Perception of Reality

[Marjan Rynkiewicz]

The orange line shows that Hickey sitting up on 2 leather cases could see a half of JFK's head over the upturned sun-vizors.
And, i reckon that Hickey could see all of JFK's head above the windshield of Queen Mary, if throo the large gap tween the upturned sun-vizors, if Queen Mary were in a favourable location behind.

The black ovals are JFK's head, & Hickey's head when sitting up hi, & Hickey's head when standing.

Actually it has been said that Hickey was a very tall dude. And he appears tall in some photos. Hence i have drawn a red oval showing Hickey's head a bit higher (when standing).

The black line shows the needed height & trajectory for Hickey's AR15, for the accidental headshot at Z313, when Hickey stood up to turn around to target the shooter behind Queen Mary.
Actually, i have based that black line on JFK's head being where drawn by Donahue (ie as drawn in that drawing).
In reality JFK's head at Z313 would have been higher than drawn by Donahue, it would have been as per the red oval head.

[Andrew Mason]

"Jerry, my "theory" is that Hickey did not make it up.  My "theory" is that he saw what he said he saw."

"He was slumped forward and to his left, and was straightening up to an almost erect sitting position as I turned and looked. At the moment he was almost sitting erect I heard two reports which I thought were shots and that appeared to me completely different in sound than the first report and were in such rapid succession that there seemed to be practically no time element between them. It looked to me as if the President was struck in the right upper rear of his head. The first shot of the second two seemed as if it missed because the hair on the right side of his head flew forward and there didn't seem to be any impact against his head. The last shot seemed to hit his head and cause a noise at the point of impact which made him fall forward and to his left again."

So, according to your "theory" Hickey saw JFK " straightening up to an almost erect sitting position".
This is not shown in the Zapruder footage yet Hickey still saw it.
How did Hickey see something that didn't happen?

According to your "theory" JFK "was almost sitting erect" when Hickey saw the headshot.
This is not shown in the Zapruder footage yet Hickey still saw it.
How did Hickey see something that didn't happen?

More interesting is what Hickey doesn't see.
The most striking aspect of this whole case is JFK's head exploding yet Hickey doesn't see this.
JFK's head flies backwards and to the left yet Hickey doesn't see this, instead he sees JFK fall forward as a result of the headshot.
This is not what the Zapruder footage shows.
It shows JFK's head flying "back and to the left"

You seem angry, Dan.

First of all, I never said anything about Hickey's description of how JFK moved after the headshot. In this case, I said that Hickey said he saw the hair fly up on the second shot BEFORE the headshot and that this is seen in the zfilm. So there is no reason to reject that evidence. It also fits with Greer, Powers, Gayle Newman and the dozens of witnesses who recalled the last two shot close together and the headshot being the last. The alternative would be to conclude that he made up seeing this and it is just a coincidence that what he made up and did not see actually occurred. That is your theory, not mine.

But while we are on the subject of Hickey's statement about how JFK moved, it is apparent that Hickey was watching JFK's head. His head did move forward from the impact of the headshot bullet. And the motion of his body after was predominantly leftward. Hickey was observing from the rear, not the side.

 I know from past discussions that you think Hickey fabricated his statements.  But his statements fit the rest of the evidence.

Multiple witnesses describe JFK's hair flying up as a result of the headshot.

Perhaps. But in Hickey's case he distinguished two shots that had two different effects.  How many said that there was a shot that coincided with his hair flying up but did not appear to strike his head and then described another shot that did strike his head?

[Andrew Mason]

I (and apparently many other people) have requested that Ken Burns, the acclaimed documentary producer, make a documentary about the JFK assassination. One of the reasons that I specified in my letter to him was to provide a counter viewpoint to the Oliver Stone movie. Sadly the response from him stated that he already had many projects in the pipeline and was too busy to do one on the JFK assassination. Ken Burns is very well known and I think is uniquely qualified to make a documentary based on what is known (instead of “raising more questions “) that would appeal to a wider audience than just the students of the case. His techniques typically can “transport” an audience to the period of time in history and the events that are the subject of the documentary. It would be a much needed antidote to Oliver Stone’s movie, if he would only make it.

It would be interesting to see Ken Burns take on the SBT. 

[Dan O'meara]

You seem angry, Dan.

Do I?
Jut because I pointed out how unbelievably poor your madcap "theory" is?

Just to recap the important point you slid over -
Your "theory" - that Hickey "saw what he said he saw."
I pointed out that Hickey turns round after the first shot and sees JFK slumped to his left (as we see in the Z-Film).
He then reports that JFK begins to sit up and is almost sat fully erect at the time of the headshot.
This does not happen. We know this for a fact. It is not in the Z-Film.

So what does that say about the reliability of what Hickey "sees"?
It says his account of what happened is completely unreliable.
He reports seeing things that did not happen!!

How can you possibly get around this fact?

[Andrew Mason]

Do I?
Jut because I pointed out how unbelievably poor your madcap "theory" is?

