The lapel flip -- what did i miss?

[Michael T. Griffith]

https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/Lattimer.txt

One of the central assertions of the conspirati is that it would be
impossible for a single bullet to make as many wounds, hit as much
bone, and emerge as unscathed as CE399, the "magic bullet," is alleged
to have done. Harold Weisberg stated this view for the umpteenth time in
a letter to the Washington Post, January 11, 1992:

   It [is] a physical impossibility for this magic bullet [CE399]
   to have the imagined career indispensable to the lone-assassin
   "solution"...there is nothing like this career in science or
   mythology.

In "Conspiracy" (pp. 69-70), Anthony Summers repeats the assertion using
dissident pathologist Cyril Wecht for support:

   Above all, [Cyril Wecht] refuses to believe that a bullet could
   emerge almost intact after causing as much bone damage as was done
   to the Governor. To demonstrate this, Wecht points to the condition
   of Mannlicher-Carcano ammunition after firing into cotton wadding,
   a goat carcass--which sustained a broken rib--and through the wrist
   of a corpse. All the test bullets are visibly more damaged than the
   bullet alleged to have caused the wounds to the President and the
   Governor.  Wecht deplores the fact that the Assassinations
   Committee did not try to reproduce the "magic bullet" by performing
   similar tests and has challenged his colleagues to produce even
   *one* bullet that had emerged similarly undamaged.

Wecht's challenge has now been met by Dr. Lattimer. It has been proven
that a single bullet could make all the wounds and break all the bone
and emerge as relatively unscathed as CE399. Therefore, the long-held
assertion of the conspirati must now be completely discarded as evidence
of conspiracy. Lattimer's experiment is described in the following article:


[Excerpted from "Experimental Duplication of the Important Physical
Evidence of the Lapel Bulge of the Jacket Worn by Governor Connally
When Bullet 399 Went Through Him" by John K. Lattimer, M.D., et al,
in the Journal of the American College of Surgeons, May 1994. The
article describes an experiment which supplies the most complete
verification of the Single Bullet Theory yet performed.]

   The most important new piece of physical evidence in the
   analysis of the shooting of President Kennedy and Governor
   Connally has been the reaffirmation of the precise moment when
   bullet 399 [the so-called Magic Bullet] passed through the
   body of Governor Connally. This is graphically demonstrated
   in frame 224 of the Zapruder movie by the sudden forward
   bulge of the right lapel of the suit jacket of Governor
   Connally. This was clearly demonstrated by enhancement of
   the motion picture in the laboratories of Failure Analysis
   Inc., by Jeffrey Lotz in 1992.   
   ...
   
   Even running the Zapruder movie at an ordinary "slow motion,"
   rate, one does not appreciate the sudden forward "bulge" of
   the lapel. It is necessary to run the movie very slowly,
   "freezing" each frame for a moment, before the flap of the
   lapel and the bulging of the jacket become obvious. Photo
   enhancement makes it easier to see, once you know when and
   where it occurs. Having established this fact, it then becomes
   apparent that the right arms of both men react immediately and
   simultaneously to the stimulus of the bullet having passed
   through them. The arms of Kennedy start an upward jerk into
   Thorburn's reflex position and the right hand of Connally,
   containing his big white Stetson hat, begins to snap up into
   view as his biceps contract and he jerks his painful forearm
   up into the view of Zapruder's camera.
   
   ...
   
   REENACTMENT OF THE WOUNDING OF GOVERNOR CONNALLY (FRAME 224).  As
   with any study of small photographs (movie frames), it is desirable
   to try to verify the findings by duplicating the situation as
   closely as possible, using the exact same type of rifle,
   cartridges, clothing, necks, ribs and radiuses, as at Dallas. In an
   attempt to verify and study this phenomenon further, a duplication
   of President Kennedy's size 16 neck and of Governor Connally's
   chest and jacket were tested to see exactly what would happen. A
   size 16 neck simulation was created, using fresh pork muscle, with
   the bone removed and the skin still in place. A rack was prepared
   to hold a rib cage at a distance of 24 inches from the Kennedy
   neck. A white dress shirt and tropical worsted jacket were placed
   over the rib cage on a special rack. A necktie was tied in place to
   simulate the clothing Governor Connally wore at the time of the
   shooting in Dallas. An array of radiuses (arm bones), encased in
   simulated forearms, was arranged in front of the right lapel of
   Governor Connally and a bullet trap was mounted beyond this array.
   Bullets of the Western Cartridge Company 6.5 millimeter ammunition
   of the same lots used by Lee Harvey Oswald were fired from a
   Carcano carbine exactly like the one used by Oswald. We knew from
   our previous experiments [as described in Lattimer's book "Kennedy
   and Lincoln"] that our test bullets would almost certainly "tumble"
   and would strike our "Governor Connally back" at about the point
   where he was actually struck. Our test bullet also struck a rib
   (just as in Governor Connally), removing 4.5 centimeters of the rib
   and exited in the area that would have been under his right nipple.
   The flying fragments of rib, marrow and soft tissue, accompanying
   the exiting, tumbling bullet, caused a large ragged hole in the
   shirt and the jacket lining and plastered them with fragments of
   rib and soft tissue, just as in the Governor's instance. The bullet
   exited under the right lapel, still tumbling, making a 3 centimeter
   transverse bullet wound in the cloth. It then struck one of the
   forearms arrayed in front of the jacket. The bullet was captured in
   a bullet trap beyond this point. A videotape of the motion of the
   jacket was obtained, along with frames from a rapid-firing 35
   millimeter camera. These revealed that the jacket bulged out about
   6 inches and then snapped back. The lapel flipped over against the
   neck area. The forward motion of the bulging jacket was completed
   in 3/30th of a second, whereupon the backward snap began on our
   static model. This was completed by 16/30th of a second from the
   shot. After this, the jacket and lapel were again back in normal
   position. While the rib and soft tissue fragments caused a large
   ragged wound in the shirt, just as described in Governor Connally's
   shirt, the exit hole of the bullet in the front of the jacket was
   elongated to a length of 3 centimeters (almost exactly the length
   of the tumbling bullet). The large shirt wound and the bulge of the
   jacket were more related to the hail of fragments of rib and soft
   tissue. The bullet then struck one of the radiuses mounted in front
   of the jacket. The bullet from this experiment was flattened on one
   side and bent from hitting the rib and radius while traveling
   sideways, just as bullet 399 was flattened and bent for the same
   reasons (399 is definitely not "pristine"). Lead extruded from the
   rear of our bullet as with bullet 399. The radius was fractured and
   tiny fragments of lead were left adherent to the periosteum,
   exactly as in Governor Connally. One of the most dependable
   features of this Kennedy and Connally mockup was the characteristic
   manner in which these Carcano bullets turned sideways (tumbled)
   after exiting the neck of Kennedy.
   
