Then went outside to watch P. parade ( Parts 1 & 2 )

[Alan Ford]

You can't honestly believe your absurd interpretation of Oswald's clear as crystal explanation? If Oswald was on the front steps, he would say he was on the front steps and especially at a time when he has the World's stage and is basically pleading for his life,

Why would he feel the need to do that?

why on Earth would he rely on the truth being discovered by a desperate Alan Ford 55 years later? Hahaha!

Btw other Depository staff all indicated that the outside steps were OUTSIDE, why would they say otherwise?

Mr. LOVELADY - That's on the second floor; so, I started going to the domino room where I generally went in to set down and eat and nobody was there and I happened to look on the outside and Mr. Shelley was standing outside with Miss Sarah Stanton, I believe her name is, and I said, "Well, I'll go out there and talk with them, sit down and eat my lunch out there, set on the steps," so I went out there.

Mr. BALL - You were standing where?
Mr. SHELLEY - Just outside the glass doors there.
Mr. BALL - That would be on the top landing of the entrance?
Mr. SHELLEY - yes.

Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; not right then I didn't. I say, you know, he was supposed to come by during our lunch hour so you don't get very many chances to see the President of the United States and being an old Texas boy, and [he] never having been down to Texas very much I went out there to see him and just like everybody else was, I was standing on the steps there and watched for the parade to come by and so I did and I stood there until he come by

Sarah Stanton who was on the steps described to the FBI that after hearing the shots "immediately went into the building".



JohnM

~Grin~

The fact that you are going to such efforts here, Mr Mytton, shows how nervous you still are about
a) Prayer Man
b) Mr Oswald's claim in custody that he "went outside to watch P. Parade".

Like I say, there is only one place (other than the roof) that is both outside and part of the building: the enclosed, roofed front steps. Which is where Prayer Man is.

As for the brief exchange with the reporter, Mr Oswald simply confirms that
i) yes, he works at the Depository
ii) yes, he was there, at his place of work, at the time.

 

[Zeon Mason]

In the confusion of the hall congestion of reporters asking questions nearly simultaneously, how probable that Oswald could have misheard the question?

IE: “Were you AT the building at the time?

Or: interpretation of “at the time” not specifically referencing to an exact moment shots were fired,  but more generally referring to the motorcade arriving at Dealey Plaza?

As to the question why Oswald is not at every opportunity vigorously stating that he was at the front entrance when shots were fired.

Um..  🤔  it’s a bit difficult...

1. Maybe Oswald did say something which did not get filmed?
2. Midnight conference, Oswald seems to be exhausted , was he drugged?
3. After hours of interrogation, without attorney present, Oswald decided not to divulge a front steps alibi until he speaks with an attorney he can trust?

[Alan Ford]

In the confusion of the hall congestion of reporters asking questions nearly simultaneously, how probable that Oswald could have misheard the question?

IE: “Were you AT the building at the time?

Or: interpretation of “at the time” not specifically referencing to an exact moment shots were fired,  but more generally referring to the motorcade arriving at Dealey Plaza?

Mr Oswald was being snippy with the reporter-------I work there, and yeah, I was there at the time of the motorcade, big deal

As to the question why Oswald is not at every opportunity vigorously stating that he was at the front entrance when shots were fired.

There's a simple explanation:
-----Mr Oswald told Captain Fritz he went outside to watch the P. Parade (front steps)
-----Captain Fritz didn't challenge him on this (he knew it was the truth), instead telling him he was suspected of having supplied the rifle
-----Mr Oswald had no idea he was being presented to the world as the actual gunman

[Rick Plant]

Evidence that points to the possibility of Stanton being on the west side of the entrance steps at some point:

1) Billy Lovelady's CE 1381:

"At the time the Presidential Motorcade passed the
Depository building heading west on Elm Street, I was standing
on the top step to the far right against the wall of the
entranceway to the Texas School Book Depository.
At this time I recall that William H Shelley, who resides at
128 South Tatum, Dallas, and Mrs Sarah Stanton, also of
Dallas, Texas, both of whom are likewise employed by the
Texas School Book Depository, were standing next to me."

As the President passes by Lovelady has himself positioned by the far west wall of the entranceway. In this clip from the Hughes footage it is possible to make out Lovelady by the far west wall as the President passes by:



Lovelady is clearly placing Stanton on the west side of the entranceway.

2) Stanton's CE 1381

"...I heard three shots after the President's car passed the front of the building but I could not see the President's car at that time."



