Users Currently Browsing This Topic:
0 Members

Author Topic: CT's, in court how would you defend Oswald?  (Read 127001 times)

Offline Bill Chapman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6506
Re: CT's, in court how would you defend Oswald?
« Reply #440 on: August 11, 2019, 10:04:17 PM »
Advertisement
No need.  Frazier was quite clear when he spoke to Tom Meros.

Tom Meros: And when he walked on ahead of you could you even see the package?
Buell Frazier:  No
Tom Meros: Unless you knew it was there, you wouldn't know what to look for.  You wouldn't even know that he had a package in his hand.
Buell Frazier: That is correct.


 ::)

No coaching there..
« Last Edit: August 11, 2019, 10:05:03 PM by Bill Chapman »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: CT's, in court how would you defend Oswald?
« Reply #440 on: August 11, 2019, 10:04:17 PM »


Offline John Iacoletti

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10866
Re: CT's, in court how would you defend Oswald?
« Reply #441 on: August 11, 2019, 10:15:19 PM »
Question: Was a group of un-packaged curtain rods found in the TSBD? How about a rifle, still broken-down or ... otherwise?

Not that there’s any record of.

Quote
Question: Was a homemade paper bag that could have contained either of those things found in the sixth floor "sniper's nest" after the assassination?

A bag or wrapper of some kind was found somewhere. Where it was found and when is a matter of debate. But Frazier was quite clear that it wasn’t the same bag he saw.

Quote
Question:  Does the fact that neither did Frazier see (from some distance away and from behind) a longish package in one of Oswald's hands when he (Oswald) entered the building, nor did Jack "I Got A Real Sketchy Memory When I'm Nervous" Dougherty remember seeing Oswald with a package, somehow prove (to your satisfaction, anyway) that Oswald did not enter the building with said package --

Do you have any evidence whatsoever that Oswald entered the building with a package?

Offline John Iacoletti

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10866
Re: CT's, in court how would you defend Oswald?
« Reply #442 on: August 11, 2019, 10:19:31 PM »
In short, I find Iacoletti impossible to debate on a common "horse sense," shared-understanding-of-the-common-meanings-and-significations-of-words-and-phrases level.

You misspelled horsesh*t.

Quote
He seems to be on an "Exoneration Of Oswald At All Costs" mission, and therefore seems to be more than willing to ignore the common meanings of words and phrases used by certain witnesses in their testimonies and FBI statements when he shortsightedly THINKS it suits his purpose to do so.

I have no need or desire to exonerate anyone. On the other hand, you seem determined to convict Oswald — even if you have to make up evidence to do so.

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: CT's, in court how would you defend Oswald?
« Reply #442 on: August 11, 2019, 10:19:31 PM »


Offline Bill Chapman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6506
Re: CT's, in court how would you defend Oswald?
« Reply #443 on: August 11, 2019, 10:35:49 PM »
No, he was watching them switch the train cars.

Did Frazier say he didn't look at Oswald again until he arrived at the door?
No, he watched Oswald enough to realize that he was getting further and further away.

And watching the trains doesn't rule out a Frazier head-angle that could be at a shallow angle off-plumb, with Oswald well-within his peripheral vision. The corner of his eye, and all that.

Someone intent on ditching that package is hardly going to do it in front of a person walking only 50' (at best) behind him.


« Last Edit: August 11, 2019, 10:37:10 PM by Bill Chapman »

Offline Thomas Graves

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2692
Re: CT's, in court how would you defend Oswald?
« Reply #444 on: August 11, 2019, 11:23:43 PM »
Did Frazier say he didn't look at Oswald again until he arrived at the door?
No, he watched Oswald enough to realize that he was getting further and further away.

And watching the trains doesn't rule out a Frazier head-angle that could be at a shallow angle off-plumb, with Oswald well-within his peripheral vision. The corner of his eye, and all that.

Someone intent on ditching that package is hardly going to do it in front of a person walking only 50' (at best) behind him.

I don't know, Bill.

Maybe all Buell Wesley Frazier could see was "blobs," and he only thought Oswald had carried a package of curtain rods into the TSBD that morning.

