On The Trail Of Delusion

[Rick Plant]

Not at all. However...regarding expert forensic evidence, a panel of sound engineers, acoustical specialists and various other auditory authorities told the HSCA committee that there is a 95% chance that there was a 4th shot from the knoll area.
A whole lot more than 95% of the only one guy believers completely reject those experts.
I am skeptical.

Nothing wrong with being skeptical and just believing everything that is being told. All I'm saying is when solid evidence is presented then I will believe it over a theory that I previously believed to be true. If anybody can prove the photos  were altered with a similar method then I am always open to looking at that evidence.       

[Tom Scully]

JFK Revisited crams a lot of information into very short segments in the two-hour film and (it seems) the target audience is people who are already familiar with the basic details of the JFK assassination and the investigations that followed.

The Clay Shaw trial isn't mentioned in the film (it's only mentioned that Shaw denied working for the CIA and that the HSCA confirmed he did have a relationship with the CIA) but neither is the Tippit shooting or Gen. Walker stuff.

Less than a minute was spent on Clay Shaw so your thread title is a little ridiculous.

Many things related to the Kennedy assassination were left out due to time constraints, not dishonesty. They were required to keep the film no longer than two-hours.

An extended version will be released in February.

Shaw and Garrison were performers in a distraction OP. They played their parts read their lines, no federal reinvestigation until 1975, mission accomplished.

https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,2771.msg102070.html#msg102070


https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,3021.msg116174.html#msg116174

For us Dummies, it might be a good idea in your opening spiel to give a brief summation of where your following research leads because reading between the lines and trying to figure out what the heck you are trying to say, makes me skip a lot of your posts. Don't get me wrong I appreciate all the effort but sometimes it's just too difficult to make a link between your research and the JFK assassination.

JohnM

The late Tom Purvis pointed out that William P. Burke, CIA Southeast Domestic Contacts director since 1949,
had married a former Comus queen who was the daughter of a Comus queen and Burke's daughter was also selected by the anonymous Comus as his queen. This information is literally etched in stone on the grave memorials of those three generations.

When I checked Burke's wedding announcement, it said his best man was Brainerd Walker Spencer.
Burke's mother-in-law, wife, and daughter :
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/100653422/marietta-kittredge
Queen MKC 1900
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/100521564/frances-ivy-burke
Queen MKC 1927
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/100520469/constance-ivy-fedoroff
Queen MKC 1950

Burke's best man and Phil Strong's Princeton roommate Spencer, honoring Burke's daughter the year before
she was Comus's queen,

In 1857, Comus taught New Orleans how to parade | 300 for 300
https://www.300nola.com/portfolio-items/in_1857_comus_taught_new_orlea/
Jul 25, 2018 — Unlike Rex, Comus' identity is never revealed. The torch carriers who helped illuminate the Comus parade were the beginning of the flambeaux .

Description of Brainerd Walker Spencer (In my last post, I included three images from a Hill School, Pottstown, PA, yearbook showing that Spencer, Phil Strong, and CD Jackson were all schoolmates.)

Phil Strong was the son of Benjamin Strong, Jr. In 1954, Phil Strong, USMC reserve Captain and founder of the O.S.S. recruit training center in 1942, used his combined contacts as CIA Science Director and friend of Lockheed's Kelly Johnson, to earn Phil Strong the title of "Father of the U2".

In 1936, reserve USMC Captain Philip G Strong quit his job in banking to conduct an extended walking tour through Germany and eventually, into the Soviet Union, interviewing young people in countries on his route.
General Philip G Strong's grandson has his letters,

https://www.tor.com/2013/08/09/toby-barlow-cia-agent-babayaga/
I Never Knew My Grandfather, Only What He Pretended to Be
Aug 9, 2013 — His name is Philip Strong and he has boarded here in the Hamburg station, ... strike up an acquaintance with a fellow name Otto Fuerbringer.

