If Oswald Was The Assassin, Did He Plan His Escape From The TSBD Very Well?

[Dan O'meara]

Alan, I think we are much closer in thoughts than it might appear. When I first started looking at the Chicken lunch story many years ago I had no idea where it would lead. The assembled evidence clearly failEd to support the official narrative. We have employees changing significant events over time, there can be no debate that they did, it’s in the record. The closest I can come to the lone nut version is that Williams was encouraged by Oswald to vacate the sixth floor a few minutes before the shots. If this were the case one must ask, why didn’t Williams convey to this fact to the police on the afternoon of the assassination. He knew Oswald was in custody and was questioned about him. At that point he becomes the star prosecution witness.

Hi Colin,
what is your position on Williams' involvement in the assassination (if any)?
I find it very difficult to imagine that he is not directly involved even if he does not understand the full extent of what he's actually involved in. I strongly suspect he got Norman and Jarman to cover for him, it was just an unlucky last minute decision to go up to the 5th floor.
I also believe Doughrty is 'the man with the rifle'.

[Jerry Freeman]

There was a big debate on this forum a while back about where the concession stand was located.

West side of the lobby. Besides it didn't matter....
 There was a partition doorway between the entrance doorway and the lobby as shown in the floor plan..

[Gerry Down]

There was a big debate on this forum a while back about where the concession stand was located.

Thought you meant the catering service that delivered lunches to the TSBD. This catering service is something we've heard very little (as in nothing) about. You'd wonder if that catering service was a way to get assassins in and out of the TSBD, or deliver rifles etc.

[Colin Crow]

Hi Colin,
what is your position on Williams' involvement in the assassination (if any)?
I find it very difficult to imagine that he is not directly involved even if he does not understand the full extent of what he's actually involved in. I strongly suspect he got Norman and Jarman to cover for him, it was just an unlucky last minute decision to go up to the 5th floor.
I also believe Doughrty is 'the man with the rifle'.

Dan my position is that the assembled evidence shows that the WC narrative of events immediately preceding the shooting are not supported. The lunch remnants were in the SN upon discovery and moved shortly after, prior to processing by Studebaker. The unfinished piece is suggestive that the person eating it was disturbed and did not return. Rowland's testimony indicates that and African American person was occupying the SN for a period for some minutes after 12.15, the time he observed a man with a rifle at the SW corner of the 6th floor.

Williams various statements prior to testifying "evolved" over time to the point that allowed Ball and Belin to place him 20 feet or so from their alleged assassin, oblivious to him cowering in the SN. Prior to their WC testimonies, Jarman and Norman provided statements that claimed he ascended with them on the elevator to the 5th floor. I believe that if Williams was the person Rowland observed that this "alibi" was concocted prior to Williams escort to City Hall for questioning. There was about an hour or so that this could have occurred.

I believe that the most likely scenario is one where someone (or something) convinced Williams to vacate his position. I don’t believe this to be of an overtly threatening nature but something perceived by Williams to be benign and reasonable at the time. I do not believe that this event involved Oswald.

If the man was not Williams, someone had to convince him to change his story and admit he was on the sixth floor at that time when he was not. I do not discount this as a possibility entirely but consider it less likely as it would also require Jarman and Norman to be convinced prior to their testimonies.

As for Dougherty, his actions were questioned by WC council very early on (the Eisenberg memo from memory). However, on balance I find it hard to consider him to be the shooter.  His role in the west elevator movements just prior to and after the shooting are critical for the WC narrative.

[Bill Chapman]

Thought you meant the catering service that delivered lunches to the TSBD. This catering service is something we've heard very little (as in nothing) about. You'd wonder if that catering service was a way to get assassins in and out of the TSBD, or deliver rifles etc.

One can get any number of assassins into a CT clown car.

[Colin Crow]

The following can be found in Commission Document 329 - FBI Gemberling Report of 22 Jan 1964

It appears that Williams, Jarman and Norman were interviewed on January 8 by Agents Carter and Griffin in response to the claim that Oswald had observed Jarman and another employee while eating lunch on the first floor of the TSBD.



The statements appear below....

[Dan O'meara]

