A scientific look at the Single Bullet Theory.

[Andrew Mason]

A scientific look at the Single Bullet Theory.

JohnM

How "scientific" is the statement "Zapruder film shows simultaneous reactions"?  This statement is based on an assumption that is not obvious to an unbiased observer: i.e that JFK's hand positions in z223 are not the result of a reaction to being shot through the neck prior to that point.  It is also not at all obvious that there is a clear path from JFK's neck exit wound to JBC's right armpit that misses JFK's hands, but that is a minor point.

Unbiased scientists share their data. They do not avoid showing us the data used in order to protect a copyright. Myers refuses to disclose the angles and distances (eg. what is the horizontal angle used; how far inboard JBC is and where this comes from).

How scientific is it to ignore 60+ witnesses who said the first shot struck JFK and/or that there was only one shot before the midpoint between the first and third (i.e. one shot before at least z240)?

I would submit that someone who adheres to basic principles of science would approach the problem this way:

1. what are the range of possibilities as to what the bullet through JFK hit, based on all the evidence?

2. which of those possibilities is the best fit with all the evidence.

[Bill Chapman]

How "scientific" is the statement "Zapruder film shows simultaneous reactions"?  This statement is based on an assumption that is not obvious to an unbiased observer: i.e that JFK's hand positions in z223 are not the result of a reaction to being shot through the neck prior to that point.  It is also not at all obvious that there is a clear path from JFK's neck exit wound to JBC's right armpit that misses JFK's hands, but that is a minor point.

Unbiased scientists share their data. They do not avoid showing us the data used in order to protect a copyright. Myers refuses to disclose the angles and distances (eg. what is the horizontal angle used; how far inboard JBC is and where this comes from).

How scientific is it to ignore 60+ witnesses who said the first shot struck JFK and/or that there was only one shot before the midpoint between the first and third (i.e. one shot before at least z240)?

I would submit that someone who adheres to basic principles of science would approach the problem this way:

1. what are the range of possibilities as to what the bullet through JFK hit, based on all the evidence?

2. which of those possibilities is the best fit with all the evidence.

In the Zfilm, JFK reacts just as he emerges from behind the sign. Given that it would likely take a split second* to react to the pain, it seems to me the bullet struck before he emerges from behind the sign. His hands are just starting to rise as he appears, indicating that the missile has traversed the neck before his hands rise to neck level.


* Every time I stub my toe while barefooted, It takes a two-count for the pain to be felt.

[Andrew Mason]

In the Zfilm, JFK reacts just as he emerges from behind the sign. Given that it would likely take a split second* to react to the pain, it seems to me the bullet struck before he emerges from behind the sign. His hands are just starting to rise as he appears, indicating that the missile has traversed the neck before his hands rise to neck level.


* Every time I stub my toe while barefooted, It takes a two-count for the pain to be felt.

Oh, sorry. I thought you wanted to use a science approach.

I can't tell when JFK started to react because I can't see that he is not already reacting before he emerges from behind the sign. I would need evidence that he is not already reacting. But the zfilm shows significant change in both hand positions betwen z200 and z222. There are many witnesses who observed that JFK changed his hand positions in response to the first shot. And there is quite a bit of evidence that the first shot was after z186.

I would also need evidence to show that JFK's dramatic reaction seen from z226 and following wa necessarily the immediate initial reaction. It could be a gagging reaction due the difficulty in breathing resulting from the damage to his airway. We do know that humans normally take about 12 to 20 breaths per minute so a gagging reaction could start a couple of seconds after sustaining the injury.

[Steve Barber]

 

Thanks for reinforcing the back shot as Kennedy emerges from behind the Stemmons Freeway sign!



JohnM

 

 

[Steve Barber]

If everyone could just look CLOSELY at where President Kennedy's hands go to...