Otto Fuerbringer was working in Berlin in 1936, as a correspondent for a St. Louis newspaper when he gave
Phil Strong a post olympics, tour of Berlin.

In 1963 Otto Fuerbringer was editor-in-chief at Time magazine. He likely approved Stolley's purchase of the Zapruder film. Less than four weeks later, Fuerbringer approved a Time cover and feature article of Guy de Rothschild. I guess the beginnings of the WC was "back page, stuff".

Late in 1952 :



I know a lot, but I don't know what motivated Jim Garrison or what his goals were. How can Oliver Stone, DiEugenio, or you know?

[Fred Litwin]

JFK Revisited Lays an Egg
There were several articles on the JFK assassination yesterday. My friend Alecia Long was in the Washington Post, and Tim Weiner had an excellent article in Rolling Stone. Links are in my post. Oliver Stone also had an article but it was in the Hollywood Reporter! His paranoia-riddled so-called documentary has laid an egg.

https://www.onthetrailofdelusion.com/post/jfk-revisited-lays-an-egg

[Richard Smith]

JFK Revisited Lays an Egg
There were several articles on the JFK assassination yesterday. My friend Alecia Long was in the Washington Post, and Tim Weiner had an excellent article in Rolling Stone. Links are in my post. Oliver Stone also had an article but it was in the Hollywood Reporter! His paranoia-riddled so-called documentary has laid an egg.

https://www.onthetrailofdelusion.com/post/jfk-revisited-lays-an-egg

If Stone just believed in one specific JFK conspiracy theory, that would be bad enough but he apparently accepts them all.  Hundreds or thousands of people would have to be involved in the conspiracy under Stone's interpretation of events.

[Jon Banks]

Standing ovation for Stone’s film at Cannes.

Rising User Review Ratings on IMDB and Rotten Tomatoes.

Ordinary people who have watched the film have given it rave reviews.

More proof that Film Critics and the Mainstream media in general are irrelevant today.

[Steve M. Galbraith]

If Stone just believed in one specific JFK conspiracy theory, that would be bad enough but he apparently accepts them all.  Hundreds or thousands of people would have to be involved in the conspiracy under Stone's interpretation of events.

He thinks the Cold War was a conspiracy caused by militarists in the US. Poor Uncle Joe Stalin didn't have a chance <g>. And that Hitler's rise was caused by American industrialists who funded the Nazi machine. It's always the US that is behind and the cause of every bad thing.

It's the Garrison vision of the US and the world: that is the "war machine" that was made fighting WWII took over power in the US and created a mythical communist threat to maintain power. JFK was going to end that all - Vietnam, Cuba, whatever - and it was for that they killed him.

If you believe in this then its makes sense that thousands of people were behind it all. And still are. It's why we see this odd coalition of the far left and far right who unite in a conspiracy belief. The far left sees right wing militarists and the far right see liberal internationalists behind these acts.

We've had two, three?, generations of Americans attain power since 1963. Literally tens of thousands of people have gone to Washington and in service to the government. In top positions and medium positions and throughout the bureaucracies administering policy. There is no chance - none - that these people, liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans, Kennedy haters and Kennedy lovers, would keep some large scale conspiracy quiet. None. One more time: none.

[Jon Banks]

He thinks the Cold War was a conspiracy caused by militarists in the US. Poor Uncle Joe Stalin didn't have a chance <g>. And that Hitler's rise was caused by American industrialists who funded the Nazi machine. It's always the US that is behind and the cause of every bad thing.

Just for clarification, not everyone, including myself, agrees with Stone that the entire Military Industrial Complex killed JFK due to his resistance towards escalation of US involvement in Vietnam. Stone is entitled to his own opinion but there's room for other points of view.

