Why are the CT's so obsessed with disproving the innocent Bus and Cab rides?

[Walt Cakebread]

Depends on what exactly you mean by "Oswald's cab ride" and "fake".

I doubt you have a clue what you're trying to establish.

Unclear what "fake" entails, see above.

Irrelevant once it was in evidence.

It didn't at the time they introduced it.

Officially he found them, indirectly, but there are conflicting reports.

Did anyone tell you otherwise?

Unknown, based on the available evidence

Hi Otto, Perhaps you can help me find a piece of information.....

I was thumbing through the WR and I read Secret Service Inspector Thomas Kelley's report of 11-23-63..(Page 626 WR)

Quote:  " Fritz asked him if he had ridden a taxi that day, and Oswald then changed his story and said that when he got on the bus he  found that it was going too slow, and after two blocks he got off the bus and took a cab to his home.  He passed the time with the cab driver and the cab driver had told him that the president was shot.  He paid a cab fare of 85 cents. "  Unquote

He passed the time with the cab driver and the cab driver had told him that the president was shot.

This driver knew that JFK had been shot....Whereas Bill whaley had no clue about what was happening....  He said that he asked his passenger who was wearing a BLUE JACKET " What's all the sirens about"    And his passenger didn't respond, or answer the question.

Two things leap out at me....  First off .... Lee said that his cab driver told him that JFK had been shot.... (Something that Bill Whaley didn't know)

And secondly Whaley said that his passenger was not talkative.....Whereas Lee said that he and the cab driver talked as they rode along.   

Lee also told Kelley that he took a cab to his home ( not a half mile past his home)  and he paid the driver 85 cents.   85 cents would have been the correct fare from the bus station to the intersection of Zangs and Beckley.

PS ....Perhaps you can help me find a piece of information.....  I believe that Lee told one of the interrogators that he took a bus to the theater....But I haven't been able to verify this.

[Dan O'meara]

"Looking at it the other way - why would the hoaxers use Whaley if he was undermining the story they were trying to invent?"

Ask them.

I'm asking you.
You're the one who's saying Oswald's cab ride was faked.
You're the one who's saying someone invented this faked cab ride
And now you're being asked to defend this Hoax you've been promoting you just disappear.
Because you've never really thought about it and you're being found out.

You don't have a clue about Oswald's movements after the assassination.
Not the first clue.

[Dan O'meara]

Hi Otto, Perhaps you can help me find a piece of information.....

I was thumbing through the WR and I read Secret Service Inspector Thomas Kelley's report of 11-23-63..(Page 626 WR)

Quote:  " Fritz asked him if he had ridden a taxi that day, and Oswald then changed his story and said that when he got on the bus he  found that it was going too slow, and after two blocks he got off the bus and took a cab to his home.  He passed the time with the cab driver and the cab driver had told him that the president was shot.  He paid a cab fare of 85 cents. "  Unquote

He passed the time with the cab driver and the cab driver had told him that the president was shot.

This driver knew that JFK had been shot....Whereas Bill whaley had no clue about what was happening....  He said that he asked his passenger who was wearing a BLUE JACKET " What's all the sirens about"    And his passenger didn't respond, or answer the question.

Two things leap out at me....  First off .... Lee said that his cab driver told him that JFK had been shot.... (Something that Bill Whaley didn't know)

And secondly Whaley said that his passenger was not talkative.....Whereas Lee said that he and the cab driver talked as they rode along.   

Lee also told Kelley that he took a cab to his home ( not a half mile past his home)  and he paid the driver 85 cents.   85 cents would have been the correct fare from the bus station to the intersection of Zangs and Beckley.

PS ....Perhaps you can help me find a piece of information.....  I believe that Lee told one of the interrogators that he took a bus to the theater....But I haven't been able to verify this.

How do you think Oswald got to his rooming house after leaving the TSBD Walt?

[Walt Cakebread]

How do you think Oswald got to his rooming house after leaving the TSBD Walt?

I'm not sure that he was on Cecil Mc Watters bus....Bledsoe was mentally incompetent.. ( she may have had Altzheimers)

And Mc Watters said that he was thinking of another passenger who laughed when he told Mc Watters that JFK had been shot in the head.

But .... There is the transfer that Mc Watter's said he issued that allegedly was found in Lee's shirt pocket.    But ...I do believe that Lee rode in a CITY cab from the Greyhound bus depot to the intersection of Beckley & Zangs......

[John Mytton]

How do you think Oswald got to his rooming house after leaving the TSBD Walt?

