JFK from Air Force 1 to Bethesda by helicopter

[Mike Orr]

You Tube ------------ JFK - The Medical Cover Up

14:45 of the video : Behn & Kellerman ! The whole video is 1:16:29 There is actual audio  : Jerry Behn is at the White House situation room and he is talking to Roy Kellerman who is on Air Force 1 . This whole video is very good and has a ton of information . Douglas Horne is very thorough during this video . It's one of the most informative videos that I have ever watched .

Air Force 1 Andrews , Roger. Go ahead with you traffic now , sir.

Kellerman : Digest to Duplex , how's this ?

Behn : Go ahead , Digest - this is Duplex

Kellerman : Again I repeat...

Kellerman : 3 helicopters to transport people to the White House lawn. okay ?

Behn : that is affirmative

Kellerman : Roger , okay...

Kellerman : White House 102 and 405X , transportation to the Navy Hospital , okay ?

Behn : That is affirmative

Kellerman : That's a Roger , uh...

Kellerman : I am keeping , uh... I will join the General and his party at the Navy Hospital , okay ?

Behn : Digest , this is Duplex - You accompany the " BODY " aboard the " HELICOPTER ".

Kellerman : Roger

[Mike Orr]

Warren Commission testimony of Clint Hill .

Mr. Specter : What did you observe as to President Kennedy's condition on arrival at the hospital ( Parkland ) ?

Mr. Hill : The right rear portion of his head was missing . It was lying in the rear seat of the car . His brain was exposed . There was blood and bits of brain all over the entire rear portion of the car .


I always wondered why there was such a rush to bury JFK and we really don't know if JFK is buried at Arlington or at sea where supposedly a casket with weight and holes in the casket so it would sink and not ever come up ! JFK killed on Friday the 22nd and buried on Monday the 25th of Nov. ! J.D. Tippit killed on Friday the 22nd of Nov. and buried on Monday the 25th of Nov. ! Lee Harvey Oswald killed by Jack Ruby on Sunday the 24th of Nov. and was buried on Monday the 25th of Nov. !

[Gary Craig]

From a CD of the White House Audio Tapes of Air Force One

MEMORANDUM

October 17, 1995

To: Jeremy Gunn

From: Doug Horne

Subject: Air Force One Audiotapes from November 22, 1963

1. "As directed, Joan Zimmerman and I visited Archives II to listen to audio recordings
of the November 22, 1963 Air Force One tapes."

-snip-

4. "Joan Zimmerman and I took voluminous notes, noting the many occasions when
spoken word on the tapes is not accounted for on the LBJ transcript. We also took notes
in an attempt to expand on areas of the "transcript" which are only summations of
conversations (vice verbatim accounts), and attempted to correct occasional inaccuracies
found in the LBJ "transcript."

-snip-

B. "Onboard Air Force One on the return flight to Washington, Secret Service Agent
Kellerman, and later General Ted Clifton (Military Aide to the President) make it clear
that their desire is for an ambulance and limousine to take President Kennedy's body to
Walter Reed General Hospital for autopsy"..under guard...," as specified by General
Clifton. Gerald Behn, Head of the White House Secret Service Detail, counters that a
Helicoptor has been arranged to take the President's body to the National Naval Medical
Center at Bethesda for autopsy, and all other personnel will be choppered to the
South Grounds of the White House. Ultimately, the President's physician, Admiral
George Burley (on Air Force One), sides with Gerald Behn (at the White House) in
support of a Bethesda autopsy and persuades the Surgeon General of the Army,
Gneral Heaton (in Washington) to cancel arrangements for a Walter Reed autopsy."

"Once it becomes clear that Bethesda is to be the site, two things happen:

First, both Admiral Burkley and General Clifton insist that the President's body be transported to
Bethesda by ambulance(vice helicoptor), even though Gerald Behn at the White House
informs General Clifton that President Kennedy's Naval Aide, CAPT Shepard, has
assured him that it will be no problem for the helicoptor to carry the heavy casket;

second, even though Admiral Burkley and General Clifton insist on ambulance
transport of JFK's body to Bethesda, Gerald Behn at the White House subsequently
orders Roy Kellerman: "You accompany the body aboard the helicopter,"

-snip-

(2) "An Air Force document titled: "Historical Highlights of Andrews Air Force Base, 1942-1989" states
that "...the body of the slain President was removed to Walter Reed General
Hospital...," which further fuels the controversy over the movements of the President's
body after Air Force One landed at Andrews."

