Questions For Buell Wesley Frazier

[Richard Smith]

As LNs claim that the documents for the rifle purchase provide conclusive proof that Oswald ordered, purchased and received the rifle from Kleins', let's examine that claim a little closer.

The only documents that tentatively link Oswald to the Kleins' rifle order are a photocopy of a filled out order form, in name of A. Hidell, a photocopy of an envelope and a photocopy of a money order that may or may not be linked to that particular order form. It should be noted that the only thing really linking any of these photocopies, taken from a microfilm which has since been lost, to Oswald is the opinion of FBI questioned documents experts, like Lyndal Shaneyfelt, who during Bugs' mock trial agreed with Gerry Spence that photocopies can easily be tampered with.

So, what exactly do LNs believe do these three documents conclusively prove?

The "only" evidence is an order form in Oswald's handwriting, the envelope it came in, payment, the use of a known alias associated with Oswald, and confirmation from Klein's that they processed the order to send a rifle to his PO Box.  LOL.  And, of course, Oswald is pictured holding a rifle in the appropriate time frame, his wife confirms he had a rifle, a rifle is found at Oswald's place of employment with the SAME serial number as the rifle sent to him by Klein's and it has Oswald's prints on it, and no other rifle is ever found or accounted for to be connected to Oswald.  But that is the "only" evidence that he have since the time machine has not been invented.

[Martin Weidmann]

The "only" evidence is an order form in Oswald's handwriting, the envelope it came in, payment, the use of a known alias associated with Oswald, and confirmation from Klein's that they processed the order to send a rifle to his PO Box.  LOL.  And, of course, Oswald is pictured holding a rifle in the appropriate time frame, his wife confirms he had a rifle, a rifle is found at Oswald's place of employment with the SAME serial number as the rifle sent to him by Klein's and it has Oswald's prints on it, and no other rifle is ever found or accounted for to be connected to Oswald.  But that is the "only" evidence that he have since the time machine has not been invented.

Not the answer to my question, but that's no surprise. So here is the question again;

The only documents that tentatively link Oswald to the Kleins' rifle order are a photocopy of a filled out order form, in name of A. Hidell, a photocopy of an envelope and a photocopy of a money order that may or may not be linked to that particular order form. It should be noted that the only thing really linking any of these photocopies, taken from a microfilm which has since been lost, to Oswald is the opinion of FBI questioned documents experts, like Lyndal Shaneyfelt, who during Bugs' mock trial agreed with Gerry Spence that photocopies can easily be tampered with.

We'll get to the other "evidence" you mention, later on. For now, what exactly do LNs believe do these three documents conclusively prove?

[Richard Smith]

Not the answer to my question, but that's no surprise. So here is the question again;

The only documents that tentatively link Oswald to the Kleins' rifle order are a photocopy of a filled out order form, in name of A. Hidell, a photocopy of an envelope and a photocopy of a money order that may or may not be linked to that particular order form. It should be noted that the only thing really linking any of these photocopies, taken from a microfilm which has since been lost, to Oswald is the opinion of FBI questioned documents experts, like Lyndal Shaneyfelt, who during Bugs' mock trial agreed with Gerry Spence that photocopies can easily be tampered with.

We'll get to the other "evidence" you mention, later on. For now, what exactly do LNs believe do these three documents conclusively prove?

You have proven impervious to evidence, facts, and even common sense.  Had these any influence on you there would be no doubt in your mind that the Oswald ordered, was sent, and possessed the rifle found in the TSBD.  Absent a time machine, there could be no more proof than exists.  We have already discussed why your baseless "possibility" that the photocopy was tampered with makes no sense and conflicts with other evidence and circumstances.  Simply arguing over and over again that it is "possible" that any evidence of Oswald's guilt is the product of fakery is the old impossible standard of proof trick that is impermissible even in a criminal trial for obvious reasons.  That approach is absurd. 

[Martin Weidmann]

You have proven impervious to evidence, facts, and even common sense.  Had these any influence on you there would be no doubt in your mind that the Oswald ordered, was sent, and possessed the rifle found in the TSBD.  Absent a time machine, there could be no more proof than exists.  We have already discussed why your baseless "possibility" that the photocopy was tampered with makes no sense and conflicts with other evidence and circumstances.  Simply arguing over and over again that it is "possible" that any evidence of Oswald's guilt is the product of fakery is the old impossible standard of proof trick that is impermissible even in a criminal trial for obvious reasons.  That approach is absurd.

Yet another personal attack to obscure the fact that you can't (or don't want to) explain what those three documents conclusively prove.

It will probably be in vain, but let me try to explain the importance of those three documents; they are the only three documents relating to the rifle purchase that allegedly have Oswald's handwriting on them. That handwriting is the only potential link of Oswald with the rifle order.

