DiEugenio Says Nobody Should Read This Article About Oliver Stone's "JFK" ...

[Jerry Freeman]

Garrison deduced a theory, then he marshaled his facts

That sounds strangely familiar
30 years later and still slamming a film they don't even show anymore.

[Thomas Graves]

So do you...I think.  Perhaps you meant 'no truer words were ever spoken'? 

Dear Gerald,

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr ....

--  MWT 

[Thomas Graves]

That sounds strangely familiar
30 years later and still slamming a film they don't even show anymore.

But which influenced SO many gullible people (myself included), led to SO many anti-MIICC tinfoil hat conspiracy theories (which ultimately helped Putin install his useful idiot Trump as our president), and even motivated Congress to establish the ARRB (or some-such thing).

--  MWT 

*MIICC = Military Industrial Intelligence Community Complex, aka "Deep State"

[Thomas Graves]

Oh, and which by the way had its origins in a KGB disinfo article placed in a Communist-owned Italian newspaper in 1967 ...

https://staging.quillette.com/2018/09/27/the-soviets-and-the-jfk-conspiracy-theorists/

--  MWT 

[Tom Scully]

That sounds strangely familiar
30 years later and still slamming a film they don't even show anymore.

Facts don't matter, belief matters.

The major motion picture, JFK, is associated with a release date of December 21, 1991.:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0102138/?ref_=nv_sr_1

http://www.leagle.com/decision/19921409806FSupp603_11312/RUSSO%20v.%20CONDE%20NAST%20PUBLICATIONS
Perry RUSSO v. CONDE NAST PUBLICATIONS d/b/a Gentlemen’s Quarterly.
United States District Court, E.D. Louisiana.
November 17, 1992
……
UNDISPUTED FACTUAL BACKGROUND:

In its January, 1992 issue, GQ Magazine published an article entitled “The Case Against Jim Garrison” (hereafter the “GQ article”). The GQ article was written by Nicholas B. Lemann, a New Orleans native and winner of numerous awards for his books and articles. The GQ article was a personal memoir1 of Lemann’s recollections of growing up in New Orleans during District Attorney Jim Garrison’s prosecution of Clay Shaw for allegedly conspiring to assassinate JFK.

The 1991 movie release, JFK sparked renewed interest in the assassination as well as the prosecution itself of Clay Shaw. The film was purportedly based on Garrison’s book, On the Trail of Assassins, and sympathetically portrayed Garrison.

The GQ article published by Lemann took a different slant, expressing his view that Shaw’s prosecution was built on flimsy evidence and was a tremendous embarrassment to the city.2 The thrust of Lemann’s article was his opinion countering that expressed by Stone in his film release JFK, to wit:

(See Letters to GQ, http://jfk.hood.edu/Collection/Weisberg%20Subject%20Index%20Files/S%20Disk/Stone%20Oliver%20JFK%20Movie/Gentleman's%20Quarterly/Item%2002.pdf
An excerpt from the introduction to Lemann’s lengthy response.:
…Printing both sides of the story has never been a
fundamental rule of magazine journalism.
Magazines are supposed to be feisty and opin-
ionated. So it’s with a sense of futility that I
rebut Sklar’s points….

Clay Shaw knew this the week after he was arrested. Ms. Mellen, or even Garrison's auto-biography editor and Oliver Stone's co-screen play writer, Zachary Sklar, were not informed of this by Jim Garrison.:

https://charlierose.com/guests/11110
Zachary Sklar — Charlie Rosecharlierose.com › guests
Lists all of Zachary Sklar's appearances on the Charlie Rose program on ... Nicholas Lemann, David Denby, and Zachary Sklar debate Oliver Stone's movie ...

https://jfkfacts.org/provocative-prolific-joan-mellen/#comment-869590
Tom S. April 14, 2016 at 1:58 am

....I found something that Donald H Carpenter happened upon just before I did, and included it but buried it in
his book. It does not mesh with the two decades long, anti-Garrison campaign of Nicholas B Lemann, nor with Stone’s movie, and it was Joan Mellen who named Garrison’s wife’s cousins, one of which was Mrs. Garrison’s godfather, and declared to Rex Bradford, “these are the CIA people.” Ms. Mellen left at that. DiEugenio has been informed and has buried his head in the sand. Shaw was told about Garrison’s conflict from the godfather/cousin himself, David Baldwin who Shaw hired fresh from his dismissal from CIA in India where he was serving as a covert agent. Shaw never raised this as an issue, and neither did Garrison.

Ironically, Garrison and Ms. Mellen’s “CIA people” appear to have had the ability to settle their differences after a family Thanksgiving gathering, if they actually did have differences and were not all following instructions to perform a limited hangout......