Just to recap the important point you slid over -
Your "theory" - that Hickey "saw what he said he saw."
I pointed out that Hickey turns round after the first shot and sees JFK slumped to his left (as we see in the Z-Film).
He then reports that JFK begins to sit up and is almost sat fully erect at the time of the headshot.
This does not happen. We know this for a fact. It is not in the Z-Film.

So what does that say about the reliability of what Hickey "sees"?
It says his account of what happened is completely unreliable.
He reports seeing things that did not happen!!

How can you possibly get around this fact?

Let's take Hickey's observation that he observed JFK slumped to the left in the car and then observed him come up (22Nov63 statement) or "He was slumped forward and to his left, and was straightening up to an almost erect sitting position as I turned and looked." (30Nov63 statement) and see whether there is something that could have given him that impression.  Hickey said he turned to the rear for about 2-3 seconds before looking forward just before the time of the last shots. So he is comparing the position of JFK that he had seen before he turned to the rear to the position he saw him when he turned forward again.

When Hickey is last seen in frame z208 (the top half of z212) he is facing forward and rising up. From z225-235 JFK slumps forward and down and to the left of where he had been when waving to the crowd. If Hickey saw JFK up to z230 say, and then turned to the rear for a few seconds before looking forward around z265-z270 (some time after Altgens 6), he would have seen a change in JFK's position.  If you compare frame z230 and z270 (which is a bit more than 2 seconds), there is a noticeable difference:

By z267, JFK is not slumping forward as he was in z230.  He is sitting more erect.  Not fully erect, but more than he was in z230.  So Hickey would naturally have the impression that JFK had been straightening up.  Nothing inaccurate about that at all.  Perfectly reasonable.

The observation of the hair on the right side of JFK's head flying forward without causing damage to JFK is raises a different kind of issue.   The issue in the first observation concerned the accuracy of his description of a change in JFK's position.  In the hair flying up observation, the issue is whether the event it occurred at all, and if so, whether it occurred at the time he heard the second shot as he stated. The accuracy of the event can be determined by the fact that the hair flies forward on the right side of JFK's head (and no one else's hair moves at all) at the time that the 1.......2...3 shot pattern indicates the second shot could have occurred.  The hair flies up into the apparent wind caused by the motion of the car.  It is unusual.  That is the only time such a hair movement occurs while Hickey could have been turned forward.  It is very hard to imagine how he he could have guessed that it occurred then without actually seeing it. His description fits what is seen in the zfilm.

So Hickey's observation of the hair flip is definitely accurate.  He must have seen it.  There is no other way he could have known it had occurred.  The only question is whether it occurred at the time of the second shot.  To corroborate that, we have the dozens of witnesses who recalled the last two shots being close together, the first shot being the neck shot and the last shot being the head shot.  We also have Greer and Powers who described what occurred on the second shot (Powers: Connally disappeared from his view; Greer: turned around immediately after the second shot and saw Connally falling - he turns by z283). 

So my conclusion, which is consistent with all the evidence, is that Hickey actually saw the hair flying up on the right side of JFK's head without any damage occurring at the time of the second shot and this occurred at z273-276.  You may not agree with my conclusion.  But if you do not, you have a disagreement with the evidence, not my reasoning.

[Charles Collins]

It would be interesting to see Ken Burns take on the SBT.

Yes, it would be a very interesting documentary and appeal to a large audience. But sadly it doesn’t appear that it will ever be made.

[Dan O'meara]

Let's take Hickey's observation that he observed JFK slumped to the left in the car and then observed him come up (22Nov63 statement) or "He was slumped forward and to his left, and was straightening up to an almost erect sitting position as I turned and looked." (30Nov63 statement) and see whether there is something that could have given him that impression.  Hickey said he turned to the rear for about 2-3 seconds before looking forward just before the time of the last shots. So he is comparing the position of JFK that he had seen before he turned to the rear to the position he saw him when he turned forward again.

When Hickey is last seen in frame z208 (the top half of z212) he is facing forward and rising up. From z225-235 JFK slumps forward and down and to the left of where he had been when waving to the crowd. If Hickey saw JFK up to z230 say, and then turned to the rear for a few seconds before looking forward around z265-z270 (some time after Altgens 6), he would have seen a change in JFK's position.  If you compare frame z230 and z270 (which is a bit more than 2 seconds), there is a noticeable difference:

By z267, JFK is not slumping forward as he was in z230.  He is sitting more erect.  Not fully erect, but more than he was in z230.  So Hickey would naturally have the impression that JFK had been straightening up.  Nothing inaccurate about that at all.  Perfectly reasonable.

The observation of the hair on the right side of JFK's head flying forward without causing damage to JFK is raises a different kind of issue.   The issue in the first observation concerned the accuracy of his description of a change in JFK's position.  In the hair flying up observation, the issue is whether the event it occurred at all, and if so, whether it occurred at the time he heard the second shot as he stated. The accuracy of the event can be determined by the fact that the hair flies forward on the right side of JFK's head (and no one else's hair moves at all) at the time that the 1.......2...3 shot pattern indicates the second shot could have occurred.  The hair flies up into the apparent wind caused by the motion of the car.  It is unusual.  That is the only time such a hair movement occurs while Hickey could have been turned forward.  It is very hard to imagine how he he could have guessed that it occurred then without actually seeing it. His description fits what is seen in the zfilm.