-snip-

-----------------------

http://www.whitehousetapes.net

Presidential Recordings Program, Miller Center of Public Affairs,
University of Virginia

"The full text of the entire volume of annotated transcripts of the LBJ recordings from November 22 to November 30, 1962,
is available here. It includes the complete set of Air Force One calls enroute from Dallas to Washington. The volume was
edited by former Miller Center scholar Max Holland."

-----------------------

[Mike Orr]

Who moved JFK from his casket on AF 1 and who made the initial call to have JFK moved by helicopter to Bethesda ?

[Mike Orr]

 Chain of Possession was over at so many points of the JFK Assassination !

[Michael Walton]

This is another one of those ridiculous theories about the JFK case, this time cooked up by Dave Lifton, which made him a good amount of money. Lifton was hot back in the 80's when his book BEST EVIDENCE was on book shelves and libraries. He also appeared in the PBS documentary about the case.

The story goes like this:

After the body was placed in a casket at Parkland and put into the hearse, the caravan leaves for Love Field. According to this kooky theory, somehow and in some way, the casket, after being placed on the plane, is opened. The body is thrown down into the cargo hold. This is done while Kennedy's Irish Mafia and Jackie are standing guard by the coffin throughout the entire procession from the hospital to its arrival at Andrews.

From there, on live TV, the coffin you see on the live TV footage is supposedly empty while Kennedy's body is snuck out the back way of the airplane, thrown onto a helicopter and whisked off to Bethesda. This supposedly allows doctors to perform all manner of body alterations to the body to cover up the evidence of multiple shooters before the official autopsy was to begin.

Yeah, right. To wit:

Do you really think that someone, anyone, would have been allowed to open up the casket in full view of a tight and crowded airplane to throw the body down into the cargo hold in full view of the widow, Kennedy's staff and cronies?

Do you really think that anyone at all would not have noticed on the other side of the plane the body being removed and thrown on to a helicopter, in full view of a mass of people at Andrews along with TV cameras and lights?

The murder was mere hours old by the time of the Andrews arrival. How in the world would the doctors have known what to cover up on Kennedy's body when they didn't even know what happened in Dallas?

I debated this endlessly with old Dave Lifton over on another forum. Here's a highlight of it - http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/23250-david-lifton-teases-final-charade-on-the-night-fright-show/page/28/?tab=comments#comment-371553

If you want to look elsewhere over there, use the keyword "scalpels" and you'll find more. Because that's what I called old Dave's theory - the Thrumming Copter and Mad Doctors with Scalpels at the Ready theory. His theory holds about as much water as the ridiculous Lee Oswald clone one.

[Gary Craig]

This is another one of those ridiculous theories about the JFK case, this time cooked up by Dave Lifton, which made him a good amount of money. Lifton was hot back in the 80's when his book BEST EVIDENCE was on book shelves and libraries. He also appeared in the PBS documentary about the case.

The story goes like this:

After the body was placed in a casket at Parkland and put into the hearse, the caravan leaves for Love Field. According to this kooky theory, somehow and in some way, the casket, after being placed on the plane, is opened. The body is thrown down into the cargo hold. This is done while Kennedy's Irish Mafia and Jackie are standing guard by the coffin throughout the entire procession from the hospital to its arrival at Andrews.

From there, on live TV, the coffin you see on the live TV footage is supposedly empty while Kennedy's body is snuck out the back way of the airplane, thrown onto a helicopter and whisked off to Bethesda. This supposedly allows doctors to perform all manner of body alterations to the body to cover up the evidence of multiple shooters before the official autopsy was to begin.

Yeah, right. To wit:

Do you really think that someone, anyone, would have been allowed to open up the casket in full view of a tight and crowded airplane to throw the body down into the cargo hold in full view of the widow, Kennedy's staff and cronies?

Do you really think that anyone at all would not have noticed on the other side of the plane the body being removed and thrown on to a helicopter, in full view of a mass of people at Andrews along with TV cameras and lights?

The murder was mere hours old by the time of the Andrews arrival. How in the world would the doctors have known what to cover up on Kennedy's body when they didn't even know what happened in Dallas?

I debated this endlessly with old Dave Lifton over on another forum. Here's a highlight of it - http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/23250-david-lifton-teases-final-charade-on-the-night-fright-show/page/28/?tab=comments#comment-371553

If you want to look elsewhere over there, use the keyword "scalpels" and you'll find more. Because that's what I called old Dave's theory - the Thrumming Copter and Mad Doctors with Scalpels at the Ready theory. His theory holds about as much water as the ridiculous Lee Oswald clone one.