   THE BULLET MUST TRAVERSE THE NECK OF JOHN F. KENNEDY FIRST OR NO
   JACKET BULGE OCCURS. In an effort to determine what would happen if
   the bullet did *not* go through the neck of Kennedy first, but hit
   Connally primarily, we fired a bullet through our Connally jacket
   and thorax preparation without running it through the model of
   Kennedy's neck first, so it did not tumble. The jacket did *not*
   bulge out and the lapel did *not* turn over. The shirt collar
   flipped briefly. With the bullet going straight ahead, wounds to
   the rib, shirt and jacket were punctate and the rib fragments
   were not enough to bulge out the front of the jacket. This made
   it seem even more likely that bullet 399 had gone through the
   neck of President Kennedy first, turned sideways and caused the
   very obvious jacket and lapel distortions, which we have
   recorded herein and which occur in frame 224. If the bullet did
   *not* go through the neck of Kennedy first, the jacket bulge and
   lapel flap did *not* occur.
   
   SUMMARY
   
   By duplicating the wound to the neck of President Kennedy, which
   caused bullet 399 to turn sideways, and having it *then* hit a
   Connally-type rib cage with shirt and jacket, we reproduced the
   right-sided bulge of the jacket worn by Connally, with lapel
   eversion, which is so significant in frame 224. The extensive
   damage to his shirtfront was from the hail of rib fragments and
   soft tissue, exactly as described with his own shirt. Our tumbling
   bullet then went on to fracture a radius and be recovered intact
   except that it was somewhat flattened and bent and had lead
   extruded from the rear, as did bullet 399. Fragments of this lead
   were scraped off on the ragged bone-ends of some of our fractured
   radiuses, just as with Governor Connally's radius. It is believed
   that this duplication of the jacket and lapel bulge of Governor
   Connally, which occurred dependably, when we reproduced the
   circumstances at Dallas, confirmed this very important detail in
   this technical demonstration of the findings in the shooting of
   President Kennedy and Governor Connally.
   
   The bulge and the lapel eversion of the jacket worn by Governor
   Connally, starting in Zapruder frame 224, does indeed establish,
   beyond any shadow of a doubt, the exact moment when bullet 399 went
   through him. The right arms of both men were seen to react
   simultaneously, immediately thereafter. It also permits us to
   establish that there was plenty of time (three and one-half
   seconds) between the first two shots (frames 160 to 224) and even
   more time (five seconds) between the last two shots (frames 224 to
   313), for Oswald to reload, reacquire the target (the head of
   President Kennedy) plus two full seconds to lock onto it. If the
   bullet does not traverse the neck of President Kennedy, it does not
   cause Governor Connally's jacket and lapel to bulge. The lapel
   bulge is a very important bit of actual physical evidence in
   establishing the fact that one bullet hit both men and that Oswald
   had plenty of time to hit the President, first in the neck and then
   in the head. These experiments confirm the mechanism of the lapel
   bulge and the behavior of the bullet.

Folks, be advised that Lattimer's claims about his SBT reenactment are bogus and were exposed as such years ago, as I have discussed in other threads. A picture of one of Lattimer's test bullets shows it was split at the nose in several places and was markedly deformed, much more deformed than CE 399. When Stewart Galanor asked Lattimer, in a filmed interview, if he could examine the bullets that struck all three simulation objects, Lattimer said he had thrown them away (Galanor, Cover-Up, New York: Kestrel Books, 1998, p. 42).

An AAT wound ballistics test directed by Dr. Wecht, which included animal bones inside a large gelatin block, proved that merely striking the wrist bone would have caused substantial deformity in the bullet.

