Bronson saw Hickey shoot JFK.

[Louis Earl]

Wouldn't it be something if 20 years from now it is established that JFK was shot by a Secret Service man and RFK was shot by a LA policeman?  Both by accident. 

[Mark A. Oblazney]

Of those 20 links posted above....all come up as a 'google error'--- check this before you post :-\What does that even mean?

Well, whatever it means, it sounds VERY profound.

[Marjan Rynkiewicz]

Well, whatever it means, it sounds VERY profound.

It means that the silly gunsmoke evidence that is the main basis for the silly sniper at the picket fence theory must if u apply that kind of reasoning also serve as evidence that Ruby did not shoot Oswald because no-one saw gunsmoke. And no-one shot from the 6th floor, & no-one shot Tippit, & no-one shot from Queen Mary.

I saw a claim that smoke can be seen in or near Queen Mary in Bronson's footage.
I can't see any.  If Hickey fired at B09 then we might see smoke at B10 B11 B12, & this would have to be at chest level in front of Hickey & the standing Agents, but i don’t see any such smoke. 

A patch of grass on the knoll behind Queen Mary seems to change color slightly from frame to frame, but that doesn't prove anything much.

Would an AR15 give much smoke?  I suspect that Hickey fired an auto burst of 3 shots, so praps 3 shots might make an appreciable amount of smoke.  Dunno.

Smoke evidence proves that ………………………………………………..…
(1) No-one shot from the 6th floor -- no-one saw gunsmoke.
(2) No-one shot Tippit -- no-one saw gunsmoke.
(3) No-one shot from the Queen Mary -- no-one saw gunsmoke.
(4) A shot came from the picket fence – many saw gunsmoke.
Many was called as a witness -- why wasnt no-one called? -- why wasnt No-one found guilty?

[Marjan Rynkiewicz]

I noticed something new today.  The Muchmore film is shown in the first 31 frames of the 120 frames in the Muchmore folder in Robin Unger's gallery on this website.  From frame M001 to M028 u can see the hood of Queen Mary.  At frames M029 M030 M031 u can see the driver Kinney.  He is starting to look to his right, & at frame M031 he has turned right as far as is possible without turning his body.  Unfortunately frame M031 is the last.   

What does the Nix film show?  Unfortunately frame M031 corresponds to i think Nix frame N232, & the lady with the tan coat blocks our view of Hickey in frames N231 N232 N233, & partly blocks Kinney in frames N230 N234.  But we can see that in earlier Nix frames & in later Nix frames Kinney is looking directly ahead towards the JFK limo.  The fatal shot is i think at N209, ie 23 Nix frames before Kinney's head turn at N232, ie a little over 1 second.

So, Kinney, who is keeping Queen Mary 6 ft behind the JFK limo, finds an urgent need to have a quick look to his right or rear.  Why?  Was it because Agent Ready has jumped off the running board & Agent Roberts is telling Ready to come back?  I don’t think so.  Kinney could see all of that action by just half turning to his right.  And Ready's jumping & unjumping is surely not as critical as the need to avoid squashing Agent Hill tween Queen Mary & the JFK limo.

Did Kinney turn his head hard right to get a look at Agent Landis jumping off the running board?  Landis did jump off, however i have never seen it mentioned.  Landis was standing next to the jump seats.  No, i don’t think that that was the reason.

Did Kinney turn his head hard right because Agent Hickey had fired his AR15 past Kinney's right earhole at frame M009 N209 UYB09 Z313?
Yes, the AR15 firing a shot (i reckon at least 4 shots)(an auto burst) past Kinney's right earhole would surely do the trick.  Kinney's head turn was probably a voluntary action, rather than non-voluntary, say 1 second after the shot,  but nonetheless it was fairly automatic & non-avoidable i reckon. 

What does the Bronson film tell us about Kinney's head turn?  Unfortunately the Bronson frames UYB01 to UYB20 stop at about Nix  N226, ie 6 Nix frames short of seeing Kinney's head turn at N232.  Bronson was standing on a pedestal, ie higher than Nix, hence the lady in the tan coat would not i think have blocked Bronson's view of Kinney's head.  The fatal shot was at UYB09 or a fraction earlier i think. 

U might remember that some days ago i mentioned the earlier head turn reaction by McIntyre (standing on the rear of the left running board).  He can be seen looking right in Bronson UYB04 to UYB09, ie towards Hickey, & we can assume that he is looking at Hickey because he has seen that Hickey has picked up the AR15.  The fatal shot is at about UYB09.  However unfortunately McIntyre is out of frame in the Muchmore film, hence the Muchmore film can't be used to confirm McIntyre's head turn. 
And McIntyre is out of frame in most of the Nix film.  He is only partly vizible in Nix frames N239 to N248 (we can see his head & the front half of his body).  In thems frames he is looking directly ahead.  Kinney turned his head 7 frames earlier at N232.  The fatal shot was at say N209.