It's fascinating that these ace FBI agents haven't got anything to say regarding the contradictory nature of Jarman's statement. It's January and they still haven't got their story straight!
My suspicion of Williams is based on my best reading of the various testimonies which has him up on the 6th floor a lot longer than he ever admits to. The sixth floor crew finish up around 11:45 to 11:50am, Williams washes up, collects his lunch, gets a bottle of soda and heads straight up to the sixth floor. He is probably up there about 11:55 to 12:00pm. He doesn't go down to the fifth floor until he hears Norman and Jarman there.
Norman and Jarman are outside until the motorcade has turned on to Main Street which is minutes before it arrives at Dealey Plaza. They make their way to the Houston St. dock entrance and enter the building about 12:25, maybe later (it is interesting that Oswald reports seeing them enter the building as it has him in the Domino room at this time, a time by which the motorcade should have already arrived). They make their way up to the fifth floor and begin opening windows etc. and it is around this point Williams hears them.
If Williams was asked to vacate the 6th floor there is no reason for him to abandon his lunch. I get the impression the arrival of Norman and Jarman is a surprise and it is something Williams has to deal with and that's why he abandons it. That the half eaten chicken piece is initially found on a stack of boxes that forms part of the SN shows he was in this position when he abandoned it. The sniper must have surely been in position by this time with Williams stood right by him. There are a couple of indications that Williams didn't get down to the 5th until the Presidential limo was just turning off Main to Houston. This is about 12:28 to 12:29pm.
If Williams needed to be shifted it would surely have been before this time.
The lies of Norman and Jarman can be seen in the light of covering for Williams, whether this was done through misguided friendship or threat. The first affidavit of Williams is an outright lie. He specifically removes himself from the 6th floor and would have got away with it if it hadn't have been for the abandoned lunch. Later that same day the lunch becomes a major part of the 'cold-blooded assassin' story and Williams is in deep s%&t.
He is called in the very next day to give another statement (why, if he'd already given one), this time acknowledging he was on the 6th then went down to the 5th. In his WC testimony it is this second statement that is treated as his original statement. The first outright lie statement is ignored as if it never existed.
I strongly suspect that if Norman and Jarman had not made a late decision to go up to the 5th floor to watch the motorcade, Williams would have been stood right next to the sniper as he took his shots.

[Colin Crow]

It's fascinating that these ace FBI agents haven't got anything to say regarding the contradictory nature of Jarman's statement. It's January and they still haven't got their story straight!
My suspicion of Williams is based on my best reading of the various testimonies which has him up on the 6th floor a lot longer than he ever admits to. The sixth floor crew finish up around 11:45 to 11:50am, Williams washes up, collects his lunch, gets a bottle of soda and heads straight up to the sixth floor. He is probably up there about 11:55 to 12:00pm. He doesn't go down to the fifth floor until he hears Norman and Jarman there.
Norman and Jarman are outside until the motorcade has turned on to Main Street which is minutes before it arrives at Dealey Plaza. They make their way to the Houston St. dock entrance and enter the building about 12:25, maybe later (it is interesting that Oswald reports seeing them enter the building as it has him in the Domino room at this time, a time by which the motorcade should have already arrived). They make their way up to the fifth floor and begin opening windows etc. and it is around this point Williams hears them.
If Williams was asked to vacate the 6th floor there is no reason for him to abandon his lunch. I get the impression the arrival of Norman and Jarman is a surprise and it is something Williams has to deal with and that's why he abandons it. That the half eaten chicken piece is initially found on a stack of boxes that forms part of the SN shows he was in this position when he abandoned it. The sniper must have surely been in position by this time with Williams stood right by him. There are a couple of indications that Williams didn't get down to the 5th until the Presidential limo was just turning off Main to Houston. This is about 12:28 to 12:29pm.
If Williams needed to be shifted it would surely have been before this time.
The lies of Norman and Jarman can be seen in the light of covering for Williams, whether this was done through misguided friendship or threat. The first affidavit of Williams is an outright lie. He specifically removes himself from the 6th floor and would have got away with it if it hadn't have been for the abandoned lunch. Later that same day the lunch becomes a major part of the 'cold-blooded assassin' story and Williams is in deep s%&t.
He is called in the very next day to give another statement (why, if he'd already given one), this time acknowledging he was on the 6th then went down to the 5th. In his WC testimony it is this second statement that is treated as his original statement. The first outright lie statement is ignored as if it never existed.
I strongly suspect that if Norman and Jarman had not made a late decision to go up to the 5th floor to watch the motorcade, Williams would have been stood right next to the sniper as he took his shots.

I had never looked at the January FBI investigation in this light before. All were interviewed on the same day and by the same agents. The contradictions are apparent and corroborations lacking. My understanding was that Jarman and Norman were longtime work buddies. The teenager Williams was a recent employee (September?) and not very familiar with the other two. I think he had been transferred to the main building from the other warehouse to form part of the flooring crew. Note that Jarman and Norman were not part of that team.

Some interesting parts of Williams "story" on this occasion. He ate his lunch at noon on the sixth floor and joined Jarman and Norman about 12.05pm. This time he used the west elevator. If so this would create a huge problem for the lone nut scenario. If he did use the west elevator and shut the gates, it would mean that someone moved the east elevator from the sixth floor. It was located on the fifth floor when Truly and Baker took it to the roof after the shots.

Perhaps the unfinished chicken leg in the SN is indicative of him hearing something and going to investigate and failing to return.

The "sighting" of Jarman and Norman mentioned by Oswald under investigation is indeed intriguing.