Oswald: No power lunch

[Mitch Todd]

The clip below shows the moment Sawyer takes Brennan to the car.
In the background the large gates of the TSBD are closed.
In the Martin film these gates are open.
This seems to back up the assertion that the pic of Brennan in the car was at some point just before Sawyer makes the call with the suspect's description.



LATER EDIT:

In the above clip there are two police officers. I am very confident the one with the cigarette in his hand is Sawyer.
The other, judging by the insignia on his sleeve, is a sergeant. Could this be Sergeant Howard? If not, then maybe Harkness.

I can't see that it would be Howard. At 12:40, he's told to stay at his location on Industrial. His duties are attached to the motorcade route, so he's near the Trade Mart. Even if he left immediately after that broadcast, it would take several minutes to get to Elm and Houston, dismount, and hoof it to the front of the TSBD in time for the film to be taken.

[Dan O'meara]

The clip below shows the moment Sawyer takes Brennan to the car.
In the background the large gates of the TSBD are closed.
In the Martin film these gates are open.
This seems to back up the assertion that the pic of Brennan in the car was at some point just before Sawyer makes the call with the suspect's description.



LATER EDIT:

In the above clip there are two police officers. I am very confident the one with the cigarette in his hand is Sawyer.
The other, judging by the insignia on his sleeve, is a sergeant. Could this be Sergeant Howard? If not, then maybe Harkness.

The sergeant in the above clip is not Harkness.
In the still below, taken from the Martin film, Harkness does not have a patch on his shoulder but the sergeant in the film does have one:



How many sergeants were on duty that day?

LATER EDIT:

What's the difference between the officers in the white caps and those in the black caps?

[Dan O'meara]

The one in the midground looks to be a traffic division guy. The one in the immediate foreground on the right is a patrol division officer. 
I double checked the various Lumpkin/Batchelor/Lawrence exhibits, just to make sure there wasn't a second Sgt Howard in the DPD. There was indeed only one Sgt Howard. There was a Ptm Howard in the patrol division, but he wouldn't fit Barnett's description. I also looked at the normal November assignments/org chart in Batchelor  ex. 5002. Barnett wasn't under Howard or in even in the same subdivision as Howard. Barnett was also not normally under Harkness, nor in the same group. Barnett doesn't appear to have been assigned to the 11/22 motorcade no parking group working under Howard. Given this, there seems to be no reason for Barnett to refer to Howard as "my sergeant" in any case. Which leads to the question, what is he really describing? Did he just misname someone else? Or is he conflating one event with another that happened much later?

If that is Sawyer and Brennan in the car, do you think that the photo would have been taken at about the time that Sawyer radioed in with the first description of the suspect in the shooting at 12:44? And what would that mean for Barnett's timing?

"I also looked at the normal November assignments/org chart in Batchelor  ex. 5002. Barnett wasn't under Howard or in even in the same subdivision as Howard. Barnett was also not normally under Harkness, nor in the same group. Barnett doesn't appear to have been assigned to the 11/22 motorcade no parking group working under Howard."

Had a quick look through Batchelor's Personnel Assignment list (Ex 5002) myself and came across this:



According to this list Barnett was assigned to Traffic Division, third platoon, under sergeant Campbell. This platoon started their assignment at 3:00 PM and finished at 11:00 PM.
But we know Barnet was on assignment before 3:00 PM as he was present for the assassination at 12:30 PM. Barnett makes this clear in his WC testimony:

"We made detail around 9 o'clock. We were instructed to be at our assignments at 10. We were given our assignments, each one was given an assignment, and I was told to watch the crowd, watch for people throwing stuff from the crowd at the President's party, to keep the traffic clear, and to stop the traffic when the President came by. Then when the President came by, I heard three shots."

Barnett is at his given assignment at 10:00 PM. This means he was actually with the second platoon whose assignment was from 10:00 PM until 6:00 PM.
The sergeant of the second platoon was E B Howard.
So Howard was Barnett's sergeant that day.

