Oswald: No power lunch

[Martin Weidmann]

Mr Shelley, within a couple of hours of the shooting, specifically remembered running into Ms Calvery out at the corner of the park. This is not an incomplete version of the story he would later tell, it is a different story.

Mr. BALL - Then what happened?
Mr. SHELLEY - Gloria Calvary from South-Western Publishing Co. ran back up there crying and said "The President has been shot" and Billy Lovelady and myself took off across the street to that little, old island and we stopped there for a minute.

So all he left out in his testimony was calling his wife. You could say it's a different story, but to me it's just a witness leaving out a minor detail he actually simply might not have remembered on the stand several months later.

I'm not sure where you want to go with this, but I don't see it going anywhere fast.

[Alan Ford]

My theory works ok if T/B took at least 88 sec to meet Oswald on the 2nd floor.

Your theory works if Officer Baker doesn't describe a different encounter in his same-day affidavit. Another way of putting this is that your theory doesn't work.

[Alan Ford]

Mr. BALL - Then what happened?
Mr. SHELLEY - Gloria Calvary from South-Western Publishing Co. ran back up there crying and said "The President has been shot" and Billy Lovelady and myself took off across the street to that little, old island and we stopped there for a minute.

So all he left out in his testimony was calling his wife. You could say it's a different story, but to me it's just a witness leaving out a minor detail he actually simply might not have remembered on the stand several months later.

Huh? How do you reconcile the following two accounts from Mr Shelley?

ACCOUNT A: “I ran across the street to a corner of the park and ran into a girl crying and she said the president had been shot. This girl's name is Gloria Calvery"
ACCOUNT B: "Gloria Calvary from South-Western Publishing Co. ran back up there crying and said "The President has been shot" and Billy Lovelady and myself took off across the street to that little, old island and we stopped there for a minute."

I'm not sure where you want to go with this, but I don't see it going anywhere fast.

I'm only going where Mr Shelley goes fast---------across the street to a corner of the park, where he runs into Ms Calvery. Why did he change this perfectly straightforward story?

[Martin Weidmann]

Huh? How do you reconcile the following two accounts from Mr Shelley?

ACCOUNT A: “I ran across the street to a corner of the park and ran into a girl crying and she said the president had been shot. This girl's name is Gloria Calvery"
ACCOUNT B: "Gloria Calvary from South-Western Publishing Co. ran back up there crying and said "The President has been shot" and Billy Lovelady and myself took off across the street to that little, old island and we stopped there for a minute."

Easy... Human failure in accurate recollection and the elapse of time between the first and the second statement, giving Shelley the time to gather his thoughts.

I'm only going where Mr Shelley goes fast---------across the street to a corner of the park, where he runs into Ms Calvery. Why did he change this perfectly straightforward story?

The corner of the park and the little old island across the street could easily be the same thing described differently on two separate occassions.

Again, I'm still not sure where you are going with this, but as far as I am concerned it's not a significant matter one way or the other.

[Alan Ford]

Easy... Human failure in accurate recollection and the elapse of time between the first and the second statement, giving Shelley the time to gather his thoughts.

But the elapse of time favors the reliability of the earlier memory. To argue otherwise is to resort to the kind of special pleading one more usually associates with the Warren Gullibles we both despise.

How could Mr Shelley possibly have had a false memory, as of ca. 2pm on 11/22, of running out to the corner of the park and running into the woman at whose wedding he had only recently been best man? Absurd!

The corner of the park and the little old island across the street could easily be the same thing described differently on two separate occassions.

They are the same thing, only here they feature in two incompatible stories.

Again, I'm still not sure where you are going with this, but as far as I am concerned it's not a significant matter one way or the other.

It may be highly significant that Mr Shelley changed his story of his immediate post-shooting movements

 

[Martin Weidmann]

But the elapse of time favors the reliability of the earlier memory. To argue otherwise is to resort to the kind of special pleading one more usually associates with the Warren Gullibles we both despise.

How could Mr Shelley possibly have had a false memory, as of ca. 2pm on 11/22, of running out to the corner of the park and running into the woman at whose wedding he had only recently been best man? Absurd!

They are the same thing, only here they feature in two incompatible stories.

It may be highly significant that Mr Shelley changed his story of his immediate post-shooting movements

 

It may be highly significant that Mr Shelley changed his story of his immediate post-shooting movements

Care to explain?

[Alan Ford]

It may be highly significant that Mr Shelley changed his story of his immediate post-shooting movements

Care to explain?

Because it shows that he's lying, which shows that he has something he wishes to hide. The question then becomes: what is it he wishes to hide?

[Dan O'meara]

Given the WC established the fact Adams and Styles left the fourth floor considerably later than they suggested. The Stroud document looses all credibility. The Stroud document contained two pieces of info. Garner said she saw Truly and Baker ascend the stairs, and Adams and Styles leave the fourth floor. She probably saw both events but places them in the wrong order. It is understandable that the WC would place no importance in the document given they established approximate times to Styles and Adams movements by establishing known times and locations to their encounters with officers and radio transmissions, and testimonies of the movements of fellow employees.

"She probably saw both events but places them in the wrong order"

How could Garner see Truly and the police officer come up the stairs first if she followed Adams and Styles out of the office and heard them go down the stairs?
If Truly came up the stairs first Garner would still have been stood at the fourth floor window with Adams Styles and Dorman.