We now know, thanks to the ARRB materials and other sources, that the back wound had no exit point. This was absolutely, categorically established at the autopsy, and that's one reason that Humes had to burn the first two drafts of the autopsy report.

Also, as several doctors have established with overlays on x-rays, using technology that was unavailable in the 1960s, there was no path from the back wound to the throat wound without smashing through part of the spine.

I might that Dr. Jones and Dr. Crenshaw independently confirmed Dr. Carrico's account that the throat wound was above the tie knot, which means, among other things, that the slits in JFK's shirt were made by the nurses as they hurried cut away JFK's clothing. This is why the slits are irregular, have no fabric missing from them, and contained no metallic traces when the FBI lab tested them. This is also why there is no hole through the tie knot (but only a small nick on the left side of the knot, and the nick is not on the edge of the knot).

[Marjan Rynkiewicz]

Folks, be advised that Lattimer's claims about his SBT reenactment are bogus and were exposed as such years ago, as I have discussed in other threads. A picture of one of Lattimer's test bullets shows it was split at the nose in several places and was markedly deformed, much more deformed than CE 399. When Stewart Galanor asked Lattimer, in a filmed interview, if he could examine the bullets that struck all three simulation objects, Lattimer said he had thrown them away (Galanor, Cover-Up, New York: Kestrel Books, 1998, p. 42).

An AAT wound ballistics test directed by Dr. Wecht, which included animal bones inside a large gelatin block, proved that merely striking the wrist bone would have caused substantial deformity in the bullet.

We now know, thanks to the ARRB materials and other sources, that the back wound had no exit point. This was absolutely, categorically established at the autopsy, and that's one reason that Humes had to burn the first two drafts of the autopsy report.

Also, as several doctors have established with overlays on x-rays, using technology that was unavailable in the 1960s, there was no path from the back wound to the throat wound without smashing through part of the spine.

I might that Dr. Jones and Dr. Crenshaw independently confirmed Dr. Carrico's account that the throat wound was above the tie knot, which means, among other things, that the slits in JFK's shirt were made by the nurses as they hurried cut away JFK's clothing. This is why the slits are irregular, have no fabric missing from them, and contained no metallic traces when the FBI lab tested them. This is also why there is no hole through the tie knot (but only a small nick on the left side of the knot, and the nick is not on the edge of the knot).

Lattimer said that some of his 1994 slugs had nose damage from the metal walls of his bullet trap.
There have been other test re-enactments of the SBT that show little damage to the slug.

JFK's spine was indeed badly injured -- jfk (had he survived the magic bullet) would have been a quadriplegic.
Here are 4 pages from Mortal Error -- by Menninger -- re Donahue's investigation.



 

[Michael T. Griffith]

Lattimer said that some of his 1994 slugs had nose damage from the metal walls of his bullet trap. There have been other test re-enactments of the SBT that show little damage to the slug.

One, I repeat the point that ARRB materials prove that the autopsy doctors absolutely, positively established that the back wound had no exit point during the autopsy. Several recent books discuss this historic evidence, and I've presented some of it in this forum. We now know that the first two drafts of the autopsy report said nothing about a buillet exiting the throat.

Two, Lattimer's claim that some of his test bullets were damaged by his bullet trap is unbelievable and suspicious.

Three, why did Lattimer throw away the bullets that he claimed penetrated all three simulation objects? This smells to high heaven of fraud.

Four, no valid SBT simulations have produced bullets that look like CE 399 after doing the required amount of damage. The WC's own extensive wound ballistics tests failed to do so, as we know from the man who conducted those tests, Dr. Joseph Dolce. The ATT partial SBT simulation did not even produce such a bullet--the bullet went through two objects (gelatin and animal bone) and emerged much more deformed than CE 399.

JFK's spine was indeed badly injured -- jfk (had he survived the magic bullet) would have been a quadriplegic. Here are 4 pages from Mortal Error -- by Meninger -- re Donahue's investigation.

I take it you are rather new to the JFK case. Most of your fellow lone-gunman theorists reject the idea that JFK's spine was damaged, because this would render impossible their silly neuromuscular-reaction theory for explaining JFK's fierce backward motion after the head shot.

I actually agree that JFK's spine was damaged, but it was not nearly as damaged as it would have been if a bullet had gone from the back wound to the throat wound. Some of the autopsy x-rays do indeed show fragments in the neck and damage to the spine; this damage was caused by the projectile that entered the throat and by the bullet (or fragment) that penetrated about 2 inches into the back. Again, if a bullet had gone from the back wound to the throat wound, even if you assume an entry point at T1, the damage to the spine would have been far more extensive.

If CT scans had been available in the 1960s, CE 399's alleged trajectory would have been recognized as impossible. Dr. Mantik explains the problem in his new book:

The problem, as I have demonstrated in Figure 11, is that CT scans were not available in 1963—or this fantasized trajectory would have been dead on arrival.

If this trajectory is valid, the bullet would either have struck a vertebral body (as it does in figure 11), or if traveling between vertebral bodies (e.g., at a higher or lower level), it would have punctured the lung, which did not occur. The trajectory of the Magic Bullet is also very unlikely in the vertical plane—the throat wound is far too superior [high/above] to represent an exit for the back wound (which is near T1—or possibly even lower). In particular, the throat wound lay just above the necktie, which is far above T1. Also recall that the bullet, presumably from a Mannlicher-Carcano on the sixth floor of the TSBD, was traveling downward. (JFK Assassination Paradoxes, p. 10)

To get the full impact of Dr. Mantik's point, one needs to view the CT scans that he provides.