 "This is done while Kennedy's Irish Mafia and Jackie are standing guard by the coffin throughout the entire procession from the hospital to its arrival at Andrews."

That is not entirely true.

If I remember correctly, LBJ demanded Jackie and most everybody else on the plane be present when he took the oath of office.

[Martin Weidmann]

This is another one of those ridiculous theories about the JFK case, this time cooked up by Dave Lifton, which made him a good amount of money. Lifton was hot back in the 80's when his book BEST EVIDENCE was on book shelves and libraries. He also appeared in the PBS documentary about the case.

The story goes like this:

After the body was placed in a casket at Parkland and put into the hearse, the caravan leaves for Love Field. According to this kooky theory, somehow and in some way, the casket, after being placed on the plane, is opened. The body is thrown down into the cargo hold. This is done while Kennedy's Irish Mafia and Jackie are standing guard by the coffin throughout the entire procession from the hospital to its arrival at Andrews.

From there, on live TV, the coffin you see on the live TV footage is supposedly empty while Kennedy's body is snuck out the back way of the airplane, thrown onto a helicopter and whisked off to Bethesda. This supposedly allows doctors to perform all manner of body alterations to the body to cover up the evidence of multiple shooters before the official autopsy was to begin.

Yeah, right. To wit:

Do you really think that someone, anyone, would have been allowed to open up the casket in full view of a tight and crowded airplane to throw the body down into the cargo hold in full view of the widow, Kennedy's staff and cronies?

Do you really think that anyone at all would not have noticed on the other side of the plane the body being removed and thrown on to a helicopter, in full view of a mass of people at Andrews along with TV cameras and lights?

The murder was mere hours old by the time of the Andrews arrival. How in the world would the doctors have known what to cover up on Kennedy's body when they didn't even know what happened in Dallas?

I debated this endlessly with old Dave Lifton over on another forum. Here's a highlight of it - http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/23250-david-lifton-teases-final-charade-on-the-night-fright-show/page/28/?tab=comments#comment-371553

If you want to look elsewhere over there, use the keyword "scalpels" and you'll find more. Because that's what I called old Dave's theory - the Thrumming Copter and Mad Doctors with Scalpels at the Ready theory. His theory holds about as much water as the ridiculous Lee Oswald clone one.

You can call Lifton's theory ridiculous as much as you like, but you need to do it based upon firm evidence rather than pure speculation and absurd ridicule on your part. The mere fact that you have difficulties accepting or understanding that (at least part of) it could have happened as Lifton writes in his book, does not mean it didn't happen. It just means that you are not open minded enough to look at the available evidence honestly.

Regardless of what your opinion about Lifton's theory is, the facts are still there and need to be explained. There were at least two caskets delivered to Bethesda at different times and witnessed by different people. When somebody like Paul O'Connor says he removed Kennedy's body, in a body bag, from a grey shipping casket, that other witnesses confirmed bringing into the morgue long before Jacky Kennedy's party arrived there, that's something you can not dismiss as a mistaken memory or a lie to get 15 minutes of fame. When Jerrol Custer told the ARRB that he was taking X-rays of Kennedy's body to be developed when he saw Jacky and Robert Kennedy arrive, that needs to be explained rather than dismissed out of hand.

The multiple witnesses Lifton cites in his work, be they Bethesda staff, FBI agents, members of the honor guard or assistants at the autopsy, paint a very confusing picture about what exactly went on at Bethesda, when the event of the arrival of a casket containing the body of Kennedy should basically have been a simple straight forward matter. There has to be a way to explain this, right? Even if he didn't get everything 100% right (which btw is something nobody can determine for lack of sufficient information), Lifton at least tries to make some sense of it and even if some of his conclusions seem incomprehensible or unlikely at first glance, they nevertheless are the product of logical reasoning.

There are just too many witnesses to simply ignore the story they tell, but to dismiss the theory about what happened to the body during (or perhaps prior to) transport, you need to explain all the subsequent events also. Or are you just going with "the body wasn't removed from the casket, so all the events that happened afterwards were just inventions by all those witnesses"? I hope not, because would make you look extremely foolish.

So, can you explain the obvious discrepancies between the statements of all those witnesses or do you simply call them all mistaken because what they say does not fit in the story you prefer?