My Re-Evaluation of Johnny Brewer’s Initial Report of December 6, 1963

[Joe Elliott]

If Sabastian had heard a report on the radio he would have known that it was Tippit, or at least a police officer, who was DOA, but he clearly did not know that because he asked the dispatcher "That the officer".

I think he only knew that some officer was shot, as he could tell over the police radio. Maybe even which officer, if he happened to know that Officer Tippit was driving Unit 10. But likely he didn’t know what car each officer was driving. Only the Dispatcher would know that. Officer Sabastian was just looking for conformation of the report he heard over commercial radio, that the officer in question had actually died.

Another point of interest is this. Let's say you're right and Sabastian did hear it on the radio at 1.25 or just before that. According to the official narrative, Tippit was allegedly shot at 1.14/1.15 and picked up by an ambulance at 1.18. The drive to Methodist Hospital from 10th/Patton is about 4 minutes, which puts the arrival of the ambulance at 1.22. There were no reporters with the ambulance, only Davenport's police car which started following the ambulance en route. Back in those days reporters had to call in stories by phone, so for the story to be broadcast at no later than 1.25, there were only three minutes, after the ambulance arrival, available for a reporter to get to Methodist Hospital, talk to a doctor, find a phone and call it in and get the story on the air..... Not very likely... Even less likely would be that a reporter calling in from Methodist Hospital would report to the station that he was at Parkland Hospital.

The DOA report, although accurate, may very well have been a false detail. False details in early reports are very common. Like the early reports that the President and the Governor were shot and a Secret Service agent killed, all in Dealey Plaza. The DOA report was likely a false detail, accept, by chance, it turned out to be true.

First of all, you are only speculating that Sabastian heard a news flash in his squad car. There is no evidence for that. And secondly, as I already stated in the "Unsung Heroes" thread;

This is false. There is evidence of that. The evidence is that Sabastian said he heard from “NBC News” that an officer was DOA. And this message was recorded on the Dictabelt. He could only get his voice recorded if he was broadcasting from his patrol car.

This could not be based on a conversation with a news reporter. Officer Sabastian was in his patrol car several miles north of Dealey Plaza. As he reported his location just 2 to 3 minutes before.

Also, this was not a 33-year-old memory, a 4-month-old memory, not even a 2-week-old memory, but a statement he made immediately. And his statement is recorded on the Dictabelt.

DPD recordings are likely not correct, as per J.C. Bowles, the man in charge of the DPD dispatchers;

The relative times are correct. Officer Sabastian reported that the media was reporting the death of an officer 11 to 12 minutes after Police Dispatch first heard of the shooting of Officer Tippit. Far sooner than I have been led to believe that such a news report could have been made. But of course, since the media was monitoring the police radio frequencies, they could have heard about it as soon as the Police Dispatcher and easily report on this within 11 to 12 minutes.


So, in conclusion, one can nitpick at this message.

Sabastian:     NBC News is reporting DOA.
Dispatcher:   That's correct.       
Sabastian:     That the officer?       
Dispatcher:   Yes.

•   It could not have been from “NBC News”. But the reporters for WFAA sometimes broadcast for “NBC News”, and sometimes for “ABC News”. So, this is an easy error that could have occurred. And we have no recording for WFAA so soon after the assassination. We could say it is speculation that WFAA made such a broadcast but it is equally speculative to say that WFAA did not. Except the hypothesis that WFAA, or some other radio station, did make this broadcast is supported by Officer Sabastian’s recorded statement.

•   Officer Tippit was DOA, but the media could not have known that so soon. But faulty details in early stories are common, like a Secret Service agent was killed in Dealey Plaza. Just because of this faulty detail, no one doubts that the early reports were about the shooting of the President and Governor at Dealey Plaza. So, no one should doubt that these early reports were about the police officer being shot.

•   We don’t know if the media did report Officer Tippit was DOA. But we know, for a fact, that the media never reported the President or the Governor were DOA. They kept stressing that both were in surgery and that there was still hope. A DOA report, even a faulty one, could only have been for Officer Tippit. And if the media ‘DOA report’ was for the President, or the Governor, or even the Secret Service Agent, Officer Sabastian would not have asked “That the officer?”.


Is this absolute proof that the media reported over radio the death of a police officer? No. But it’s pretty convincing evidence.