[Michael T. Griffith]

Wecht probably just had bullets fired that arrived at the impact site nose-on and at full-velocity. Those will disintegrate and mushroom.

No, they used an FMJ bullet.

Plus, the front-shirt slits have no fabric missing and tested negative for any traces of metal when the FBI tested them, and we now know that the autopsy absolutely established that the back wound had no exit point and that the first two drafts of the autopsy report said nothing about a bullet exiting the throat.

But the SBT has the bullet that caused Connally's wounds slow-downed and tumbling.

Which is absurd. The throat wound was small and punched in, and the entry wound in Connally's back was the same length as JFK's rear head entry wound (1.5 cm) and only 0.2 cm taller. No one suggests that the rear-head-entry-wound bullet was "tumbling." No, it simply entered the skull at an angle, just as did the bullet that struck Connally's back.

Plus, the front-shirt slits have no fabric missing and tested negative for any traces of metal when the FBI tested them, and we now know that the autopsy absolutely established that the back wound had no exit point and that the first two drafts of the autopsy report said nothing about a bullet exiting the throat.

The slowing-down and tumbling (along with more as the bullet went through the "Connally" torso) resulted in a bullet that, having struck two hard tissue obstructions, was similar to CE399.

Hogwash. The WC's wound ballistics tests destroyed the SBT.

The initial belief at autopsy that the back wound had no exit (though it bothered the pathologists at the time) didn't come out of the ARRB hearings. It was recorded in the 1963 Silbert-O'Neill Report, made by two FBI agents present at the autopsy. Humes revised the Autopsy Report over the weekend after a phone conservation with Dr. Perry of Parkland Hospital.

You're misleading people again. The ARRB materials strongly confirm the Sibert-O'Neill report, as does Dr. Canada's posthumously published interview with Dr. Kurtz. As you well know, since I just proved this to you a few days ago, Sibert and O'Neill provided important additional information on the back-wound and its probing in their ARRB interviews. Why didn't you mention that?

Plus, the front-shirt slits have no fabric missing and tested negative for any traces of metal when the FBI tested them, and we now know that the autopsy absolutely established that the back wound had no exit point and that the first two drafts of the autopsy report said nothing about a bullet exiting the throat.

The bullet can easily pass from the back wound to the neck outshoot without striking bone. The missile channel will cause a great deal of pressure; in this case, there was bruising across the top of the right lung. The T1 transverse process had a non-displaced fracture, possibly caused by the passing of the bullet.

Nonsense and distortion. You are mischaracterizing the damage and the bruising. Look at Dr. Mantik's CT scans.

Plus, the front-shirt slits have no fabric missing and tested negative for any traces of metal when the FBI tested them, and we now know that the autopsy absolutely established that the back wound had no exit point and that the first two drafts of the autopsy report said nothing about a bullet exiting the throat.

A neck wound above the shirt collar wouldn't match the wound location shown in the autopsy photo.

You know this is wrong. We've been through this before. Any number of photos of JFK wearing a shirt and tie show that you are wrong. Why do you keep repeating claims that you know are false?

Plus, the front-shirt slits have no fabric missing and tested negative for any traces of metal when the FBI tested them, and we now know that the autopsy absolutely established that the back wound had no exit point and that the first two drafts of the autopsy report said nothing about a bullet exiting the throat.

In the motorcade, was the tie knot slightly off to the left?

The tie knot would have had to be off center by a lot more than "slightly" for the bullet to avoid going through it or to avoid nicking one of its edges. The FBI fought tooth and nail to avoid releasing the evidence photos of the tie, but Weisberg finally got them, and they destroy the SBT, but you folks just won't admit it.

Furthermore, the front shirt slits are clearly below where the tie knot would have been.

Plus, the front-shirt slits have no fabric missing and tested negative for any traces of metal when the FBI tested them, and we now know that the autopsy absolutely established that the back wound had no exit point and that the first two drafts of the autopsy report said nothing about a bullet exiting the throat.

[Marjan Rynkiewicz]

One, I repeat the point that ARRB materials prove that the autopsy doctors absolutely, positively established that the back wound had no exit point during the autopsy. Several recent books discuss this historic evidence, and I've presented some of it in this forum. We now know that the first two drafts of the autopsy report said nothing about a buillet exiting the throat.

Two, Lattimer's claim that some of his test bullets were damaged by his bullet trap is unbelievable and suspicious.

Three, why did Lattimer throw away the bullets that he claimed penetrated all three simulation objects? This smells to high heaven of fraud.

Four, no valid SBT simulations have produced bullets that look like CE 399 after doing the required amount of damage. The WC's own extensive wound ballistics tests failed to do so, as we know from the man who conducted those tests, Dr. Joseph Dolce. The ATT partial SBT simulation did not even produce such a bullet--the bullet went through two objects (gelatin and animal bone) and emerged much more deformed than CE 399.

