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Author Topic: First shot reactions  (Read 50654 times)

Offline Peter Kleinschmidt

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Re: First shot reactions
« Reply #48 on: July 28, 2019, 09:33:03 AM »
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The crowd is focused on the President and motorcade. Very few of them recognized the first shot as a rifle shot. Even JFK quickly recovered from the noise (after a brief look towards Jackie) and then returned looking to his right and began waving to the crowd again. Look closely at his facial expressions on the Zapruder clip as he turns back to his right. His look of concern quickly returns to a smile as he re-engages with the crowd.

The first shot missed. So I agree with your assessment of the second photo.
Exactly, the crowd is focused on the motorcade but that does not make them immune to gunfire. When the first shot is a miss is it only louder inside an open-top car or from where it originated

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Re: First shot reactions
« Reply #48 on: July 28, 2019, 09:33:03 AM »


Online Charles Collins

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Re: First shot reactions
« Reply #49 on: July 28, 2019, 05:34:15 PM »


No reason to believe he's not smiling here. The glare spot begins to obscure his face as the Z240s increase.


Left: raw frames; Right: deblurred (TinyPic to close 2019)
 
It seems to me he's smiling before his head gets to the right. The change in shadow makes it seem he begins to break out in smile.

The reasons that make me believe that he isn’t smiling are:

The fact that JBC and Jackie both have expressions of concern.

JFK, JBC, Jackie, Nellie, and two SS agents are looking around as if they just heard the first shot and are wondering what it was.

JFK nods his head in apparent acknowledgment of the people on his right, who are likely making a lot of noise trying to get his attention. Then he apparently breaks into a smile as if he is returning his attention to the admiring crowd.

People have been interpreting the Zapruder for over 55-years. If you believe the shadows are making it only appear that he is breaking into a smile, that is okay with me. I just don’t agree.

Online Charles Collins

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Re: First shot reactions
« Reply #50 on: July 28, 2019, 06:07:26 PM »
Exactly, the crowd is focused on the motorcade but that does not make them immune to gunfire. When the first shot is a miss is it only louder inside an open-top car or from where it originated

When trying to stress a important point, a speaker might ask: “Did you hear what I just said”? This would be an attempt to make sure the audience is paying attention to his words.

The bystanders had their attention focused on the motorcade. The limousine occupants had their attention focused on the crowd. However, the limousine occupants had been traveling through the crowds for a while. And the bystanders only had a few moments to see the President before he would pass by and be gone. Therefore, due to these probable differences in intensity of focus, it seems to me that the limousine occupants might  be more aware of other things going on around them than the bystanders would be.

 Rosemary Willis appears to have reacted to the sound of the first shot as she can be seen jerking her head around to look back towards the TSBD just after Z133. So she is apparently more aware of her surroundings. However, she has been running along side the limousine since it turned onto Houston Street. And she has had to watch where she was going in order to not run into anything.

As far as your question goes, I saw a paratrooper describing what it was like while descending towards the ground where the enemy was shooting rifles at him. He said he could tell when he was the target by the distinctive crack sound of the rifle. I have been told that this is the sonic boom of the bullet. And it apparently is most noticeable when the bullet passes close by. So perhaps the limousine occupants did hear something that the bystanders didn’t.

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Re: First shot reactions
« Reply #50 on: July 28, 2019, 06:07:26 PM »


Offline Thomas Graves

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Re: First shot reactions
« Reply #51 on: July 28, 2019, 07:15:24 PM »
When trying to stress a important point, a speaker might ask: “Did you hear what I just said”? This would be an attempt to make sure the audience is paying attention to his words.

The bystanders had their attention focused on the motorcade. The limousine occupants had their attention focused on the crowd. However, the limousine occupants had been traveling through the crowds for a while. And the bystanders only had a few moments to see the President before he would pass by and be gone. Therefore, due to these probable differences in intensity of focus, it seems to me that the limousine occupants might  be more aware of other things going on around them than the bystanders would be.

 Rosemary Willis appears to have reacted to the sound of the first shot as she can be seen jerking her head around to look back towards the TSBD just after Z133. So she is apparently more aware of her surroundings. However, she has been running along side the limousine since it turned onto Houston Street. And she has had to watch where she was going in order to not run into anything.