Beyond that, both sides are to blame for the start of the Cold War but the US is (arguably) more responsible for it lasting several decades. I'm sure there's more than one interpretation of Cold War history but the TV series you're referring to was written by Historian, Peter Kuznick. Almost all historical events have more than one interpretation and the consensus of historians can change over time. For example, President Ulysses Grant is experiencing a revival in popularity among contemporary historians after spending a century being called one of the worst US Presidents. So it seems perfectly fine and normal to read or watch Kuznick's alternative interpretations of 20th century world history.

Lastly, Stone's opinions on the MIC and US covert ops are based in reality.

It's fair to criticize how much Stone blames Defense and Financial institutions for the evils of the world but the criticisms aren't baseless. After all, it was none other than President Dwight Eisenhower who first warned about the dangers of the Military Industrial Complex and President Harry Truman after the JFK assassination who called for the CIA to be reined in.

Have you read any of the books on the Dulles brothers? They were the epitome of the "Deep State".

[Steve M. Galbraith]

Just for clarification, not everyone, including myself, agrees with Stone that the entire Military Industrial Complex killed JFK due to his resistance towards escalation of US involvement in Vietnam. Stone is entitled to his own opinion but there's room for other points of view.

Beyond that, both sides are to blame for the start of the Cold War but the US is (arguably) more responsible for it lasting several decades. I'm sure there's more than one interpretation of Cold War history but the TV series you're referring to was written by Historian, Peter Kuznick. Almost all historical events have more than one interpretation and the consensus of historians can change over time. For example, President Ulysses Grant is experiencing a revival in popularity among contemporary historians after spending a century being called one of the worst US Presidents. So it seems perfectly fine and normal to read or watch Kuznick's alternative interpretations of 20th century world history.

Lastly, Stone's opinions on the MIC and US covert ops are based in reality.

It's fair to criticize how much Stone blames Defense and Financial institutions for the evils of the world but the criticisms aren't baseless. After all, it was none other than President Dwight Eisenhower who first warned about the dangers of the Military Industrial Complex and President Harry Truman after the JFK assassination who called for the CIA to be reined in.

Have you read any of the books on the Dulles brothers? They were the epitome of the "Deep State".

Jon, you guys who suspect some sort of small "c" conspiracy involving perhaps a rogue element in the CIA should be furious at Stone's recklessness. He makes your side look foolish with all this nonsense. Instead of giving him a standing ovation you should be jeering him. The entire JFK conspiracy cause went haywire after Garrison's poison. And you've never recovered.

As to the Cold War: I think it's absolutely false to argue that the US caused the Cold War to last longer than it did. Did our policies unnecessarily contribute to it? Of course, our hands weren't clean. And absolutely false to say "both sides" caused it to start. The US dramatically dismantled the military after the war; if the MIC was so powerful how did they let that happen? It was only Stalin's betrayals at Yalta, the Red Army's occupation of Eastern Europe, the attempted subversion of the West, that caused the conflict. Why did the countries in Western Europe go along with this? It wasn't just the US that felt threatened by Moscow. We had troops there with the approval of those governments; the USSR had troops in Eastern Europe after installing puppet governments.

During the war the Soviets had hundreds of agents and assets spying on the US, infiltrating the highest levels of the government, stealing atomic secrets. Meanwhile, FDR and the US had no covert agents at all in the USSR.

Shorter: No Stalin, no Cold War. Or a much smaller version of it.

You're reading what the US did - the Dulles et cetera (cf. Dulles and Beria) - and ignoring what the Soviets and Chinese were doing that precipitated those actions. This is like Howard Zinn's history where he cites what the US did and never includes the policies of Moscow and others. I certainly don't want to re-fight the origins and causes of the Cold War here <g>.

One final note: the idea that JFK was opposed to these policies, was some sort of critic of US opposition to the Soviets is frankly groundless. I don't think there's a whiff of evidence that as Stone and Garrison argue he was going to "end" the conflict. Or pull out of Vietnam. Or make nice with Castro. That's all part of this mythical JFK as Camelot. JFK was a hard-headed realist who, yes, wanted to avoid conflict with the Soviets, but who recognized the existential danger they posed to us.