I take it you are rather new to the JFK case. Most of your fellow lone-gunman theorists reject the idea that JFK's spine was damaged, because this would render impossible their silly neuromuscular-reaction theory for explaining JFK's fierce backward motion after the head shot.

I actually agree that JFK's spine was damaged, but it was not nearly as damaged as it would have been if a bullet had gone from the back wound to the throat wound. Some of the autopsy x-rays do indeed show fragments in the neck and damage to the spine; this damage was caused by the projectile that entered the throat and by the bullet (or fragment) that penetrated about 2 inches into the back. Again, if a bullet had gone from the back wound to the throat wound, even if you assume an entry point at T1, the damage to the spine would have been far more extensive.

If CT scans had been available in the 1960s, CE 399's alleged trajectory would have been recognized as impossible. Dr. Mantik explains the problem in his new book:

To get the full impact of Dr. Mantik's point, one needs to view the CT scans that he provides.

Wesley Fisk & Dr Alex Krstik & Chris Leigh & David King of Adelaide based "Anatomical Surrogate Technology"  looked into the magic bullet in 2004.  I can't find a paper or report. Their slug had similar damage to CE399 & Lattimer's slug.  There are 3 youtube footages. The main footage is….
JFK Beyond The Magic Bullet (2004) 14,462 views Dec 18, 2018    Nalinho 131 subscribers
Unsolved History is history the way it was, Through detailed examination of archeological and forensic evidence, existing photographs, authentic artifacts, and carefully selected interviews from eyewitnesses and experts - events are reconstructed and historical questions are finally answered. Join the investigators of Unsolved History for a final, definitive look at the assassination of President Kennedy in this special, extended episode. After 40 years of heated debates and accusations, the physical evidence that remains from that day in Dallas is all that can be objectively examined. Watch as experts scrutinize film footage and authentic photos taken the day of the assassination for uncovered clues. The alleged assassin's timeline is broken down to the nearest minute to show where he was at the time of the shooting - and whether or not the "accepted" version of Oswald's plot holds true. Listen in on an obscure audio recording that may shed light on the identity of the true triggerman and examine Exhibit #399 - the so-called "magic bullet," the most controversial piece of evidence. It's an in-depth examination of the unanswered questions, conspiracy theories and physical evidence behind the shots that changed history.

[Michael T. Griffith]

The initial belief at autopsy that the back wound had no exit (though it bothered the pathologists at the time) didn't come out of the ARRB hearings. It was recorded in the 1963 Silbert-O'Neill Report, made by two FBI agents present at the autopsy. Humes revised the Autopsy Report over the weekend after a phone conservation with Dr. Perry of Parkland Hospital.

This is a perfect example of the stunt that you pull in this forum over and over again. Now, just a few days ago, you and I discussed the myth that Humes only learned of the throat wound on the morning after the autopsy. I presented you with evidence that debunks this myth. I cited the fact that we know from the ARRB materials that the throat wound was probed. I cited the fact that a good friend of Humes's, Jim Snyder of CBS's DC bureau, confidentially informed CBS producer Robert Richter that Humes told him that he was aware of the throat wound during the autopsy (we learned this when Richter's 1/10/67 internal memo to CBS producer Les Midgley later surfaced). I cited the fact that we now know that the first two drafts of the autopsy report said nothing about a bullet exiting the throat (you keep ignoring the fact that there were two drafts, not just one). And I cited the fact that James Jenkins, one of the medical technicians at the autopsy, witnessed the probing of the back wound and could see that the wound did not enter the lining of the chest cavity, that he could see the end of the probe pushing against the chest cavity's lining.

Yet, here you are, in a different thread, once again repeating the myth that Humes knew nothing about the throat wound during the autopsy, and you're doing this while saying nothing about the contrary evidence that I myself presented to you just a few days ago.

I should add that I did not even present all the evidence that debunks the myth. Here is some additional evidence that refutes it:

* Amazingly, and perhaps in a back-handed effort to reveal that the autopsy doctors knew about the throat wound during the autopsy, Dr. Boswell told the ARRB that after the back wound was probed following the removal of the chest organs, the probing revealed that the wound track exited the throat wound, that the probe actually came out from the throat wound!

Now, of course, his claim about the throat wound being identified as the exit wound via probing was contradicted by several autopsy witnesses, not to mention that it contradicts the story that Boswell, Finck, and Humes told for years about when they learned of the throat wound.

Autopsy photographer John Stringer (who was also the director of medical photography at the Naval Medical School in 1963) specifically said that the probe did not come out through the neck, and Sibert and O'Neill emphatically said that at the end of the autopsy the autopsy doctors had no doubt whatsoever that the back wound had no exit and that the bullet found in Dallas had worked its way out of the back wound during cardiac massage.

When asked about the Sibert and O'Neill report, Boswell falsely claimed that Sibert and O'Neill weren't in the autopsy room when the back wound was probed after the chest organs were removed. Actually, Sibert and O'Neill saw the initial probing and saw the probing that was done with the chest organs removed, and they remained at the autopsy until the body was prepared for burial. Sibert left the autopsy room for short periods, but O'Neill remained in the room "through the time that the autopsy was completed," and he saw the autopsy doctors remove their gloves and call for the morticians to prepare the body for burial.

* Stringer told the ARRB that a probe was inserted into the throat wound, and he added that he believed the body was propped up so the torso was in a vertical position when the probe was put into the throat wound.