[Joe Elliott]

So, if Oswald was roaming the streets of Oak Cliff, acting "suspiciously", why didn't anyone but Johnny Brewer notice? And also follow him, call the police, warn their neighbors?
Only Johnny Brewer - and perhaps those with him, though we'll never know, because they were never identified, nor interviewed- spotted this dangerous double murderer.

Every time one looks into the details of this case, one finds a stunning lack of follow through.
That doesn't mean some conspiracy on the part of the DPD and the FBI, just a desire for a quick, easy uncomplicated solution.

Because I don’t think a police car with the siren on was approaching Oswald ever 5 minutes. If that did happen, and each time Oswald ducked briefly into a store entrance, we might have had other reports like that of Mr. Brewer and Julia Postal.

The earliest statement, from two weeks later, did not mention “we.” Only the statements taken down 4 months later. And the questioner probably didn’t even notice the “we” while going through his list of questions.

And, they already had 2 witnesses, Johnny Brewer and Julia Postal, who saw Oswald disappear from view at the approach of a police car with a siren on. Do we really need one or two more? About a subject who ten minutes later not only ducked into a shoe store entrance, ducked into a theater without paying, but also pulled a gun and struck Officer McDonald when he asked Oswald to stand up?

[John Iacoletti]

Also, this was not a 33-year-old memory, a 4-month-old memory, not even a 2-week-old memory, but a statement he made immediately. And his statement is recorded on the Dictabelt.

That doesn’t make it true. There’s nothing that corroborates it.

It could not have been from “NBC News”. But the reporters for WFAA sometimes broadcast for “NBC News”, and sometimes for “ABC News”.

WBAP and WFAA were different radio stations. They shared broadcast frequencies, but why do you assume they shared announcers?

So, this is an easy error that could have occurred. And we have no recording for WFAA so soon after the assassination.

There are “WFAA News” reports on the so-called “WBAP” broadcast tape during the relevant time.

•   We don’t know if the media did report Officer Tippit was DOA. But we know, for a fact, that the media never reported the President or the Governor were DOA.

That’s quite a double-standard. You can’t rule out all those minor stations we don’t have recordings for, right?

They kept stressing that both were in surgery and that there was still hope. A DOA report, even a faulty one, could only have been for Officer Tippit.

A faulty report could have said anything.

And if the media ‘DOA report’ was for the President, or the Governor, or even the Secret Service Agent, Officer Sabastian would not have asked “That the officer?”.

I could just as easily say that if another organization announced the Tippit shooting, Sebastian would not have said “NBC News”. You don’t get to decide what a mistaken cop can be mistaken about.

Is this absolute proof that the media reported over radio the death of a police officer? No. But it’s pretty convincing evidence.

To you, maybe.

[John Iacoletti]

And, they already had 2 witnesses, Johnny Brewer and Julia Postal, who saw Oswald disappear from view at the approach of a police car with a siren on.

Postal did not see such a thing.

Do we really need one or two more? About a subject who ten minutes later not only ducked into a shoe store entrance, ducked into a theater without paying, but also pulled a gun and struck Officer McDonald when he asked Oswald to stand up?

Is that a hypothetical question? Oswald did not “pull a gun”.

[Bill Chapman]

Oswald, who had phenomenal respect for authority, especially poor dumb cops, promptly stood to attention as the poor dumb cops approached. In his bumbling attempt to salute, he inadvertently popped a poor dumb cop in the chops, knocking him backwards. Then, as a patsy, he tried to turn in his poor dumb cop-killer S&W. While playing handsies with poor dumb cops, he almost shot more poor dumb cops.

Noticing that the movie had stopped, he remarked 'That's it. It's all over now'. Then, while resisting arrest, he protested that he wasn't resisting arrest.

[Martin Weidmann]

I think he only knew that some officer was shot, as he could tell over the police radio. Maybe even which officer, if he happened to know that Officer Tippit was driving Unit 10. But likely he didn’t know what car each officer was driving. Only the Dispatcher would know that. Officer Sabastian was just looking for conformation of the report he heard over commercial radio, that the officer in question had actually died.

The only problem is that there is no evidence whatsoever for such a report on commercial radio around 1.25pm and the timeline (if the official narrative is correct) makes it physically impossible for such a broadcast to be made within 3 minutes after Tippit being declared DOA at 1.22.

The DOA report, although accurate, may very well have been a false detail. False details in early reports are very common. Like the early reports that the President and the Governor were shot and a Secret Service agent killed, all in Dealey Plaza. The DOA report was likely a false detail, accept, by chance, it turned out to be true.