[Dan O'meara]

Jim Murray took photos from the grassy infield that include Marilyn Sitzman when she was interviewed by a news reporter near the Zapruder pedestal. He then took a series of close up photos of the action about the south Elm storm drain from 12:39-12:40 (Trask “That Day in Dallas”). From there Murray climbed the south knoll near the triple underpass, at approximately 10:40-10:41. Then he followed the action at the TSBD doorway, capturing the image of Howard Brennan standing at the doorway’s east wall. I estimate that time could be about 12:41-12:42. Robin Unger’s photo site includes this photo with a print media caption indicating 12:42. This photo does not appear to yet include Marilyn Sitzman at the sidewalk corner in two photos Murray took at this time.

https://www.jfkassassinationgallery.com/albums/userpics/10001/normal_10435.jpg
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,2013.msg54679.html#msg54679
https://www.jfkassassinationgallery.com/albums/userpics/10001/normal_Murray.jpg

There is a batch of Murray pics taken where the Elm St extension runs into the car park towards the railroad tracks. In this one I believe we see Amos Euins (circled):

host pictures


This puts this pic at before 12:36 PM when wee see Euins being whisked away from this area by Harkness in the Martin film. Here is a Murray pic of the area we see Harkness taking Euins away. Not the large gates of the TSBD are open:



The reason I keep mentioning the large gates is because of Mooney's testimony:

"Mr. Ball.
Were the doors open?

Mr. Mooney.
They were wide open, the big gates. So I grabbed one, and we swung them to, and there was a citizen there, and I put him on orders to keep them shut, because I don't recall whether there was a lock on them or not. Didn't want to lock them because you never know what might happen.
So he stood guard, I assume, until a uniformed officer took over.
We shut the back door--there was a back door on a little dock. And then we went in through the docks, through the rear entrance."

It is safe to assume that at the time of the assassination these gates were open until Mooney had them closed. The Murray pics above are before the gates are closed, the Alyea clip of Sawyer escorting Brennan to the car is after the gates are closed, so the gates provide a very basic timestamp. Kind of.

[James Hackerott]

There is a batch of Murray pics taken where the Elm St extension runs into the car park towards the railroad tracks. In this one I believe we see Amos Euins (circled):

host pictures


This puts this pic at before 12:36 PM when wee see Euins being whisked away from this area by Harkness in the Martin film. Here is a Murray pic of the area we see Harkness taking Euins away. Not the large gates of the TSBD are open:



The reason I keep mentioning the large gates is because of Mooney's testimony:

"Mr. Ball.
Were the doors open?

Mr. Mooney.
They were wide open, the big gates. So I grabbed one, and we swung them to, and there was a citizen there, and I put him on orders to keep them shut, because I don't recall whether there was a lock on them or not. Didn't want to lock them because you never know what might happen.
So he stood guard, I assume, until a uniformed officer took over.
We shut the back door--there was a back door on a little dock. And then we went in through the docks, through the rear entrance."

It is safe to assume that at the time of the assassination these gates were open until Mooney had them closed. The Murray pics above are before the gates are closed, the Alyea clip of Sawyer escorting Brennan to the car is after the gates are closed, so the gates provide a very basic timestamp. Kind of.

Jim Murray captured the closed gate from the south knoll at about 10:40-10:41. The 3D renderings show the perspective view of the open versus closed gate, from an approximate location of Murray.

[Dan O'meara]

Jim Murray captured the closed gate from the south knoll at about 10:40-10:41. The 3D renderings show the perspective view of the open versus closed gate, from an approximate location of Murray.

That's a great spot James but how do you know it's around 12:40 - 12:41 PM

[Dan O'meara]

In the Dillard pic below the red arrow points out the space where the "red gates" are (slightly obscured by, what I assume is, the Stemmons sign).
We can't see the diamond pattern on the gates because they are wide open so it is just a black space.



In the Allen pic below the same space is pointed out by a red arrow.
Again, we can't see the diamond pattern on the gates so they are wide open.
The difference in this pic is that the Hertz clock reads 12:40




So we know the gates were open at 12:40
This means the film clip above with Sawyer and Brennan was definitely after 12:40 PM as the gates are closed.

[James Hackerott]

That's a great spot James but how do you know it's around 12:40 - 12:41 PM

Thanks Dan,
I put the time at 12:40-12:41 based on the Murray photo taken sometime after the clock struck 12:40 and Murray could have reached the south knoll area by 12:41. And that time range fits with the Murray photo of the TSBD south face at 12:42.

My peristyle wall shadow study is consistent with 12:41. See my 2019 post about using the peristyle wall shadow for time estimates from 12:30 on for at least 15 minutes.
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,2013.msg54679.html#msg54679

I seem to be miss-remembering Mooney or someone else mentioning the time of the gate closing at 12:40. I had no luck today finding such a reference though.

Your finding the Allen photo taken at 12:40 showing the gate open is a good info.