The Dale Myers Blog

[John Iacoletti]

I assume he could see Oswald disappear, likely, as Bill Chapman said, into the entrance ‘hall’ that leads to the theater doors. He doesn’t need to see Oswald go through the doors to infer that he had likely snuck into the theater. In any case, it doesn’t hurt to go check it out and when he finds that Oswald is not indeed not in the ‘hall’, he knows he must have passed through the doors.

No he doesn’t. Because he wasn’t watching the front of the theatre for the entire time.

[Jerry Freeman]

It is clear that he is talking about the events of November 22, 1963, but is making this statement before a Notary Public on December 6, 1963,

So what? Brewer repeated his claim..

Mr. BREWER - Well, they kept reconstructing what had happened and what they had heard, and they talked about it in general. There wasn't too much to talk about. They didn't have all the facts, and just repeated them mostly. And they said a patrolman had been shot in Oak Cliff.

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/brewer_j.htm
Didn't sound very confused to me. To say otherwise is just unfounded speculation.

And how is your implied conjecture that memories are always reliable---

I didn't ever write that and you know it. You just added those words out of the blue. 
Besides, why is a memory only reliable when it supports the official story?

[Bill Chapman]

Doesn’t need to hear that a policeman had been shot. Hearing that the President had been shot, just 3 miles away, just about an hour before, is reason enough to be alert for suspicious behavior.

I assume he could see Oswald disappear, likely, as Bill Chapman said, into the entrance ‘hall’ that leads to the theater doors. He doesn’t need to see Oswald go through the doors to infer that he had likely snuck into the theater. In any case, it doesn’t hurt to go check it out and when he finds that Oswald is not indeed not in the ‘hall’, he knows he must have passed through the doors.

I get the impression that CTers are annoyed with Mr. Brewer. Why couldn’t he have just minded his own business.

'He doesn’t need to see Oswald go through the doors to infer that he had likely snuck into the theater'

Tell that to a CTer and see how far you get

[Bill Chapman]

Probability arguments definitely make sense. Certainly, in this case.

Mr. Brewer was about 7 years younger than Ms. Postal. Mr. Brewer was a tall handsome man with a steady job. It doesn’t sound too likely that they would get to know each other. If they were the same age, it would be more likely. And I get the feeling that Mr. Brewer would probably not get on a first name basis with Butch.

Mr. Brewer knew Julie and Butch. Knew both on a first name basis. Did the Butch act as the ‘chaperone’ for Johnny and Julie on their dates? Or was there something, how shall I say it, a little less conventional about the relationship among the three? To me this all sounds pretty unlikely.

It all boils down to this:

33-year-old memories are suspect.

33-year-old memories that it appears did not exist 2 weeks or 4 months after the event, but do appear by 33 years later, are very suspect.

And new 33-year-old memories that just popped up and sound fishy are very, very, suspect.


And in general, at lot of these new 33-year old memories that just popped up seem fishy.

Mr. Brewer was with two IBM employees. It was a Friday, 6 days before Thanksgiving, when I would think they would be at work but they were just hanging out at a shoe store, lounging around and killing time. Mr. Brewer remembers them being there but doesn’t remember any interaction with them. Asking them if they thought that young man was acting strange. Asking them to come with him to check out this suspicious man. Doesn’t even remember asking them to leave the store so he can lock up for a bit and check out this mystery at the theater.

And he suddenly, years later, remembers that he did see Oswald before. That he sold Oswald a pair of shoes. He now even remembers exactly the model numbers of the shoes. Yeah.

33-year-old memories that just popped up need to seem plausible to be accepted as possibly real memories and not false memories that even honest people will develop over time. These memories do not seem real. There is no obvious reason why they should be lies. None of these memories got him an extra $ 20,000 or do anything for him. They sound like false memories.

'Mr. Brewer was about 7 years younger than Ms. Postal. Mr. Brewer was a tall handsome man with a steady job. It doesn’t sound too likely that they would get to know each other. If they were the same age, it would be more likely. And I get the feeling that Mr. Brewer would probably not get on a first name basis with Butch'.

BS, Joe. Maybe she would turn out to be a cougar 

[Joe Elliott]

So what? Brewer repeated his claim.. http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/brewer_j.htm

Once one has false memory, it tends to stick. He could have a false memory two weeks later, four months later, and 33 months later. It doesn’t matter if he repeats the same story one hundred times it can still be a false memory.

Didn't sound very confused to me. To say otherwise is just unfounded speculation.