Once I discovered the Garrison "experts" were clueless, and the reaction of "the community" is to circle the wagons, I better understood how "Trump 45" could be "a thing".

https://jfkfacts.org/provocative-prolific-joan-mellen/#comment-869223
Tom S. - April 12, 2016 at 1:25 pm

Although I am credited as a contributor to Ms. Mellen’s book, “Our Man in Haiti,” my entire body of research results influence me to share an opinion that the description of Joan Mellen in this article is overdone….

She first met Jim Garrison just months after the Clay Shaw trial in 1969 and described interviewing more than 1200 people before publishing her book on Jim Garrison, “Farewell to Justice.”

More than 30 years after she first met Jim Garrison and in addition to much other research and interviewing 1200 people, this was the crux and the emphasis of Joan Mellen’s presentation on the best supported CIA influences/interference on Garrison’s investigation and his prosecution of Clay Shaw.

https://www.maryferrell.org/pages/Unredacted_-_Episode_1_-_Transcript.html
Unredacted Episode 1: Transcript of Interview with Joan Mellen
Joan Mellen is the author of A Farewell to Justice: Jim Garrison, JFK’s Assassination, and the Case That Should Have Changed History. This interview was conducted on 22 Feb 2006. Tyler Weaver provided the introduction, and the interview was conducted by Rex Bradford.
…….
REX: I – I think –

JOAN: – when Baldwin was present, he was a CIA asset, his brother worked for the International Trade Mart and Clay Shaw, David Baldwin, and these, these are CIA people….

Using only internet resources and in the course of a couple of weeks of part time research I shared in comments on this website, (see- https://jfkfacts.org/assassination/review/who-was-the-only-man-to-ever-face-legal-charges-in-jfks-assassination/#comment-856847 )
I found these details, not published or mentioned, ever, by Joan Mellen.

In the course of attempting to determine if my new fact checked research details were actually original, I found identical details, by author of a biography of Clay Shaw, Donald H Carpenter.

From Joan Mellen’s book :

https://books.google.com/books?id=9mQtAgAAQBAJ&pg=PT138&lpg=PT138&dq=%22joan+mellen%22+stephen+lemann&source=bl&ots=JQ0cQ7W_xe&sig=zjEbm-HJgiFBiqsZJ_VSNijJh0U&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjAvsOe1YnMAhVLHD4KHdSUDKoQ6AEIQjAF#v=onepage&q=%22joan%20mellen%22%20stephen%20lemann&f=false


The best face I can put on this is that Garrison misled and failed to disclose to his friend, Joan Mellen, and editor of his own book, the co-writer of the JFK the movie screenplay, Zachary Sklar.

The most troubling thing I’ve learned is that almost no one seems to appreciate being exposed to this new information. They already knew what they knew and indicate a preference of not having to consider Garrison’s actual proximity to those even he described as CIA sponsored adversaries.

Garrison’s silence on this also provided an opening (unanswered by Garrison) for the belligerent nephew of Stepen B. Lemann who is also the step-nephew of wife of Lee Garrison’s first cousin and godfather David Baldwin.:

continued……

Reply

https://jfkfacts.org/provocative-prolific-joan-mellen/#comment-869321
Tom S. April 12, 2016 at 9:18 pm

Bogman, how could Garrison go “a little mad with the spook meddling?”
The point I attempted to make comparing Joan Mellen’s version….”these were the CIA people,”
and Garrison only describing Stephen B Lemann in his complaint to the FCC, (June, 1967) as
counsel to WDSU who is “known in the past to have distributed Central Intelligence Agency funds,”
and Garrison worked several year under former NODA Leon Hubert, Jr. with David Baldwin’s brother,
Edward, another first cousin of Garrison’s wife.

Where is Garrison’s mention of Stephen B Lemann’s hiring
of Father Machann out of the Catholic priesthood and into
a job as a NOLA mental health field coordinator?
(see- https://jfkfacts.org/assassination/news/obama-prepares-future-critics-dwell-past/#comment-864459 )
Garrison said what now appears suspiciously on anything specific about any of the activities of his wife’s family members and their in-laws.

Edward’s law partner wrote a letter to CIA’s Helms requesting to be put on “the list.”
Between them, Stephen B. Lemann and Edward Baldwin were the principle CIA lawyers Garrison
was accusing of tampering with his witnesses, making promises to protect them from Garrison.

If the CIA interference angle was overdone, now we know it was because Garrison had an undisclosed
connection to the “CIA lawyers” and to the closest CIA link to Clay Shaw, David Baldwin, and Shaw
knew all this from late in the first week of his arrest.

The problem I observe is the refusal to carefully consider what actually happened, without the strong influences
of Joan Mellen, Zachary Sklar, Oliver Stone, and Garrison himself.