He probably made it all up! 

Yep, just another example of his hundreds and hundreds of fabrications and l-i-e-s, the untruths-telling son of a gun!

-- MWT  ;)
« Last Edit: August 12, 2019, 12:09:17 AM by Thomas Graves »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: CT's, in court how would you defend Oswald?
« Reply #444 on: August 11, 2019, 11:23:43 PM »


Offline John Iacoletti

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10866
Re: CT's, in court how would you defend Oswald?
« Reply #445 on: August 12, 2019, 12:23:03 AM »
;D

Mr. BALL. What did you tell him?
Mr. FRITZ. I told him he had a package and put it in the back seat and it was a package about that long and it was curtain rods. He said he didn't have any kind of a package but his lunch. He said he had his lunch and that is all he had, and Mr. Frazier told me that he got out of the car with that package, he saw him go toward the building with this long package.
I asked him, I said, "Did you go toward the building carrying a long package?"
He said, "No. I didn't carry anything but my lunch."

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/fritz1.htm

JohnM

Yeah, we're supposed to trust Fritz's word-for-word recollection of conversations when Ball kept having him refer to his report when it conflicted with his testimony.

Offline John Iacoletti

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10866
Re: CT's, in court how would you defend Oswald?
« Reply #446 on: August 12, 2019, 12:23:38 AM »
Please don't breed

Another brilliant evidence-based rebuttal from Chapman.

Offline John Iacoletti

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10866
Re: CT's, in court how would you defend Oswald?
« Reply #447 on: August 12, 2019, 12:32:57 AM »
No one saw anyone bring a rifle into the TSBD.  Yet it was there.  So we know that someone did.  Oswald was in the process of committing a crime.  He took measures to avoid being seen carrying a rifle into the building.  Like wrapping it up in a paper bag and then hiding it.  You appear to be suggesting that unless a witness had x-ray vision then it can't be proven that Oswald carried the rifle.

I know you don't like it, "Richard", but that's the nature of what it means to prove something.  If you have no evidence whatsoever that Oswald carried a rifle into the building (and you don't), then you don't get to claim that you've proven it.

Quote
Absurd. How do we know it was him?  He carried a long package into work that morning then lied about it.

Misinformation, no matter how confidently stated is misinformation.  The only way you can claim that he lied about it is by assuming that your conclusion is true.

Quote
  A long bag was found next to the SN with his prints.

You don't know where it was found.  The cops didn't even agree where it was found.  There's also no evidence that a rifle was ever in that bag or that it was the bag that Frazier saw.  Frazier said it was not.

Quote
The rifle found in the building had the same serial number as the one ordered under an alias that Oswald used.

You have no evidence of Oswald ever using that name as an alias for himself.

Quote
  It was sent to his PO Box.

You have no evidence of such a rifle ever going through the postal service, being delivered to that PO box, or being picked up by Oswald or anyone else.

Quote
  His prints were on that rifle.

No, some prints were found by the trigger guard that were useless for identification purposes, and a single partial palmprint showed up a week later on an index card.

Quote
  It can't be linked to any other person.

or to Oswald.

Quote
  He is pictured holding it.

No, he's pictured holding a rifle that may or may not be the same one.

Quote
  His wife confirms he owned a rifle and that it was stored in the Paine's garage.

No, she confirmed that she peeked in the end of a rolled up and tied blanket 6 weeks earlier and saw part of a wooden stock that she took to be a rifle.

Quote
  There is no accounting for that rifle except as the one found in the TSBD.

There is no accounting that the rifle allegedly found in the TSBD was the same thing Marina saw.

Quote
  It is a slam dunk.

Only to somebody who misrepresents the evidence.

Quote
Difficult to understand how there could possibly be anymore evidence than exists to link Oswald to the rifle.

Difficult to understand why you keep trotting out conclusions that aren't supported by the actual evidence and calling them evidence.

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: CT's, in court how would you defend Oswald?
« Reply #447 on: August 12, 2019, 12:32:57 AM »