No, it doesn’t sound confused at all. If we only go by what he is saying. But because we know he could not have heard (I assume) a broadcast over the radio within 21 minutes of the shooting, he is either confused about the order of events, or lying. However, no one has explained what his motive for lying would be. Why tell a lie “I was alerted by the report of a policeman shooting” when he could tell the truth “I was alerted by the report of the President being shot”. People generally don’t lie without a reason. I am not going to believe he lied unless someone can come up with a plausible reason.

So, it is reasonable to assume that he was confused about when he first heard about the shooting of the policeman. He may have remembered this being broadcast over the radio a couple of hours later but a couple of days later forget when he heard it.

I didn't ever write that and you know it. You just added those words out of the blue. 

Ok, what is your position? Can false memories occur? Can they form after 2 weeks? After they form, do they tend to remain permanent?

In Mr. Brewer’s case, I would assume that people have tried to tell him he is mistaken. But this would be impossible to prove to him, without him listening to a recording of every radio station he might have been listening to. So, without proof, he would probably say “Well, that’s what I remember”. False memories seem just as real as true ones.

Besides, why is a memory only reliable when it supports the official story?

Memory is unreliable. That is why I prefer to go with film and physical evidence.


Finally, someone could say “Mr. Smith said there were only two shots fired at the President. I think he is lying”. Well, to get me to accept that Mr. Smith is lying, you would have to give me a reasonable motive. Why would he lie when he really knew there are 3 shots fired? Without some motive for lying, I’m always going to chalk it up to it being a false memory.

[Joe Elliott]

'He doesn’t need to see Oswald go through the doors to infer that he had likely snuck into the theater'

Tell that to a CTer and see how far you get

Maybe it’s a difference in the way CTers think.

If a tree falls in the forest, but nobody hears it, does it make a sound?

If Oswald enters a theater, but nobody sees him go through the doors, did he really enter the theater?

If Oswald carries a long package toward the TSBD, but nobody sees him enter the building with it, did he really enter the building with a long package?

[Joe Elliott]

'Mr. Brewer was about 7 years younger than Ms. Postal. Mr. Brewer was a tall handsome man with a steady job. It doesn’t sound too likely that they would get to know each other. If they were the same age, it would be more likely. And I get the feeling that Mr. Brewer would probably not get on a first name basis with Butch'.

BS, Joe. Maybe she would turn out to be a cougar 

If she was, I bet Mr. Brewer would remember that. There are certain events that do not become false memories.

[Martin Weidmann]

Probability arguments definitely make sense. Certainly, in this case.

Mr. Brewer was about 7 years younger than Ms. Postal. Mr. Brewer was a tall handsome man with a steady job. It doesn’t sound too likely that they would get to know each other. If they were the same age, it would be more likely. And I get the feeling that Mr. Brewer would probably not get on a first name basis with Butch.

Mr. Brewer knew Julie and Butch. Knew both on a first name basis. Did the Butch act as the ‘chaperone’ for Johnny and Julie on their dates? Or was there something, how shall I say it, a little less conventional about the relationship among the three? To me this all sounds pretty unlikely.

It all boils down to this:

33-year-old memories are suspect.

33-year-old memories that it appears did not exist 2 weeks or 4 months after the event, but do appear by 33 years later, are very suspect.

And new 33-year-old memories that just popped up and sound fishy are very, very, suspect.


And in general, at lot of these new 33-year old memories that just popped up seem fishy.

Mr. Brewer was with two IBM employees. It was a Friday, 6 days before Thanksgiving, when I would think they would be at work but they were just hanging out at a shoe store, lounging around and killing time. Mr. Brewer remembers them being there but doesn’t remember any interaction with them. Asking them if they thought that young man was acting strange. Asking them to come with him to check out this suspicious man. Doesn’t even remember asking them to leave the store so he can lock up for a bit and check out this mystery at the theater.

And he suddenly, years later, remembers that he did see Oswald before. That he sold Oswald a pair of shoes. He now even remembers exactly the model numbers of the shoes. Yeah.

33-year-old memories that just popped up need to seem plausible to be accepted as possibly real memories and not false memories that even honest people will develop over time. These memories do not seem real. There is no obvious reason why they should be lies. None of these memories got him an extra $ 20,000 or do anything for him. They sound like false memories.

Probability arguments definitely make sense. Certainly, in this case.

No they don't. Probability arguments are subjective, just like assumptions....

With sufficient probability arguments and assumptions you can arrive at any desired conclusion.