Without those three documents, Waldman 7 would just be an internal Kleins' document showing that a particular rifle order was processed on behalf of A. Hidell and without that the BY photos would just be photos of a guy (in this case Oswald) holding a rifle.

Your circular logic crap is simply BS.

Simply arguing over and over again that it is "possible" that any evidence of Oswald's guilt is the product of fakery is the old impossible standard of proof trick that is impermissible even in a criminal trial for obvious reasons.

Really? I guess you must have missed the O.J. Simpson trial.

I must say that it is a complete mystery to me how impossible it is to get you to understand the difference between demanding authentication of pieces of evidence and claiming that those pieces of evidence are faked.

[Alan Ford]

Alan,

Please tell us what connection there is between the Ruth Paine curtain rods that you seem to be fixated on and the "curtain rods" that Lee Oswald lied about?

Even with a date discrepancy on the document you've posted many times now, tell us what the connection is.

Do you think Oswald DID take some rods into the TSBD and then the cops took them back to Ruth's garage?

Enlighten us all as you answer the proverbial question that can be asked of nearly all conspiracy theorists whenever they start talking about their murky theories----with that question being:

Where are you going with this?

Well, Mr Von Pein, before I tell you that, let me tell you where I'm NOT going with it, which is to the hilariously absurd place YOU have gone with it.

Unlike you, I do NOT believe that the curtain rods were submitted by Agent Howlett to Lt. Day
-----------EITHER a good half a day BEFORE Agent Howlett extracted them from the Paine garage (=the Von Pein 23 March Option)
-----------OR nearly two hours AFTER they were released by Lt. Day back to Agent Howlett (=the Von Pein 24 March Option)

The reason I do NOT believe EITHER of these two Von Pein Options is possible is that, unlike you, I do not believe Agent Howlett owned a time machine.

Now! As for what I DO believe, it's that
-------------two curtain rods were found in the Depository at some point after the assassination
-------------two Ruth Paine Exhibits were contrived by the Warren Commission to neutralize the threat to the official story which the two curtain rods found in the Depository represented

Unlike your explanation, mine does NOT rely on the existence of a time machine in Dallas in March 1964!

 

[Alan Ford]

Well, Mr Von Pein, before I tell you that, let me tell you where I'm NOT going with it, which is to the hilariously absurd place YOU have gone with it.

Unlike you, I do NOT believe that the curtain rods were submitted by Agent Howlett to Lt. Day
-----------EITHER a good half a day BEFORE Agent Howlett extracted them from the Paine garage (=the Von Pein 23 March Option)
-----------OR nearly two hours AFTER they were released by Lt. Day back to Agent Howlett (=the Von Pein 24 March Option)

The reason I do NOT believe EITHER of these two Von Pein Options is possible is that, unlike you, I do not believe Agent Howlett owned a time machine.

Now! As for what I DO believe, it's that
-------------two curtain rods were found in the Depository at some point after the assassination
-------------two Ruth Paine Exhibits were contrived by the Warren Commission to neutralize the threat to the official story which the two curtain rods found in the Depository represented

Unlike your explanation, mine does NOT rely on the existence of a time machine in Dallas in March 1964!

 

Suggested Extra Question To Mr Buell Wesley Frazier For Mr David Von Pein to Insert As An Honest Researcher Seeking Only The Truth:

#3b. UPDATE: Please ignore Questions 3 and 3a above, Buell, and address yourself instead to this question:

Are you aware of this document?



When I first saw it myself, I assumed the submission date was simply an error and should have read 23 March.
But when I realized that this committed me to a totally kooky notion---------that two curtain rods were submitted by Agent Howlett to Lt. Day a good half a day BEFORE Agent Howlett extracted them from the Paine garage---------I opted for a different submission date: 24 March.
Now I realize that this would commit me to another totally kooky notion---------that two curtain rods were submitted by Agent Howlett to Lt. Day nearly two hours AFTER they were released by Lt. Day back to Agent Howlett----------I am completely stumped.

Can you help me with this so that together we can establish what the heck was going on here?

[David Von Pein]

As for what I DO believe, it's that
-------------two curtain rods were found in the Depository at some point after the assassination
-------------two Ruth Paine Exhibits were contrived by the Warren Commission to neutralize the threat to the official story which the two curtain rods found in the Depository represented

Why didn't the authorities just simply ditch and destroy the TSBD rods?

Why go through that whole "Rods Found In Ruth's Garage" charade?

And then the WC somehow got Ruth Paine to just play along with this charade as well?

Your fantasy scenario concerning Ruth's curtain rods is utterly ridiculous....not to mention totally superfluous (even if people WERE trying to frame Oswald).

[Martin Weidmann]

Why is it that LNs can always only ask questions but never answer one?

They constantly want definitive answers to the most silly questions to prove them wrong, but they will never try to prove themselves to be right by answering a question substantially.

It started with the WC in the sixties and hasn't changed since.