Here is Muchmore M031 of 120, showing Kinney looking right.   And below that we see Nix N233 of 652 showing the lady blocking our view.
In N233 u can see under Queen Mary that Ready & Landis are both standing on the road.

[Mark A. Oblazney]

It means that the silly gunsmoke evidence that is the main basis for the silly sniper at the picket fence theory must if u apply that kind of reasoning also serve as evidence that Ruby did not shoot Oswald because no-one saw gunsmoke. And no-one shot from the 6th floor, & no-one shot Tippit, & no-one shot from Queen Mary.

You need to up your game, Marjan........ we can top this.  google 'mark o'blazney meets culto'.

you're welcome+

[Marjan Rynkiewicz]

You need to up your game, Marjan........ we can top this.  google 'mark o'blazney meets culto'.
you're welcome+

Nope. I googled that. Nothing found. Can u give me a good link.
Praps it concerns a CIA conspiracy. The only conspiracy related to the JFK accidental homicide is the coverup.
Me myself i dont spend much time on things that happened on some other day, or outside Dealey Plaza.
Oswald took about 1 day to decide to kill JFK. He probly had a suicidal half-baked escape plan. He fired 2 shots.
Hickey accidentally shot JFK.
There was no CIA or FBI or Johnson or Mafia or Castro conspiracy, except for the coverup.
No sniper at the picket fence, or in a drain, or somewhere.

[Walt Cakebread]

Yes all of that supports my wordage that no-one saw (reported seeing) gunsmoke at the 6th floor.

However gunsmoke was seen near Queen Mary, because i suppose that there is always a little observable smoke, & as i have said in another thread Hickey fired an auto burst of 3 shots hence 3 lots of a little smoke. 

Re Dillard that article says twice that Dillard observed gunsmoke when in fact he hadnt -- smelling gunsmoke should not be called observing gunsmoke. 
And the timing of Dillard smelling gunsmoke is wrong. He could not have smelled gunsmoke until much later when the wind carried it from the location of Queen Mary at B09, or until he met the smell say halfway or something.

no-one saw (reported seeing) gunsmoke at the 6th floor.


That's because there were no shots fired from the SE corner window on the 6th floor.   And there were also no shots fired from the Queen Mary....

[Marjan Rynkiewicz]

no-one saw (reported seeing) gunsmoke at the 6th floor. That's because there were no shots fired from the SE corner window on the 6th floor.   And there were also no shots fired from the Queen Mary....

It would take weeks to read all of the reports books statements etc, 99% of it contradictory. Most of the witness statements are clearly worthless-misleading-wrong-lies, & we must decide which are true, & the rare true bits are hidden in the middle of rubbish.
Oswald fired at Z105 (hit signal arm) & Z218 (the magic bullet).
Hickey fired at Z300 to Z312 (an accidental auto burst of at least 4 shots).
In this thread & in others i have pointed out that Hickey's shots caused reactions by Agents Kinney & McIntyre & Bennett.
I have shown that Hickey could shoot JFK without having to stand fully up. 
I have shown that the Bronson film shows Hickey with an AR15 less than a second after Z313. 

We cant add anything to this saga unless we can get access to the superior 2019 copy of Bronson's 26 frames, the 20 2017 frames in Robin Unger's gallery here are very blurry. I doubt that the Museum will allow Robin to show the 2019 frames.  At present the Museum are happy to allow the public to believe that one of the 2017 Bronson frames shows that Hickey was holding his AR15 upwards at 45 deg at Z313.  However even without the help of the 2019 frames it is obvious that that frame is well after Z313. There must be some other reason why the Museum wont make the 2019 frames public.

Re gunsmoke, my comments were made in jest. In fact in addition to the many witnesses who smelled gunsmoke in Elm St there were many who said that they saw gunsmoke near Queen Mary at the time of the shots.  I had thort that the AR15 was set in burst mode which automatically fires 3 shots, but i found that there was no burst mode on the 601 model in 1963. It did have auto mode which fired at i think 400 rpm while the trigger is pressed or until u run out of ammo.

The AR15 was used for the first time on that Friday, & by lunchtime had killed the President & was never used again -- where is it today. 

Some mentions of smoke are confusing & cant be related to gunpowder, eg the word smoke was unfortunately also used to describe the explosion of JFK's head, & to describe the debris etc kicked up by bullets hitting the road & concrete.