It is clear from Altgens 6 that anyone standing on the east side of the entranceway has a clear view of the motorcade as the shots are being fired. Only someone standing closer to the west wall would not have this clear line of sight. Stanton appears to be saying it was not possible for her to see the President's car at the moment of the shots - "I could not see"

3) This interview with Frazier.

@ 51:10 in this interview:

“...a lady come by and she was crying, ‘cause she had been down by the sidewalk, somewhere down toward the triple underpass and she come by and she said, “They have shot the President”.
And so, Sarah, the lady I was standing by up on the top step back in the shadows...we looked at one another, and we really didn’t have a lot to say, we just listened to what the lady told us…”

Frazier identifies Sarah as being on the top step standing back in the shadows. People on the east side of the front steps are not standing in shadow. Only someone on the west side would be described as standing “back in the shadows.”

In this still from Darnell Frazier is clearly seen but where is Stanton?



Obviously there is Pauline Sanders statement that Stanton was on the east side of the entranceway and in other interviews Frazier seems to indicate Sarah was to his left. The common sense approach to all this evidence is that Stanton moved from the east side to the west as the motorcade approached.

That's exactly what advocates for Oswald as Prayer Man have done. There is not one scrap of evidence that places Oswald on the steps.

You sound like Alan here.
Why rule out Oswald as a potential candidate?
I don't believe Oswald took the shots but I can't say definitively where he was at that time.
It would be amazing if it were Oswald on the steps.
So why not accept it is Oswald on the steps?       

Because there is not one scrap of evidence that places him there.
The question is - How can other researchers place him there?

How do you know it's a man?

Bill Lovelady saying "next to me" does not mean the Prayer Man position. You're inventing a false claim for your phony evidence. 

It's funny how these Sarah Stanton enthusiasts always want to use other people's testimony, and then fabricate what they testified to, but always dismiss what Sarah Stanton testified to.

Sarah Stanton never placed herself in the Prayer Man position, nor did she ever mention in her FBI testimony that she spoke to Buell Frazier. In fact, she never even mentioned Frazier's name in her FBI testimony. But you, who were never there, have all the answers knowing exactly where you want her to be. That's comical.

Sarah Stanton stated that she immediately went inside the building after after hearing 3 shots and went upstairs to the second floor to look out the window to see what what happening. But then, you and Doyle, make up fake stories of Stanton chatting it up outside on the steps in the Prayer Man position.       

Buell Frazier on several occasions confirmed that Stanton was standing to his left. Never once did he ever say she was the Prayer Man or she was to his extreme right. So, how can you claim she is the Prayer Man?   

In fact, just recently, Frazier again said he has no idea who the Prayer Man is. Wouldn't he have said it was Stanton if she was indeed standing in that Prayer Man spot you claim she was standing in? How could he not know if he was talking to her as you claim? The reason that Frazier does not know, is because Stanton was never in the Prayer Man position and she was to his left as he always maintained. This simple fact proves your theory to be incorrect.

Obviously there is Pauline Sanders statement that Stanton was on the east side of the entranceway and in other interviews Frazier seems to indicate Sarah was to his left. The common sense approach to all this evidence is that Stanton moved from the east side to the west as the motorcade approached.

 

Ok, so now you are just making up your own false evidence like Doyle used to do. Good job and give yourself a big pat on the back!

It's amazing how people like you can just "move" a person from one spot to the next and claim that as your evidence.         

You want Sarah Stanton to be in the Prayer Man position so badly that you invented your own fake evidence. You "moved" Stanton to the Prayer Man position (with her 300+ pounds) when she is always placed on the opposite side by two witnesses. 

Sarah Stanton was identified on the opposite side by two witnesses, you can't move her into the Prayer Man position just because you want her to be there....C'mon man!  

That's exactly what advocates for Oswald as Prayer Man have done. There is not one scrap of evidence that places Oswald on the steps.

The advocates against Oswald as Prayer Man (like you) foolishly try to place a 300+ pound woman (who was identified on the opposite side by two witnesses) in the Prayer Man position just so they can eliminate Oswald as a candidate. Even worse, you physically moved her to the spot juat saying "she moved" and claim that as your evidence. Talk about being desperate...that takes the cake!     

You sound like Alan here.
Why rule out Oswald as a potential candidate?
I don't believe Oswald took the shots but I can't say definitively where he was at that time.
It would be amazing if it were Oswald on the steps.
So why not accept it is Oswald on the steps?

Because I base my research on facts and evidence. I don't make up phony theories and invent situations that never occurred to come to my final conclusion. The fact is too many researchers do that, and you're placing Stanton in the Prayer Man position, and your only "evidence" is to just say Stanton "moved". That's absolutely ridiculous and is not serious research.             