What "DOA report" may have been false yet accurate? I'm not even sure where you are getting this from, as there wasn't a DOA report. In fact there is no record of any verbal report and the first document that mentions Tippit's DOA is a permission for an autopsy which gives the time of DOA at 1.15 pm.

But you missed and/or ignored the point I made completely.

Another point of interest is this. Let's say you're right and Sabastian did hear it on the radio at 1.25 or just before that. According to the official narrative, Tippit was allegedly shot at 1.14/1.15 and picked up by an ambulance at 1.18. The drive to Methodist Hospital from 10th/Patton is about 4 minutes, which puts the arrival of the ambulance at 1.22. There were no reporters with the ambulance, only Davenport's police car which started following the ambulance en route. Back in those days reporters had to call in stories by phone, so for the story to be broadcast at no later than 1.25, there were only three minutes, after the ambulance arrival, available for a reporter to get to Methodist Hospital, talk to a doctor, find a phone and call it in and get the story on the air..... Not very likely... Even less likely would be that a reporter calling in from Methodist Hospital would report to the station that he was at Parkland Hospital.

Now, if Tippit was really shot at around 1.06 or 1.07 it would be a different matter, but I don't think you want to be having that discussion....

In any event, I put it to you that if Tippit was indeed declared DOA at 1.22, there was no physical possibility for a report about his death being broadcast 3 minutes after the event.

So, I repeat, if the official narrative is correct, Tippit was declared at Methodist Hospital at 1.22 pm. There is no physical way that his DOA could be reported on the air by a commercial station at 1.25 pm, when the DPD dispatcher, who was in direct radio contact with the officers at Methodist Hospital, didn't even confirm the DOA until 1.28 pm.

This is false. There is evidence of that. The evidence is that Sabastian said he heard from “NBC News” that an officer was DOA. And this message was recorded on the Dictabelt. He could only get his voice recorded if he was broadcasting from his patrol car.

This could not be based on a conversation with a news reporter. Officer Sabastian was in his patrol car several miles north of Dealey Plaza. As he reported his location just 2 to 3 minutes before.

Also, this was not a 33-year-old memory, a 4-month-old memory, not even a 2-week-old memory, but a statement he made immediately. And his statement is recorded on the Dictabelt.

No that's not false. Sabastian did not say he heard from NBC News, he said "NBC News is reporting DOA". There also is no evidence that he heard that news in his car, just like there is no proof that there actually was a radio transmission. You just assume he did and it's a circular argument.

You say Sabastian said he heard a broadcast (which he didn't really say), so there must have been one, and there must have been a broadcast because otherwise Sabastian could not have heard it.

As for his voice being on the dictabelt, yes he could only broadcast from his patrol car, but that doesn't mean he was in it when he heard about the DOA of an officer. In fact, he could have been one of the officers at the carpark where the jacket was found.

And who said anything about a conversation with a reporter? He simply could have overheard it. Victoria Adams wasn't talking to a police officer when she heard a message on DPD radio from a motorbike parked in front of the TSBD. As for his location, just before he asked about the DOA, Sabastian told the dispatcher he was almost at 400 East Jefferson. So, he was not several miles north of Dealey Plaza, as you incorrectly claimed.

The relative times are correct. Officer Sabastian reported that the media was reporting the death of an officer 11 to 12 minutes after Police Dispatch first heard of the shooting of Officer Tippit. Far sooner than I have been led to believe that such a news report could have been made. But of course, since the media was monitoring the police radio frequencies, they could have heard about it as soon as the Police Dispatcher and easily report on this within 11 to 12 minutes.

The relative times are correct.

So, now you know better than J.C. Bowes, the man who was actually in charge of the DPD dispatchers and who testified to the HSCA that the times could not be relied on? WOW!

Officer Sabastian reported that the media was reporting the death of an officer 11 to 12 minutes after Police Dispatch first heard of the shooting of Officer Tippit.

Really, and where did he say that? Or, for that matter, how did he know that? According to the DPD transcripts, the first General Broadcast of an officer being shot at 10th street was at 1.18 pm.... 11 to 12 later would be 1.29 to 1.30 for the alleged media broadcast.... 4 to 5 minutes after Sabastian allegedly heard a NBC broadcast. It doesn't add up.

But of course, since the media was monitoring the police radio frequencies, they could have heard about it as soon as the Police Dispatcher and easily report on this within 11 to 12 minutes.