None of them actually provided any clearer picture of what was going than Clay Shaw or Nicholas
Lemann have, and that is the basis for my criticism.

I’m happy George can be confident the American people would not have been better informed before
1979 if Garrison had never opened his mouth or made an arrest. I cannot know that, so I’m glad for
George that he can assert that, here.

Why is it not a consideration that Garrison and Shaw simply put on a performance, as they were instructed to? You may not like it but it is a plausible explanation for Garrison’s connections to his purported antagnoists never coming to light. I find it hard to believe Mellen and Sklar were in
on Garrison and his ex-wife’s non-disclosure. The evidence is there that Garrison played Mellen, Sklar, and as a result, also Stone.

In one sentence, all of the names that stand out, Stephen B Lemann, Edward Baldwin, Lemann’s nephew,
Nicholas, and in the background, Shaw’s friend and ex-covert CIA agent David Baldwin, described by Joan Mellen as the CIA people, were actually close relatives of Garrison’s wife, or their in-laws.

Examine your indifference to these connections being hidden, until presented without comment in 2014
in Donald H Carpenter’s book. I think the true reason there is no reaction or denial is that people
have too much invested in the JFK the movie narrative, and the people who got closest to Garrison and wrote books and made a movie are left with egg on their faces.

Reply

Garrison writes to the FCC Commissioner :



https://maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=62423&search=garrison_and+rosel#relPageId=176&tab=page


Seven years later, Nicholas Lemann, nephew of that "attorney closely connected with the station.", writes about Garrison in "The Crimson:
and here is Nicholas B. Lemann, in 1991 :



Nicholas B. Lemann, writing in GQ Magazine in December, 1991 :

https://www.thecrimson.com/article/1974/2/6/the-rise-and-fall-of-big/
The Rise and Fall of Big Jim G. | News |
Feb 6, 1974 - The Rise and Fall of Big Jim G. Politics ... Garrison became the district attorney in New Orleans in 1962, winning a ... The Crimson Brand Studio.
By Nicholas Lemann

https://jfkfacts.org/comment-of-the-week-15/#comment-856783
Tom S. - February 7, 2016 at 11:40 am

Photon’s and to a lesser extent, Dr. McAdams’s reactions to the presentation of Garrison – Shaw related details over the past three weeks are illuminating and troubling. Dean Nicholas B. Lemann looks even
worse, and contemplating Photon’s comments, it is surprising that this is possible.

Was Tom Purivs “on to something?”

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=20298&p=275862
Thomas H. Purvis – Posted 18 July 2013
As was long ago indicated on this forum, the Clay Shaw/Garrison case was little more than a massive “smoke screen”…

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=20298&p=275914
Posted 19 July 2013
……
The “power structure” within New Orleans lies not with those who are currently in what is some temporary political position.

It lies with those who possess the capability to place these persons in the various political positions.

Therefore, Jim Garrison, not unlike any other political figure in New Orleans, did what he was instructed to do or else he suffered the consequences.

Now, if one could only resolve exactly who, within the deep south city of New Orleans, LA, would have reason to replace JFK.

Hint:…

[Joe Elliott]

Oliver Stone: “I’ve created a counter-myth to the official one – is that so bad?”

Liars are always looking for excuses for their lies. So they can justify the lies to others. So they can justify the lies to themselves. Anyone who makes this kind of statement is a classic red flag. It is no big coincidence that some of the biggest liars of all time, the Nazis, saw all others as big time liars, including the liberal press of the West. Is there a parallel with Donald Trump here? I think so.

Of course, if what us LNers support is a pack of lies, no rational person would respond with their own pack of lies. You just respond with the truth.

If any LNer on this board were ever to say he is creating counter myths to combat the lies of the CTers, I would urge him to go find another cause to support. We don’t need his help. I think other LNers would feel the same.

If John McAdams or if Vincent Bugliosi ever made such a statement, LNers would drop them as their top spokemen. But Oliver Stone can say that and still be a big hero to many CTers. That says something about LNers and CTers.

[John Tonkovich]

Why would anyone try to learn history from...a film?

Also, why is Mr. Graves even posting about an individual on another forum?
How does this add to the "General Discussion and Debate"?

[Thomas Graves]

Why would anyone try to learn history from...a film?

Also, why is Mr. Graves even posting about an individual on another forum?
How does this add to the "General Discussion and Debate"?

Mr. Tonkovich,

Your question should have been, "How does one not get brainwashed by Russian disinformation in a blockbuster "historical" movie (sic) by Oliver "I Admire Vladimir Putin and My Son Works for RT" Stone?

If, in JFK, Stone knowingly created and put onto the silver screen a "counter myth," shouldn't he have labeled it as such for the audience, rather than presenting it as factual?

--  MWT