* Dr. John Ebersole, the autopsy radiologist, told the HSCA that Humes was aware of the throat wound during the autopsy.

* Dr. George Burkley, JFK's personal physician, knew about the throat wound because he was in the ER at Parkland Hospital helping the Parkland doctors treat JFK. He supplied the Parkland doctors with hydrocortisone because of JFK's adrenal condition: "Burkley produced three 100-mg vials of Solu-Cortef from his bag, murmuring, 'Either intravenously or intramuscularly'" (William Manchester, The Death of a President, Harper & Row, New York: 1967, p. 184). Burkley arrived in the ER before Dr. Perry arrived, and Dr. Perry was the one who did the tracheostomy over the throat wound, so Burkley surely saw the throat wound, just as did the other doctors and nurses who were in the room before Dr. Perry arrived. And, of course, Dr. Burkley was also at the autopsy and spoke with the autopsy doctors during the autopsy.

* Nurse Audrey Bell, the Supervising Nurse of Operations and Recovery at Parkland Hospital, revealed in 1997 that Dr. Perry complained to her on the morning after the autopsy that he had gotten almost no sleep the night before because unnamed persons at Bethesda Naval Hospital had been pressuring him on the telephone all night long to change his opinion about the throat wound, and to describe it as an exit wound rather than an entrance wound.

* Dr. Perry and other Parkland doctors held a televised press conference barely an hour after JFK died, about six hours before the autopsy began, and Dr. Perry stated three times during the press conference that JFK's throat wound was an entrance wound.

The story that the autopsy doctors didn't know about the throat wound until the morning after the autopsy was invented to explain Humes's destruction of the first two versions of the autopsy report. A story had to be concocted that would at least appear to excuse Humes's highly unusual and illegal action of destroying autopsy drafts. Again, we now know that the first two drafts said nothing about a bullet exiting JFK's throat.

By the way, Dr. Robert Canada, a high-ranking Navy medical officer at the autopsy, said that the back wound was at around the level of T3 and that the bullet "did not exit." At the time of the autopsy, Dr. Canada was a Navy captain and was the director of the Naval Medical School at Bethesda Naval Hospital. Dr. Canada also said that there was a large "avulsed" (blown out) wound in "the right rear of the president's head." Dr. Canada shared this information in a 1968 interview with Dr. Michael Kurtz, a historian at Southeastern Louisiana University. Dr. Canada asked that Dr. Kurtz not publish his comments until 25 years after his death, and Dr. Kurtz honored that request.

there was bruising across the top of the right lung

To be specific, Humes claimed he saw bruising on top of the pleural dome, which is above the top of the right lung. However, no autopsy photos show this damage, even though Humes repeatedly claimed that photos were taken of it. Furthermore, Jenkins said he saw no bruising on the top of the pleural dome but that he did see bruising at the of the right lung's middle lobe.

[Michael T. Griffith]

In his filmed interview with Stewart Galanor, Lattimer said that he had discarded all four of the bullets that allegedly struck all three simulation objects in his test. Of these four bullets, Lattimer included only a photo of one of them in his paper on his test, but that photo shows that the bullet split at the nose and was much more deformed than CE 399. Galanor:

According to Dr. Lattimer, out of approximately 20 attempts, four bullets struck all three objects. A photograph of one of the test bullets appears in Dr. Lattimer's paper reporting the results of his experiments (Journal of American College of Surgeons, May 1994). It was split at the nose in several places and was significantly more deformed than Commission Exhibit 399. I asked Dr. Lattimer if I could examine and photograph this bullet and the other three bullets as well, and he told me that he had thrown them all away. (Filmed interview of Dr. Lattimer, May 20, 1997) (Cover-Up, New York: Kestrel Books, 1998, p. 42)

Now why, why, why would Lattimer have thrown away such historic evidence, evidence that allegedly proved that the single-bullet theory was possible? Why did he only publish a photo of one of those four bullets? (Probably because the three others were even more damaged than the one bullet that he showed in his paper.) A person would have to be very gullible to believe that the three other bullets emerged in the same condition as CE 399. If they had, you can bet your retirement savings that Lattimer would have kept them and showcased them to the world.

Let's do a quick summary of some of the reasons that the SBT is a silly myth:

* The slits in the front of JFK's shirt are below the inside part of the collar and clearly below the button and the button hole; they look nothing like a defect made by a bullet; they tested negative for metallic traces; they have no fabric missing from them; and, crucially, they do not coincide when the shirt is buttoned because the slit under the button is below the opposite slit. Clearly, the slits were cut by one of the Parkland nurses as she hurriedly removed JFK's shirt.

* We have multiple and mutually corroborating accounts that at the autopsy the autopsy doctors absolutely, positively established via prolonged and extensive probing that the back wound had no exit point, that the wound's path did not penetrate the lining of the chest cavity. This is why the first two drafts of the autopsy report said nothing about a bullet exiting the throat.

* CT scans of torsos of males with the same build as JFK establish that there was no path from the back wound to the throat wound without smashing through the spine.

