . . . my personal feeling is that he was probably directed to write the autopsy report.??

Jenkins told me he has always assumed such ? directions?? came ?from someone outside the hospital.??

I said that the chain of command was short? Humes? senior officers were Stover, C .O. of the Medical School; Galloway, C.O. of the Medical Center, and Kenney, the Surgeon General. ? And then you?re either at the Joint Chiefs of Staff or orders from the White House.?? Jenkins replied : ?I didn?t say that; you did.

It was obvious that he had given the matter some thought, and he was not comfortable discussing it.

Jenkins? statement that the ?Friday night conclusion?? regarding the neck trajectory was different from the autopsy report was not new. That was the old ? non-transit/transit conflict between the FBI report and the navy autopsy. But the statement that the doctors did not come to a firm conclusion about the head shot, that their discussions were tentative, was new. To evaluate that , and much else Jenkins said, it is necessary to make a brief digression.

[...]

[Part VII ? Synthesis], [Chapter 30 ? The X-rays and Photographs Reconsidered], [The Puzzle of the Ruler]

James Jenkins told me that during the autopsy, when the "civilians" were practically arguing with Humes, they put the idea to him that the bullet entered at the rear, exiting through the tracheotomy incision , and that that bullet went on to hit Connally.**62

[...]

**Unfortunately, Jenkins never made a written record , and so it is easy to discount his recollections by claiming he was influenced by what he later read in books and magazines. But having spoken with him, I didn?t belive that was the case. Jenkins did not follow the case and, in fact, until I spoke with him in September 1979, did not know a bullet wound at the front of the neck had been observed in Dallas. Jenkins kept referring to it as the "tracheotomy incision," and couldn?t understand why those ?civilians in the autopsy room kept claiming that a bullet exited there.

[Steve Taylor]

Why do you think those are 'shooters'?

I'll limit myself to the 2d floor here.  I believe this man pictured at Z255 fired the first shot(s) and is withdrawing from the window.  He is standing, looking down at the rifle as he pulls it back in.  His left hand is visible blocking a complete view of the buttstock.  It looks like he is wearing a black glove.  The glasses are partially visible just below the brim of his cap and are reflecting the Sun. I believe the key to this being a rifle is the sharp curve on the object (to our left).  The rifle is laying on its side.  You see this outline on many types of rifle. I don't believe this could be an arm unless it has severe multiple fractures.