So Hickey's observation of the hair flip is definitely accurate.  He must have seen it.  There is no other way he could have known it had occurred.  The only question is whether it occurred at the time of the second shot.  To corroborate that, we have the dozens of witnesses who recalled the last two shots being close together, the first shot being the neck shot and the last shot being the head shot.  We also have Greer and Powers who described what occurred on the second shot (Powers: Connally disappeared from his view; Greer: turned around immediately after the second shot and saw Connally falling - he turns by z283). 

So my conclusion, which is consistent with all the evidence, is that Hickey actually saw the hair flying up on the right side of JFK's head without any damage occurring at the time of the second shot and this occurred at z273-276.  You may not agree with my conclusion.  But if you do not, you have a disagreement with the evidence, not my reasoning.

"From z225-235 JFK slumps forward and down and to the left..."

    Your "untruthfulness" knows no bounds.
I was intrigued to see what fabrications your slippery mind would come up with but this is off the charts.
You genuinely believe you can misrepresent the Z-Film, state something has happened in it that obviously hasn't happened and that it won't be mentioned. Who do you think you are - Hickey?

JFK does not slump forward, down and to the left between frames z225 and z235. Have you lost your mind??

From z225 onwards JFK grabs his throat and sits bolt upright, he leans slightly forward, Jackie grabs hold of his arms and then he slumps to his left. This is what happens in the Z-Film and none of your untruthing will change that.
JFK does not begin to slump to his left until around z260.
In fact, Altgens 6 (z255) shows JFK sat up and leaning slightly forward but before he has begun to slump to the left:



Your arrogance, to believe you can simply ride roughshod over the film/photographic record, is unbelievable. And none of this changes the fact that in his statement Hickey is clear that when he turns around after hearing the first shot he sees JFK slumped to his left - this can only be a reference to the moment JFK has actually slumped to his left, something observed by dozens and dozens of witnesses.
From this slumped position Hickey then recalls JFK beginning to sit upright until he is almost erect and is then shot in the head.

THIS DOES NOT HAPPEN.

JFK does not begin sit up after he has slumped to the left.
Hickey is FoS. His account of the shooting is wholly unreliable as he reports seeing things that do not happen. It isn't a question of him comparing JFK's position before he turned around to when he turned back, that's just your slippery mind in action. Hickey is supposedly describing an action that occurs after he has turned round from the position we see him in Altgens 6 - he is turned facing back and to his right at z255. JFK slumps to his left almost immediately after this moment.
Hickey then turns and describes something that clearly didn't happen, demonstrating his recollection of the moment of the headshot is severely defective and not to be trusted.

As for JFK's fringe ruffle, that you put down to a wayward shot...

"But if you do not, you have a disagreement with the evidence, not my reasoning."

 
What reasoning!!

[Andrew Mason]

"From z225-235 JFK slumps forward and down and to the left..."

    Your "untruthfulness" knows no bounds.
I was intrigued to see what fabrications your slippery mind would come up with but this is off the charts.
You genuinely believe you can misrepresent the Z-Film, state something has happened in it that obviously hasn't happened and that it won't be mentioned. Who do you think you are - Hickey?

JFK does not slump forward, down and to the left between frames z225 and z235. Have you lost your mind??

Your reaction is difficult to understand.  I just presented you with two animated .gif files to compare JFK's position seen by Hickey before he turns rearward to his position next seen by Hickey when he turns forward.  Can you not see them?

From z225 onwards JFK grabs his throat and sits bolt upright, he leans slightly forward, Jackie grabs hold of his arms and then he slumps to his left. This is what happens in the Z-Film and none of your untruthing will change that.

Did you not read what I wrote? I was describing JFK's position in z230 compared to his position while he was waving to the crowd before the Stemmons sign. I don't know why anyone would describe JFK as sitting bolt upright at z230, which is the position of JFK that I was suggesting that Hickey saw before he turned rearward for 2-3 seconds before turning forward again at the time of the last two shots.  Numerous witnesses described JFK as slumping forward or to the left and bringing his hands to his neck:

JFK does not begin to slump to his left until around z260.

Which zfilm are you viewing?  Here is a comparison of JFK's position between z193 and z230:

By z230 JFK has definitely moved noticeably left from the far right position he had in z193.  If you disagree, please explain why the green lines show otherwise.

Your arrogance, to believe you can simply ride roughshod over the film/photographic record, is unbelievable. And none of this changes the fact that in his statement Hickey is clear that when he turns around after hearing the first shot he sees JFK slumped to his left - this can only be a reference to the moment JFK has actually slumped to his left, something observed by dozens and dozens of witnesses.
From this slumped position Hickey then recalls JFK beginning to sit upright until he is almost erect and is then shot in the head.

THIS DOES NOT HAPPEN.

The zfilm shows otherwise.  Hickey is describing a difference or change in position of JFK between the time he saw JFK before he (Hickey) turned around to the rear which I am suggesting could have occurred around z230 and when he turned forward just before the last two shots (which I am suggesting could have occurred around z270):