* There is no hole through the tie knot nor through any other part of the tie, nor is there a nick on either edge of the tie knot or the tie. This is why the FBI fought so doggedly to withhold the evidence photos of the tie. JFK's tie would have had to be substantially off center in order to avoid being penetrated or nicked by a bullet that exited through the shirt slits.

* The Parkland nurse who assisted with the surgery on Connally's wrist insisted that much more bullet-fragment material was removed from the wrist than is missing from CE 399.

* The WC's own wound ballistics tests established that merely shattering Connally's wrist would have caused substantial deformity in CE 399.

* The evidentiary record is clear that CE 399 is not the bullet that was reportedly found on a stretcher at Parkland Hospital. The two men who first saw the bullet both said it was pointed in shape, and the first two federal agents who saw the bullet said they could not identify CE 399 as the stretcher bullet they had handled.

* Three Parkland doctors independently confirmed that the throat wound was above the tie knot.

* The throat wound had all the standard traits of an entrance wound: it was neat, round, small (5-7 mm), and punched in. ER nurse Margaret Hinchliffe, an experienced ER nurse who had seen many bullet wounds, told the WC that she had never seen an exit wound that looked like the throat wound.

[Michael T. Griffith]

You're citing two layers of hearsay by non-medical people of a "conversation" not recorded?

Oh, of course. Just never mind that this information was shared in confidence and never intended to be disclosed, right? What exactly would these men have "misunderstood" about the subject? The account consisted only of a few components, none overly technical.

Isn't CBS part of the Mass Media Coverup? What x-ray with a probe did the three pathologists describe in their 1967 "Military Review" or in sworn testimony?

Holy cow, you obviously have no idea about all the testimony regarding missing autopsy  photos and x-rays.

Your only response is to say, "Gee, the autopsy doctors didn't mention such an x-ray in their 1967 review or in their testimony"?! Of course they didn't mention it on those occasions, because they were trying to keep it from being known.

Why does Humes seem to probe the whole neck transit, then say he doesn't want to use it to authenticate the SBT?

Humm, indeed, why do you suppose that was? Think really hard. It'll come to you. Here's a hint: Until WC staffers finally badgered him enough to get him to change his stated position, Humes initially said the SBT was impossible. You know this, right?

Is there some law that pathologists can only write a set number of drafts?

Gosh, how many autopsies do you know of that required two drafts and where the chief pathologist burned all of his notes and both drafts?

ou wrote:
    "And we also now know that Jenkins told the HSCA that the back-wound
     enabled Humes "to reach the end of the wound" and that the wound tract
     was "not into the chest cavity.""

Not the same as the probe pushing against the cavity lining.

That's a hoot. If the wound tract did not go into the chest cavity, then the SBT is a myth.

On other occasions Jenkins explained that he could see the probe pushing against the lining of the chest cavity. How can you not know this? This fact has been in the public record for going on three decades now.

Since you're citing Jenkins, he said the autopsy doctors had no knowledge of the throat wound during the autopsy.

And Jenkins might well have believed that. He was not in the room the whole time.

The Silbert-O'Neill Report also says as much.

That means that Stringer imagined the throat wound being probed. That means Dr. Ebersole imagined that the autopsy doctors were aware of the throat wound. That means Burkley said nothing about the throat wound to the autopsy doctors. That means Humes lied to Snyder or that Snyder somehow misunderstood his relatively simple account. That means Nurse Bell lied about or imagined her conversation with Dr. Perry on the morning after the autopsy.

What Finck told the ARRB about the extent of the probing:

     Q: When you were performing the autopsy of President Kennedy,
     did you make any attempts to track the course of the bullet—
     A: Yes.

     Q:—that you referred to as the upper back?
     A: Yes. That was unsuccessful with a probe from what I remember.

     Q: What kind of probe did you use?
     A: I don't remember.

     Q: Is there a standard type of probe that is used in autopsies?
     A: A non-metallic probe.

     Q: In using the probe, did you attempt to determine the angle of the
     entrance of the bullet into President Kennedy's body?
     A: Yes. It was unsuccessful from what I remember.

     Q: In the probes that you did make, did you find any evidence that
     would support a bullet going into the upper back and existing from the
     place where the tracheotomy incision had been performed?
     A: From what I recall, we stated the probing was unsuccessful.
     ...
     Q: Do you have any recollection of photographs being taken with probes
     inserted into the wounds?
     A: I don't.
     ...
     Q: At the time you concluded the autopsy, on the night of November
     22nd-23rd, did you have any conclusion in your own mind about what
     had happened to the bullet that entered the upper thoracic cavity?
     A: No. And that was the reason for the phone call of Dr. Humes the
     following morning, and he found out there was a wound of exit in the
     front of the neck. But at the time of the autopsy, we were not aware
     of that exit wound in the front of the neck.
     ...
     Q: Sure. Did the angle of the probe when you inserted the probe into
     the wound, begin in a direction that pointed down into the thoracic
     cavity rather than out the throat?
     A: I don't think I can answer the question, because we said the probing
     was unsuccessful. So how can I determine an angle if the probing
     was unsuccessful?

Surely you know that you are being dishonest in cherry-picking this quote, which is nothing but a slightly modified version of the standard tale that the autopsy doctors told for decades. You know that Finck testified in 1967 that a senior military officer would not allow him to dissect the back wound, which would have been another way to categorically determine where the wound went.