As far as your question goes, I saw a paratrooper describing what it was like while descending towards the ground where the enemy was shooting rifles at him. He said he could tell when he was the target by the distinctive crack sound of the rifle. I have been told that this is the sonic boom of the bullet. And it apparently is most noticeable when the bullet passes close by. So perhaps the limousine occupants did hear something that the bystanders didn’t.

Charles,

Isn't it possible that Rosemary "pulled up" because her father yelled, "Stop, Rosemary!," or some-such thing?

-- MWT  ;)
« Last Edit: July 28, 2019, 07:16:36 PM by Thomas Graves »

Online Charles Collins

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Re: First shot reactions
« Reply #52 on: July 28, 2019, 07:49:03 PM »
Charles,

Isn't it possible that Rosemary "pulled up" because her father yelled, "Stop, Rosemary!," or some-such thing?

-- MWT  ;)

Not unless he had “eyes in the back of his head” (like my mother did ;) ).

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Re: First shot reactions
« Reply #52 on: July 28, 2019, 07:49:03 PM »


Offline Thomas Graves

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Re: First shot reactions
« Reply #53 on: July 28, 2019, 08:12:41 PM »
Not unless he had “eyes in the back of his head” (like my mother did ;) ).

I rest my case.

(LOL)

Offline Jerry Organ

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Re: First shot reactions
« Reply #54 on: July 28, 2019, 10:38:02 PM »
The reasons that make me believe that he isn’t smiling are:

The fact that JBC and Jackie both have expressions of concern.

By virtue of what others are doing means JFK did the same? Even if Jackie's change in expression between Willis 04 and Croft was one of concern, she could be worried some people in the street are about to be mowed down by Martin's motorcycle.



In any case, there is no clear indication that Jackie's expression does change between Willis 04 and Croft.


Jim Towner Slide
 

Willis 04 Slide (Z157)
 

Robert Croft Slide (Z202)

We can compare the Jim Towner and Croft slides because they of comparable quality and focus:



There is a slight change but Jackie is still smiling. And I would say no look of concern. She might have been smiling a little more in the Towner slide because Tina Towner was filming her.

Governor Connally doesn't appear to have smiled since Main and Houston. He's probably feeling the effects of 30-minutes in that jump seat.

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JFK, JBC, Jackie, Nellie, and two SS agents are looking around as if they just heard the first shot and are wondering what it was.

There was also a crowd of people to their left who were hoping to make contact as the limousine straightened up. They were possibly waving and shouting as it was their turn to be seen by the Kennedys. In the early Z-140s, Nellie makes a small turn to look forward. Not a big deal.

Which SS agents are turning? Myers and Vaughan address the turns of Ready, Bennett and Hickey here. Kellerman straightens his head up in the late-Z140s, where it remains, slightly looking towards his right, as they approach the sign.

Quote
JFK nods his head in apparent acknowledgment of the people on his right, who are likely making a lot of noise trying to get his attention. Then he apparently breaks into a smile as if he is returning his attention to the admiring crowd.

   

Here are the three clearest frames before the "break out in a smile" frame of Z167 (the hand-lifting begins Z170). No rationale have been given for the claim that Kennedy has a "look of concern" or even that he's not smiling in those frames.

Quote
People have been interpreting the Zapruder for over 55-years. If you believe the shadows are making it only appear that he is breaking into a smile, that is okay with me. I just don’t agree.

Mockery. I see. Kennedy is already smiling before he turns his head rightward to the crowd (and maybe smiling while he was looking leftward). The change in shadow on his face as his head got to its position in Z167 made it seem he broke out in a smile that moment.

Offline Louis Earl

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Re: First shot reactions
« Reply #55 on: July 29, 2019, 01:57:24 AM »
Can someone help me out with a fundamental question.  A substantial majority of critics and WC supporters appear to agree that the first shot missed.  I can understand that the earlier that shot occurred, the longer a SN shooter had to fire 2 more shots till 313.  Other than that, what is the significance of the timing of the first shot.

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Re: First shot reactions
« Reply #55 on: July 29, 2019, 01:57:24 AM »