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Author Topic: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley  (Read 20745 times)

Offline Michael Carney

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #32 on: August 31, 2019, 02:54:24 PM »
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 A jacketed bullet is not designed to disintegrate upon impact. The purpose of the jacket is to keep it together and hopefully go though more than one soldier in combat. I have personally fired jacketed bullets at 2x6 piece of wood and it went straight through and went through another 2x6 a short distance beyond sideways, you could see the profile of the bullet in the second 2x6 and again straight through. So the jacketed bullet does not disintegrate, at best it will break up into sizable pieces and they would have found them during the autopsy. What they found were very small particles representative of an AR15 round, not a 6.5mm carcano round. You also saw in the “smoking gun” video that the secret service directed a “technician” to tape fragment’s of a jacketed bullet to the x-rays trying to make it look like JFK was shot with a jacketed bullet.
The frangible round that came out of the AR15 is designed to disintegrate and usually explodes after penetration. If a bullet were designed to disintegrate on impact than theoretically all you would get is a skin abrasion, there would be no penetration of the skull. 
There have been others that have used computer analysis to show that the single bullet theory is possible
Your link only showed a cover page, no ballistics information

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #32 on: August 31, 2019, 02:54:24 PM »


Offline Michael Carney

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #33 on: August 31, 2019, 03:15:24 PM »
What do you think Hickey is going to say, of course he is going to deny holding the gun when the fatal shot was fired. 
The photo Willis 05 shows Hickey sitting and we can’t see if he is holding a gun or not. But this is 6 seconds before the head shot. Try this when you are sitting down in a chair, quickly reach down to the ground like you are grabbing something and then stand up quickly. I timed myself at 2 seconds. It takes a fraction of a second to squeeze off a round. All of that can easily be achieved in the amount of time between the second and the third shot.
Sorry, I am not buying the exhaust fumes. Not one witness said they smelled exhaust fumes, they said gunpowder. Where are the witnesses that smelled exhaust fumes?
The trajectory is not more consistent with the 6th floor of the TSBD which was something like 15 degrees whereas the head shot was more like 7 degrees. Consistent with it being fired from the car behind.
“Deductive logic ought to work with the evidence”. What evidence? You have not one witness saying they smelled exhaust fumes, they smelled gunpowder. You have an entry angle of 7 degrees, you have witnesses saying an agent was holding a rifle. I’m sorry you are not showing any “evidence” to the contrary.


Offline Michael Carney

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #34 on: August 31, 2019, 05:36:36 PM »
 I can’t make out anything in the Bronson video, it’s too blurry.
I know they didn’t have catalytic converters back then but not one witness said exhaust fumes, they all said gunpowder. It certainly could have been a mix of both gunpowder and exhaust fumes. But again, they said gunpowder.
“Wouldn't agent William McIntyre (above, right) see some of Hickey's motions in dropping to the floor and popping back up with a long rifle in his hands in the 2.3 sec before the Altgens photo or the 3.2 sec after?”
After the second shot he was looking at JFK, not Hickey. The time between the second shot and the third shot could easily be 6 secs, more than enough time for Hickey to reach down, grab the AR15, and standup.
One other thing about the angle, not only was the angle not steep enough for the 6th floor of the TSBD. It is also coming from the wrong horizontal angle coming from behind left of JFK.
The only shots fired from the TSBD were from the carcano rifle, where did the 5.56mm bullet come from? Coroner measured the diameter of the hole in that back of JFK’s at 6 mm, carcano bullet diameter is 6.5 mm.

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #34 on: August 31, 2019, 05:36:36 PM »


Offline Michael Carney

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #35 on: August 31, 2019, 06:56:18 PM »
Shot into the pavement, sure it will disintegrate then, but not shooting at a skull. At best it would break up but no fragments of a jacketed bullet were found during the autopsy, only small particles that a frangible round makes.
So the head shot was from a frangible round, not a jacketed round.  The entry hole goes along with this “theory”. The angle of entry says not from the TSBD.
The MFF site displays alright, but they want $35 to join.    

Offline Bill Chapman

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #36 on: August 31, 2019, 10:00:43 PM »
AR-15 muzzle blast produces db167
Science says db167 can produce considerable ear damage
Did witnesses in QM hear the AR-15 firing?

The guys right beside Hickey, for instance

« Last Edit: August 31, 2019, 10:15:44 PM by Bill Chapman »

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #36 on: August 31, 2019, 10:00:43 PM »


Offline Bill Chapman

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #37 on: August 31, 2019, 10:39:46 PM »
A jacketed bullet is not designed to disintegrate upon impact. The purpose of the jacket is to keep it together and hopefully go though more than one soldier in combat. I have personally fired jacketed bullets at 2x6 piece of wood and it went straight through and went through another 2x6 a short distance beyond sideways, you could see the profile of the bullet in the second 2x6 and again straight through. So the jacketed bullet does not disintegrate, at best it will break up into sizable pieces and they would have found them during the autopsy. What they found were very small particles representative of an AR15 round, not a 6.5mm carcano round. You also saw in the “smoking gun” video that the secret service directed a “technician” to tape fragment’s of a jacketed bullet to the x-rays trying to make it look like JFK was shot with a jacketed bullet.
The frangible round that came out of the AR15 is designed to disintegrate and usually explodes after penetration. If a bullet were designed to disintegrate on impact than theoretically all you would get is a skin abrasion, there would be no penetration of the skull. 
There have been others that have used computer analysis to show that the single bullet theory is possible
Your link only showed a cover page, no ballistics information

... hopefully go though more than one soldier in combat
>>> That's not the primary reason

Offline Michael Carney

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #38 on: August 31, 2019, 11:18:09 PM »
“At a minimum, it shows the two people on the back seat are not standing nor holding the sizable AR-15. Certainly no one has their butt above the fold-down top.”
Looks to me like they are not sitting in seats, but sitting on the backrests of the seats. And I can’t see if Hickey is holding anything or not.
“They heard the gunshot reports. Just before or after the head shot, a siren came on so they would have been less likely to hear the sound of the acceleration of the two heavy stretch-limos. How much gunpowder smell does one little AR-15 round produce to fill up Elm Street?”
I am not sure if one shot would fill up Elm Street or not, I don’t know how it disperses. So it’s likely it mixed with exhaust fumes. But I can’t ever remember car exhaust smelling like gunpowder.
“Depends on whether one trusts Donahue's placement of Kennedy's head.”
I haven’t seen anyone shoot it down and he was an expert witness so I am sure he would know what he it talking about. I think it was Donahue that said the holes in the skull are always larger than the bullet.
Another thought I had is an M16 would not be a snipers choice. They are bush guns, with short barrels and not likely in wide distribution back in those days. First time I saw an M16 was in the Army in the spring of 66 and at that time the Army was using the M14 in Viet Nam. So I can’t imagine a civilian would have one in 63.

Offline Michael Carney

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #39 on: September 01, 2019, 02:23:31 AM »
Right, that's the purpose of a full metal jacket round.

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #39 on: September 01, 2019, 02:23:31 AM »