Humes to the ARRB:

     A. My problem is, very simply stated, we had an entrance wound high
     in the posterior back above the scapula. We didn't know where the
     exit wound was at that point. I'd be the first one to admit it. We knew
     in general in the past that we should have been more prescient than
     we were, I must confess, because when we removed the breast plate
     and examined the thoracic cavity, we saw a contusion on the upper
     lobe of the lung. There was no defect in the pleura anyplace. So it's
     obvious that the missile had gone over that top of the lung.
     ...
     ... it's helpful to take a long probe and put it in the position. It can tell
     you a lot of things. If you know where the point of entrance and the
     point of exit are, it's duck soup. But for me to start probing around in
     this man's neck, all I would make was false passages. There wouldn't
     be any track that I could put a probe through or anything of that nature.
     It just doesn't work that way.
     Q. Was any probe used at all to track the path—
     A. I don't recall that there was. There might have been some abortive
     efforts superficially in the back of the neck, but no.
     ...
     Q. Do you recall any photograph or X-ray that was taken with a probe
     inserted into the post thorax?
     A. No, absolutely not. I do not have a recollection of such.

How can you quote this stuff with a straight face? I mean, this is just silly. You can quote Humes's lies 100 times, but that won't make them any more credible or believable. Is this your answer to all of the evidence that I've cited?

And we'll just see about Humes's (and Boswell's) claim that no photos were taken of inserted probes.

Boswell to the ARRB:

     Q. Previously in the deposition, you've made reference to there being a
     probe to help track the direction of the neck wound. Do you recall that?
     A. Mm-hmm.

     Q. Could you tell me about how long the probe was or describe the
     dimensions of the probe?
     A. It's a little soft metal instrument that looks like a needle with a blunt
     end on one end and a flattened end on the other, like a needle that you
     would knit with or something. And it's, I would say, eight inches long,
     blunt on one end and sort of has a sharp point on the other end.

     Q. Were there any X-rays taken with the probe inside the body that
     you recall?
     A. No.

     Q. How far in did the probe go?
     A. Very short distance. Three inches, about.

     Q. Were there any photographs taken with the probe inserted?
     A. I doubt it.
     ...
     ... When we saw the clothing, we realized that where I had drawn this was—
     if you looked at the back of the coat, it was in the exact same place. But the
     coat had been—was up like this. He was waving, and this was all scrunched
     up like this. And the bullet went through the coat way below where this
     would be on his body, because it was really at the base of his neck. And the
     way I know this best is my memory of the fact that—see, we probed this hole
     which was in his neck with all sorts of probes and everything, and it was such
     a small hole, basically, and the muscles were so big and strong and had
     closed the hole and you couldn't get a finger or a probe through it. But when
     we opened the chest and we got at—the lung extends up under the clavicle
     and high just beneath the neck here, and the bullet had not pierced through
     into the lung cavity but had caused hemorrhage just outside the pleura.
     And so if I can move this up to here—it's shown better on the front, actually.
     The wound came through and downward just above the thoracic cavity and
     out at about the thyroid cartilage. So if you put a probe in this and got it back
     through like this, that would come out right at the base of the neck.

Uh. .  . . Umm. . . . Did you actually read this quote before you pasted it? Did you miss the part where Boswell said that at first they couldn't get "a finger or probe through it" but that when they "opened the chest" they could see that "the bullet had not pierced through into the lung cavity but had caused hemorrhage just outside the pleura"? Did you miss that?

This mirrors Dr. Karnei's account of the probing: that the doctors removed the chest organs to get a better view of the bullet's tract and that they probed the wound extensively after they removed the chest organs. Karnei added that they moved the body "every which way" during the probing.

Here's what Jenkins explained in a filmed interview:

I remember looking inside the chest cavity and I could see the probe . . . through the pleura [lining of the chest cavity] . . . . You could actually see where it was making an indentation . . . where it was pushing the skin up. . . . There was no entry into the chest cavity. . . . No way that could have exited in the front.

During his 8/29/1977 HSCA interview, Jenkins said that Humes found that the bullet tract had not "penetrated into the chest" and that Humes had been able to "reach the end of the wound." Jenkins specified that the back wound "was very shallow" and that "it didn't enter the peritoneal cavity [the chest cavity]."

Jenkins added that at around the time of the probing "they repeatedly took x-rays of the area."

Dr. Karnei told the ARRB that by around midnight the autopsy doctors "had not found a bullet track through the body, nor had they found an exit wound for the entry in the shoulder." In his 8/27/77 HSCA interview, Karnei said that he recalled them "putting the probe in and taking pictures."

Significantly, Karnei told the HSCA that he saw "the chest cavity opened and watched the removal of the organs," and that after this he saw Finck "working with a probe and arranging for photographs."

O'Neill told the HSCA in his 11/8/78 interview that "Humes and Boswell couldn't locate an outlet for the bullet that entered the back." That's when Sibert left to call the FBI lab to see if "any extra bullets existed." He added, "I know for a fact that when the autopsy was complete, there was no doubt in anyone's mind in attendance at the autopsy that the bullet found on the stretcher in Dallas came out of JFK's body," i.e., out of the back wound.

He offered this gem of an observation: "I do not see how the bullet that entered below the shoulder could have come out the front of the throat."