Reporters have always monitored police radio frequencies for the purpose of finding out where the next story possibly is. As police radio traffic isn't always correct or complete, no responsible reporter would use those broadcasts as the main source for a report on the radio.

So, in conclusion, one can nitpick at this message.

Sabastian:     NBC News is reporting DOA.
Dispatcher:   That's correct.       
Sabastian:     That the officer?       
Dispatcher:   Yes.

•   It could not have been from “NBC News”. But the reporters for WFAA sometimes broadcast for “NBC News”, and sometimes for “ABC News”. So, this is an easy error that could have occurred. And we have no recording for WFAA so soon after the assassination. We could say it is speculation that WFAA made such a broadcast but it is equally speculative to say that WFAA did not. Except the hypothesis that WFAA, or some other radio station, did make this broadcast is supported by Officer Sabastian’s recorded statement.

•   Officer Tippit was DOA, but the media could not have known that so soon. But faulty details in early stories are common, like a Secret Service agent was killed in Dealey Plaza. Just because of this faulty detail, no one doubts that the early reports were about the shooting of the President and Governor at Dealey Plaza. So, no one should doubt that these early reports were about the police officer being shot.

•   We don’t know if the media did report Officer Tippit was DOA. But we know, for a fact, that the media never reported the President or the Governor were DOA. They kept stressing that both were in surgery and that there was still hope. A DOA report, even a faulty one, could only have been for Officer Tippit. And if the media ‘DOA report’ was for the President, or the Governor, or even the Secret Service Agent, Officer Sabastian would not have asked “That the officer?”.


Is this absolute proof that the media reported over radio the death of a police officer? No. But it’s pretty convincing evidence.

You keep repeating yourself.... Are you even taking notice of what others say?

Except the hypothesis that WFAA, or some other radio station, did make this broadcast is supported by Officer Sabastian’s recorded statement.

No it doesn't. Sabastian's message on DPD radio only shows that he (over)heard something about a DOA. He gets the station wrong and doesn't even know if it was "the officer" or "the President".

75 (Ptm. E.G. Sabastian)                    75.       
Dispatcher                                            75.       
75                                                    NBC News is reporting DOA.       
Dispatcher                                            That's correct.       
75 (?)                                            That the officer?       
Dispatcher                                      Yes.       
    
87 (?) (Ptm. R.C. Nelson)                    87.       
75                                            . . . on the President?       
Dispatcher                                            No, that's not correct, 19.       
                                                     What officer was it?       
Dispatcher                                     J.D. Tippit.


The available evidence clearly shows there couldn't have been a radio broadcast about Tippit's death within 3 minutes after him being declared DOA.

Officer Tippit was DOA, but the media could not have known that so soon. But faulty details in early stories are common

There was no faulty detail here. According to the official narrative (which I do not believe) Tippit was declared DOA at around 1.22 pm. In those days reporters had to phone in stories. There wasn't even a reporter present at Methodist Hospital and no broadcast about Tippit's death was made on DPD radio until 1.28 pm. There simply is no way that there could have been a radio broadcast within 3 minutes after the officer's death.

We don’t know if the media did report Officer Tippit was DOA. But we know, for a fact, that the media never reported the President or the Governor were DOA.

What kind of warped "logic" is this? Neither Kennedy or Connally were Dead on Arrival, so of course the media did not report that they were!

A DOA report, even a faulty one, could only have been for Officer Tippit.

And what DOA report would that be?

Officer Sabastian would not have asked “That the officer?”.

And if he thought it was Tippit, he wouldn't have asked ". . . on the President?"

[John Iacoletti]

Oswald, who had phenomenal respect for authority, especially poor dumb cops, promptly stood to attention as the poor dumb cops approached. In his bumbling attempt to salute, he inadvertently popped a poor dumb cop in the chops, knocking him backwards. Then, as a patsy, he tried to turn in his poor dumb cop-killer S&W. While playing handsies with poor dumb cops, he almost shot more poor dumb cops.

Noticing that the movie had stopped, he remarked 'That's it. It's all over now'. Then, while resisting arrest, he protested that he wasn't resisting arrest.

Cool story, bro.  Thanks for your imaginative contribution.

[John Iacoletti]

So now that we're all in agreement that Sebastian was mistaken, is there any evidence at all that Brewer heard a radio report of a policeman being shot in Oak Cliff prior to Oswald's arrest?