 The hands are never at "neck level", they never go near the throat, and he never "clutched his throat".  Sadly, this entire idea seems to stem from no one having made blow ups of the Z frames for a cursory examination of the film to examine exactly what happened, before 1966 when John Connally examined blown up frames trying to determine when he was shot.  Life Magazine is responsible for claiming that the President "clutched his throat" in its October 1964 edition, in one of the captions for the Zapruder frames they published in that issue.

 The right hand is the first to go into position in a cupped fashion, over the mouth.  The left hand comes up, every finger except for the index finger are curled. The index finger is slightly curled but in a near straight position as the hand forms into a semi-fist and comes up against the bottom the right hand.  It looks like he could very well be dry heaving after the bullet that ripped through his back exited the throat.   As he starts to turn his head to his left, his right hand--now in a semi-cupped position-is now at cheek level as his head turns and the hand remains in the upward position.  He doesn't start to bring the left hand/arm down until after Mrs. Kennedy grasps his left arm and pulls him slightly downward and toward her.  His right hand then moves from cheek level down to chest level where it remains until the fatal shot is fired. 

[Royell Storing]

       "...ripped THROUGH his back......". This statement is Incorrect. Humes probed JFK's BACK Wound and the depth of said wound ended at the first knuckle on his finger. The location of the BACK Wound is corroborated by: (1) The JFK Autopsy Face Sheet, (2) JFK Autopsy Photo, (3) JFK Dress Shirt, & (4) JFK Suit Coat. The JFK BACK Wound had absolutely Nothing to do with the Neck Wound or the movement of his hands during the assassination. 

[Steve Barber]

       "...ripped THROUGH his back......". This statement is Incorrect. Humes probed JFK's BACK Wound and the depth of said wound ended at the first knuckle on his finger. The location of the BACK Wound is corroborated by: (1) The JFK Autopsy Face Sheet, (2) JFK Autopsy Photo, (3) JFK Dress Shirt, & (4) JFK Suit Coat. The JFK BACK Wound had absolutely Nothing to do with the Neck Wound or the movement of his hands during the assassination.

  Since that is what you believe, Storing, go for it.   I will use common sense and accept the fact that bullet that entered the back exited the throat,  based on the evidence.   You go ahead and continue to live in denial, and base your case on flimsy, conspiracy tripe.  You haven't read everything on the back wound, or you would know why the wound only went as far as the first knuckle, so I take your reasoning with the usual grain of salt.  Oh, and yes, the movement of his arms and hands DID have everything to do with the back wound.

[Andrew Mason]

If everyone could just look CLOSELY at where President Kennedy's hands go to...

 The hands are never at "neck level", they never go near the throat, and he never "clutched his throat".  Sadly, this entire idea seems to stem from no one having made blow ups of the Z frames for a cursory examination of the film to examine exactly what happened, before 1966 when John Connally examined blown up frames trying to determine when he was shot.  Life Magazine is responsible for claiming that the President "clutched his throat" in its October 1964 edition, in one of the captions for the Zapruder frames they published in that issue.

 The right hand is the first to go into position in a cupped fashion, over the mouth.  The left hand comes up, every finger except for the index finger are curled. The index finger is slightly curled but in a near straight position as the hand forms into a semi-fist and comes up against the bottom the right hand.  It looks like he could very well be dry heaving after the bullet that ripped through his back exited the throat.   As he starts to turn his head to his left, his right hand--now in a semi-cupped position-is now at cheek level as his head turns and the hand remains in the upward position.  He doesn't start to bring the left hand/arm down until after Mrs. Kennedy grasps his left arm and pulls him slightly downward and toward her.  His right hand then moves from cheek level down to chest level where it remains until the fatal shot is fired.

I don't think it matters precisely where he put his hands. What matters is why his hands moved from the position they are seen in z193 to the position they are in at z223 and why his facial expression seen when he appears from behind the Stemmons sign is so different from that in z193. Many witnesses said his facial expression changed like that and his hand positions changed like that in respon4se to the first shot.