First shot reactions

[Royell Storing]

Silly me. Misunderstanding all these coded "inferences." Reminds me of the man in the White House.

You wrote:

    "So - without moving the men - let's see the views from above and
     from the side so we can check the angles.  There is no way that the
     line you have drawn goes from right to left at about 9 degrees and
     intersects JBC's right armpit."

No point in me posting any overhead view until this is sorted. Where are you getting 9 degrees?



The HSCA for Z190 has a right-to-left trajectory of about 13 degrees; it doesn't back-project to the SN but nearly so. I'm modelling Z193 because it's the clearest Z-frame in that area. You're modelling, I guess, Z195.

More of that coded insult stuff.



I don't see how our lines are that different. Similar line-of-sights and the trajectory similarly goes right-to-left and downward.

I have not seen such a file. Only frame-grabs posted here. Don't bother sending the file because I won't open it.

Not so much reluctant as I need to do more work for an overhead view. Some limousine details, Connally's torso twist and maybe Kennedy's shoulder line raised. The limo details are essentially done but the rest is major. On my system, it takes about a minute for each move, rotate or scale. I had enough in place a while ago for Zapruder line-of-sight views.

There are other 3D items I work on as well, such as the Holland Theory, the Sniper's Nest precision build, Kennedy head/torso with bone structure, BYP recreation, Z171 recreation, Hickey's semi-standing position and so-on.

      STOP with the "coded"  .  It makes you sound Batty and we know that is not the case.   

[Bill Chapman]

You should not cry about the bullet when the chain of possession consisted of 7 people - of which the first 3 people could not identify it, the 4th was never asked, and the 5th person could not identify it. But you cry that is a fact

Define 'pristine'

[Ray Mitcham]

Define 'pristine'

Let's see your chain of possession.

[Royell Storing]

Thanks. Another brilliant contribution. We couldn't keep this topic going without you.

    And that would be "code" for what?

[John Iacoletti]

What's the point of modeling Z-193 or Z-195 unless you think that's when the magic bullet transited?

[Andrew Mason]

You wrote:

    "So - without moving the men - let's see the views from above and
     from the side so we can check the angles.  There is no way that the
     line you have drawn goes from right to left at about 9 degrees and
     intersects JBC's right armpit."

No point in me posting any overhead view until this is sorted. Where are you getting 9 degrees?

We have had this discussion before. We are measuring the horizontal angle that a line from the SN through JFK's neck makes to the car direction. The horizontal angle  at z195 is 13 degrees to the car direction, which is what I was using.  The horizontal angle at z225 is between 9 and 10 degrees.  I was assuming you were using a shot at z225.

The HSCA for Z190 has a right-to-left trajectory of about 13 degrees; it doesn't back-project to the SN but nearly so. I'm modelling Z193 because it's the clearest Z-frame in that area. You're modelling, I guess, Z195.

I don't see how our lines are that different. Similar line-of-sights and the trajectory similarly goes right-to-left and downward.

Not so much reluctant as I need to do more work for an overhead view. Some limousine details, Connally's torso twist and maybe Kennedy's shoulder line raised. The limo details are essentially done but the rest is major. On my system, it takes about a minute for each move, rotate or scale. I had enough in place a while ago for Zapruder line-of-sight views.

There are other 3D items I work on as well, such as the Holland Theory, the Sniper's Nest precision build, Kennedy head/torso with bone structure, BYP recreation, Z171 recreation, Hickey's semi-standing position and so-on.

What you need to do is show us where you have placed JBC in a view from above.  Then, with the men in that same position we need to see a view as seen from Zapruder's position.  The trajectory of the shot has to go from the SN to JFK's back, out of his throat to nick the left side of his tie knot and strike JBC in the right armpit.  I have tried it at z195 and it can't be done.  I have tried it at z225 and it can't be done. But maybe I have made an error of some kind.   So I am curious as to how you have done it.

[Peter Kleinschmidt]

Define 'pristine'

The meaning is not needed the bullet never came in contact with Kennedy or Connelly Not my fault the bullets and yes the casings too also had a chain of possession issue. You now have nothing to argue about, what will you do with all of your extra time. Study Vince Foster's death?

[Michael Walton]

The common misconception of what you see in the Z film is shots were fired there. They were not. Kennedy is simply fluffing his hair, looking around, bringing his arm down and then getting ready to wave to the women to the right of him because they yelled out.

Go to film and photos of the parade and you see this movement of him throughout. I could post here a hair fluffing photo, a sequence where he does the same, he's waving then leaning on the car, and so on. But I won't - look it up. It's not hard to find.

We have to give the conspirators a little bit of credit. They knew the oak tree was in the line of fire early on Elm. They knew that if they started firing away too early, it would have blown everything. The kill zone is pretty much exactly where you see it in the Z film - right as he reappears from the sign. This video goes into detail about it.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B7Hr9Lrku-Cxa3NqTEpScWNQZnc

I simply have never understood why people think there's shots fired earlier, sparks flying from the curb and other nonsense. It's pretty straightforward - the vast majority of ear witnesses said they heard 2 close together shots and then the head shot. The Z film backs this up.

'Night John Boy. 'Night Mary Ellen.