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Author Topic: Et tu, Bonnie?  (Read 67602 times)

Offline Richard Smith

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Re: Et tu, Bonnie?
« Reply #248 on: April 14, 2021, 02:36:24 PM »
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Why didn't Frazier hear all the metal pieces jangling around in the bag?

Did the rifle have to be completely disassembled as shown in that photo to fit the bag?  What could be the fewest pieces that the rifle could have been in to fit the bag? 
« Last Edit: April 14, 2021, 02:56:10 PM by Richard Smith »

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Re: Et tu, Bonnie?
« Reply #248 on: April 14, 2021, 02:36:24 PM »


Offline Dan O'meara

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Re: Et tu, Bonnie?
« Reply #249 on: April 14, 2021, 02:52:46 PM »
I don't believe there are any answers to be found anywhere near Dealey Plaza. I've avoided reading almost all JFK Assassination "research" supported books and I think if any evidence proving a cover up exists in the Zapruder film, it would have resolved some issues by now, but what has it resolved? My point is it is counterproductive compared to the many things easily proven.

Dan, I was old enough on the day after JFK was assassinated, to cut an image of Oswald out of the front page of the local newspaper and take it to a friend's house where it was mounted on a dart board, the face in the image covering the bulls eye of the dart board.

Then, I lived my life, I had a neighorhood newspaper delivery route a few years after 1963 until just after Garrison brought the JFK Assassination back into the news. I usually read the first section of the newspaper I delivered, every day.
After that, there was plenty to distract me from focus on JFK until 2008, when I read this.:

This is a reprint of an article with identical details published before the Nov., 2008 election.
https://www.jpost.com/Magazine/Features/Mr-Obamas-neighborhood
"...According to lore, when Minow called a partner in his firm to recommend he meet with Obama during a visit to Harvard, the partner told him he had already been hired for a summer internship.Obama's experience at the Sidley Austin firm, where he soon got to know Minow, a former Federal Communications Commission chairman (as well as his future wife, Michelle Robinson), was crucial in introducing Obama to leading local Jewish figures like the billionaire Crown. Crown first became acquainted with the young associate after Minow suggested he meet this "special" guy who "is going places." And indeed, Crown describes him as "brilliant" and "a quick study," though he does not pretend to have pictured Obama sitting in the Oval Office during their early encounters.These kinds of introductions proved key for Obama's construction of a network which would eventually support his political aspirations. The Crown family, for instance, have been major financial backers, with Lester's son James serving as Obama's Illinois finance chairman.".."

I did some research and then wrote these two blog posts.
https://postbushera.blogspot.com/2008/
"....    https://www.sfgate.com/business/article/ON-ECONOMICS-How-Kennedy-Assassination-2958771.php

    ON ECONOMICS: -- How Kennedy Assassination Affected Some Stock Prices
    JONATHAN MARSHALL
    Monday, November 18, 1996
    ....But the facts speak tellingly about how accidents of history can affect great fortunes.
    A postscript for assassination buffs: No individual stood to lose more from the TFX scandal than Chicago investor Henry Crown, who owned 20 percent of General Dynamics. His personal attorney, Albert Jenner, became a senior staff attorney on the Warren Commission, in charge of investigating the possibility of a conspiracy.In later years, Jenner also represented Chicago labor racketeer Allen Dorfman. Dorfman's stepfather Paul, a leading figure in the Chicago mob, ran the Waste Handlers Union in Chicago in 1939 with Jack Ruby, Lee Harvey Oswald's future killer.
    Both Dorfmans hated the Kennedy family. Robert Kennedy had hauled them before a Senate crime panel in the late 1950s, where they took the Fifth Amendment.
    Allen Dorfman was murdered, gangland-style, in 1983 in the company of another friend of Ruby, Irwin Weiner. Attorney Jenner obtained Weiner's acquittal in a 1975 federal labor racketeering case after the government's leading witness was shotgunned to death.
    Weiner was called to testify in 1978 before the House Select Committee on Assassinations about his relationship with Ruby, including a phone conversation with Ruby shortly before the assassination. He said the call was innocent.
    The committee was investigating the theory -- which it never proved -- that organized crime had Ruby silence Oswald to disguise its own role in the Kennedy assassination....."

Intrigued by what I read in the above article, I searched for confirmation: ..."

My second blog post.:
https://postbushera.blogspot.com/2010/01/14-months-later-revisiting-this-blog.html
"....Consider that behind the following “mother of all cover ups”, is the family of Obama’s earliest and wealthiest backer. The crux of the following are the indications that Tom Clark heard in 1946, details of the background of the man whose son he hired as his SCOTUS clerk in 1956, and that Clark is named as vouching for that man’s lawyer to serve as senior investigative counsel to determine if there was a conspiracy to assassinate the president.

Not only did the FBI keep from the Warren Commission, every detail described by Sy Hersh about former FBI SA, IB Hale and his twin sons in the 1962, FBI observed burglary of Judith Exner's Los Angeles apartment, ..."

A month after writing the first blog post, I joined the Education Forum, JFK Debate in 2009, later became a moderator there, and in 2015, the comments editor of jfkfacts.org .