Because there is not one scrap of evidence that places him there.
The question is - How can other researchers place him there?

I never said Oswald was the Prayer Man. Some researchers want him to be there and others like you don't. Until we know who exactly the Prayer Man is, you can't make up phony claims like "Sarah Stanton is the Prayer Man" when two witnesses and Sarah Stanton herself never place her there. And you can't claim a 300+ pound woman is the figure of a smaller framed person. That doesn't work which is why Stanton as "Prayer Man" is a joke.       

How do you know it's a man?

The dead giveaway is the part on the right side of the head and the receding hairline. That's not a woman's hairstyle.  And the shirt the Prayer Man is wearing is a man's shirt and not a woman's outfit.   

[Rick Plant]

I get the impression Oswald was utterly contemptuous of his work colleagues who he believed were all beneath him. So much so he wouldn't even pretend to make so much as the slightest effort to show any mannersl. He was so convinced of his superiority he could treat those around him like the dirt he thought they were. Ironically, his quietness didn't make him invisible, quite the contrary, in the tight-knit, gossip-prone, enclosed world of the TSBD he would have stood out head and shoulders above everyone else.

You get this impression because Oswald didn't converse with his colleagues?

To believe this socially incompetent, arrogant loner would spend one second in the company of his work colleagues if he didn't have to is absurd. If Oswald watched the motorcade it was from some dark quiet corner where nobody else would think to be.

Are you now placing Oswald in the Prayer Man position?   

[Zeon Mason]

Why would not Oswald at least tell his brother about the front steps?

Why not tell Marina

If either one or both of above were told, why would they choose not to ever divulge such critical information?

I can only speculate a possible reason that Oswald had intent of not letting such alibi be known (except to Will Fritz )because of some anticipation
of potential high profile attorney representing Oswald, initiating a wrongful arrest lawsuit and monetary settlement once some photographic/film evidence might be discovered.

Other options:

1. Oswald was not PM and chose to lie to his interrogators that he “went out to watch the P. Parade”, then reversed himself and denied saying such statement to those same interrogators.
2. Oswald was a schizophrenic and while one personality knew where he was, the other did not.
3. There Is a near double of Oswald who was the 6th floor shooter , while Lee Harvey Oswald was at the front entrance steps.
 

[Bill Chapman]

Why would not Oswald at least tell his brother about the front steps?

Why not tell Marina

If either one or both of above were told, why would they choose not to ever divulge such critical information?

I can only speculate a possible reason that Oswald had intent of not letting such alibi be known (except to Will Fritz )because of some anticipation
of potential high profile attorney representing Oswald, initiating a wrongful arrest lawsuit and monetary settlement once some photographic/film evidence might be discovered.

Other options:

1. Oswald was not PM and chose to lie to his interrogators that he “went out to watch the P. Parade”, then reversed himself and denied saying such statement to those same interrogators.
2. Oswald was a schizophrenic and while one personality knew where he was, the other did not.
3. There Is a near double of Oswald who was the 6th floor shooter , while Lee Harvey Oswald was at the front entrance steps.

Oswald said he was in the lunchroom when he heard the 'commotion' outside. We LNers reckon he had somewhat loftier ambitions; say six floors worth.

And his brother Robert and Marina thought him guilty.

[John Mytton]

Oswald said he was in the lunchroom when he heard the 'commotion' outside. We LNers reckon he had somewhat loftier ambitions; say six floors worth.

And his brother Robert and Marina thought him guilty.

Mr. HOLMES. He said when lunchtime came he was working in one of the upper floors with a Negro.
The Negro said, "Come on and let's eat lunch together."
Apparently both of them having a sack lunch. And he said, "You go ahead, send the elevator back up to me and I will come down just as soon as I am finished."
And he didn't say what he was doing. There was a commotion outside, which he later rushed downstairs to go out to see what was going on. He didn't say whether he took the stairs down. He didn't say whether he took the elevator down.
But he went downstairs, and as he went out the front, it seems as though he did have a coke with him, or he stopped at the coke machine, or somebody else was trying to get a coke, but there was a coke involved.
He mentioned something about a coke. But a police officer asked him who he was, and just as he started to identify himself, his superintendent came up and said, "He is one of our men." And the policeman said, "Well, you step aside for a little bit."
Then another man rushed in past him as he started out the door, in this vestibule part of it, and flashed some kind of credential and he said, "Where is your telephone, where is your telephone, and said I am so and so, where is your telephone."
And he said, "I didn't look at the credential. I don't know who he said he was, and I just pointed to the phone and said, 'there it is,' and went on out the door."

JohnM