Don't expect an answer anytime this century, this is the very meat and potatoes of my thread question, the reason they are so obsessed with disproving the bus and cab rides is that they can't move forward because they are stuck in a classic "KookLoop", they lack the deductive reasoning skills to formulate an alternative so they just keep repeating the same nonsense again and again and again, since their very first posts they ignore all the powerful evidence presented as refutation and still haven't moved forward one iota.
This discussion will never get off first base and for some reason these ignorant "researchers" are happy to just stay there and pretend that they are Defence Lawyers so as to continually create chaos and achieve nothing.

JohnM

[Walt Cakebread]

Don't expect an answer anytime this century, this is the very meat and potatoes of my thread question, the reason they are so obsessed with disproving the bus and cab rides is that they can't move forward because they are stuck in a classic "KookLoop", they lack the deductive reasoning skills to formulate an alternative so they just keep repeating the same nonsense again and again and again, since their very first posts they ignore all the powerful evidence presented as refutation and still haven't moved forward one iota.
This discussion will never get off first base and for some reason these ignorant "researchers" are happy to just stay there and pretend that they are Defence Lawyers so as to continually create chaos and achieve nothing.

JohnM

Psssst Johnny....  Did you just wake up from your nappy?.....  I've already answered Dan's question.....Just wipe the stuff from your eyes and read my posts....

[John Mytton]

What does Whaley's manifest tell you?



This is how you answer a direct question.

Looking at the above manifest, in particular entry #14, the first thing to notice is the "P" in the left hand column. This indicates the fare was a 'pick-up'. 8 of Whaley's fares that day were 'pick-ups' and 13 were 'calls'. If the passenger was Oswald fleeing the TSBD we would expect him to be a 'pick up'.
The next relevant column tells us the pick-up point was 'Greyhound'. This is a reference to the Greyhound bus station at 207 Lamar Street. Whaley was parked on Lamar close to Jackson. He spotted 'Oswald' approaching south on Lamar. This is the direction we would expect Oswald to be approaching from if he'd abandoned the bus on Elm St.
The next column tells us the destination was '500 No. Beckley', the 500 block on North Beckley Avenue (note no specific house number is given). This is the street Oswald lives on, so the fare travels from close to the TSBD to close to 1026 North Beckley. This is what we would expect if it is Oswald. That he gets dropped off past his address is easily explained as someone on the run wanting to check if anyone is waiting for him outside where he lives.
The next column reports the fare as 95 cents (incorrectly reported as 85 cents by Fritz)
The next column indicates it was a single passenger as we would expect if it was Oswald.
The next two columns record the time picked up and dropped off. It must be noted that all the figures in these two columns are estimations. This is clear by the fact all the numbers are rounded up to either 5 or 0. The 8 fares between 11:00am and 2:45pm are all given in 15 minute blocks. This tallies with Whaley's account of not using a watch and estimating his times. The best we can say is that Whaley picks up this fare somewhere between 12:30pm and 12:45pm. As we would expect if it was Oswald after abandoning the bus.
The next two columns indicate that the distance travelled was 3 miles. All the figures in these columns are also rounded up. The actual distance of the trip is 2.6 miles and takes around 7 minutes.

There is nothing in Whaley's manifest that is inconsistent with the account of Oswald catching a cab after abandoning the bus.

The question is - why would anyone want to fake the bus ride and cab ride? What's the point? Why not just fake one or the other?
And if you believe they are fake then how did he get to the rooming house?

Agreed, even though the miles travelled are inconsistent, the time slots are generally in 15 minute increments, except that is for those times when Whaley has to shoehorn in an extra journey which is totally consistent with a man who didn't use a watch and as he says "I don't put the correct time on the sheet because they don't require it, sir, but anywhere approximate." and to just reinforce his guessing and that it isn't that important, is that he says "sometimes I make three or four trips before I make the entries."

Another interesting fact is that besides Whaley's passenger only giving the destination, this passenger doesn't say a word in response to being asked about the "the police cars, the sirens was going, running crisscrossing everywhere, just a big uproar in that end of town and I said, "What the hell. I wonder what the hell is the uproar?" And he never said anything." While not conclusive this arrogant behaviour is typical Oswald.

When Oswald got in the cab shortly after getting off the bus for the trip to Oak Cliff, and the cab drove off, the cabdriver, seeing all the police cars crisscrossing everywhere with their sirens screaming, said to Oswald, “I wonder what the hell is the uproar?” The cabdriver said Oswald “never said anything.” Granted, there are people who are very stingy with their words, and this nonresponse by Oswald, by itself, is not conclusive of his guilt. But ask yourself this: If a thousand people were put in Oswald’s place in the cab, particularly if they, like Oswald, were at the scene of the assassination in Dealey Plaza and knew what had happened, how many do you suppose wouldn’t have said one single word in response to the cabby’s question
Vincent Bugliosi Reclaiming History

JohnM