One thing I am sure of is "people in high places" did not want the public to know what actually happened, Marina Porter was "gagged" until 1978.... 14 years... Priscilla steered Marina to this guy.:

'4'''-*t4*tttkiO Marina Oswald - Hood College
http://jfk.hood.edu/Collection/Weisberg%20Subject%20Index%20Files/M%20Disk/McMillan%20Priscilla%20Marina%20&%20Lee/Item%2013.pdf
Marina's New York agent, Perry Knowlton, and Harper and Row editors have forbidden her to discuss the up- coming book without their permission for at least a year after its publication.

Facts are that a cousin of Allen Dulles was the last person to see Priscilla's father alive and reported him "missing" and Priscilla used here father's death to the HSCA as an excuse for taking 14 years to finish and publish her book, Marina & Lee!

https://archive.is/esTuB
....
https://archive.is/o/esTuB/www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=95330&relPageId=42


Hi Tom,

With all respect. your post is wasted on someone like me.
You're so far down the line on this case it's not even funny and I'm still stuck in Dealey Plaza.
I'm sure more senior researchers understand your post but I'm struggling.
What I will say is this - as far as I'm concerned the majority of those who were on the 6th floor that morning are clearly lying between their original statements and their WC testimonies. I find this significant.
The main man is Bill Shelley and it is clear, to me at least, that Billy Lovelady is parroting what Shelley is telling him to say. They both neglect to mention their trip down towards the railroad yard in their original statements. They both neglect to mention they re-enter the TSBD by the west door, instead they both seem to say they re-enter the TSBD by the front door. In their WC testimonies they both introduce the 3 minute timestamp for when Baker arrives.
Dougherty, Norman, Williams and Givens are also lying.
Why?

As for the Z-film. It cannot be used to demonstrate a cover-up but it is highly significant. I doubt there is a single CTer (myself included) who was not influenced by the "back and to the left" motion of JFK after the headshot. It was quite a slow and difficult path for me to come to the realisation that this motion was actually caused by a shot from behind (see my "Unseeing the Headshot" thread). Once this is realised the only aspect of the Z-film that seems to demonstrate 'conspiracy' disappears. The Z-film is consistent with at least two shots coming from the general direction of the TSBD.

Offline Dan O'meara

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Re: Et tu, Bonnie?
« Reply #250 on: April 14, 2021, 02:54:55 PM »
Did the rifle have to be completely disassembled as shown in that photo into multiple parts or just shortened by removing the barrel?  What could be the fewest pieces that the rifle could have been in to fit the bag?

Good call.
This sounds like a job for Walt Cakebread.

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Re: Et tu, Bonnie?
« Reply #250 on: April 14, 2021, 02:54:55 PM »


Offline Colin Crow

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Re: Et tu, Bonnie?
« Reply #251 on: April 14, 2021, 03:45:21 PM »
Did the rifle have to be completely disassembled as shown in that photo to fit the bag?  What could be the fewest pieces that the rifle could have been in to fit the bag?

I’m sure you will find the answer in the WCR......it was an exhaustive investigation after all wasn’t it.

Offline Colin Crow

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Re: Et tu, Bonnie?
« Reply #252 on: April 14, 2021, 03:48:56 PM »
Why didn't Frazier hear all the metal pieces jangling around in the bag?

How was the open end secured on the back seat? Just a 2” fold over securing the stock......really? Maybe it was closest to the door.

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Re: Et tu, Bonnie?
« Reply #252 on: April 14, 2021, 03:48:56 PM »


Offline Colin Crow

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Re: Et tu, Bonnie?
« Reply #253 on: April 14, 2021, 03:52:49 PM »
Excellent analysis Colin.

When Truly and Baker reach the 5th, the west elevator is gone. The only real option is that Dougherty has taken it.
Either Dougherty was on the fifth when he took the west elevator down to the first floor before Truly and Baker arrived.
Dougherty called the west elevator to the 6th floor then took it down to the 1st floor before Truly and Baker arrived.
Dougherty called the west elevator to the 6th which is where it was when Truly and Baker arrived. After they reached the roof Dougherty took the west elevator down to the first floor.

My guess is the latter. He went up to the sixth to investigate. Then came down to the first.

Offline Richard Smith

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Re: Et tu, Bonnie?
« Reply #254 on: April 14, 2021, 04:01:02 PM »
I’m sure you will find the answer in the WCR......it was an exhaustive investigation after all wasn’t it.

Yes, if they had only fixated more on chicken sandwiches and measuring Oswald's arm pits we would know the truth.  What does "disassembled" mean in this context?  It appears to relate only to the rifle's length to fit the bag.  Could that be done just by removing the barrel etc? 

Offline Dan O'meara

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Re: Et tu, Bonnie?
« Reply #255 on: April 14, 2021, 04:08:21 PM »
How was the open end secured on the back seat? Just a 2” fold over securing the stock......really? Maybe it was closest to the door.

From the analysis of the bag's construction it seems clear that the open end was secured by folding the bag over at the strong fold nearest the open end and tucking this flap under the package as it lay on the seat. Otherwise it would be carried in such a fashion that the flap is secured by the carrying hand.

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Et tu, Bonnie?
« Reply #255 on: April 14, 2021, 04:08:21 PM »