Colors of Blue and Gold

[Jon Banks]

Question: Can spoken promises, or alleged spoken promises, justify the breaking of written treaties?

Yes. Agreements only stand if both sides honor them.

If we agree that on Tuesdays, I wash your car and on Fridays, you wash mine, that agreement ends when one of us or both us us stop upholding it.

Western leaders have long known that bringing Ukraine into NATO is a major non-starter for Russia but have promised future NATO membership to Ukraine anyway in spite of the fact that they knew it could lead to an aggressive response from Russia. So now Ukraine is suffering from the consequences of the stupid game of chicken.

From my point of view, you are a Russian apologist. Who prefers autocratic rule. Who cares nothing for democracy.

You couldn't be more wrong about me.

I believe in democracy and reject the idea that our leaders must do undemocratic or anti-liberal things to save our democracy.

Secondly, there's nothing worse democracy than war because war justifies government crackdowns on personal freedom and freedom of expression.

So I reject the idea that endless and unnecessary wars are good for democracy. The opposite is true. 

The US has been at war for 90% of my lifetime and I don't think our democracy is better off for it. Things are only getting worse here.

I’m not saying Ukraine must be forced to fight. Whether they want to or not. Because it helps us.

I don't view Russia as a major national security problem for the US so I don't see why we have a dog in the fight between Russia and Ukraine.

There are areas of geopolitics where the US and Russia strongly disagree and there are other areas of geopolitics where the US and Russia can find common ground. But short of launching nuclear war, Russia isn't a threat to the US. 

If there's anything we can do to help end the war as soon as possible, I support that but I reject the idea that Ukraine's fight is America's too.

Question: Do you think we should stop military aid to Ukraine. Regardless of what Ukrainians think?

Given that we're partially responsible for Ukraine being in this situation (ie the NATO issue and America's role in their 2014 coup), I don't think it's morally right to cut off aid to Ukraine.

But I don't think our aid to Ukraine can realistically be unconditional or without limitations.

Contrary to your accusations, I do have sympathy towards the plight of Ukrainians but I prefer a ceasefire as soon as possible, even if it means they don't regain all their territory, over a years long war where thousands more are killed and we end up with the same result, a stalemate...

[Richard Smith]

It's not wasted money. Just like Hitler, Putin needs to be stopped. And sending weapons to Ukraine seems to be a very cost effective way to do it. Yes, it costs money to stop Putin. Just like it cost money to stop Hitler. But it needs to be done.

In the long run, Ukraine will be better off suffering the war damage, than living under the boot of Russia. There is no hope for them if that happens. And adding Ukraine to Russia will only give them more resources, more draftees, and make Russia an even bigger threat to Europe and the world.

And so far you have dodged my question.

Why did the recent reverses on the battlefield for Russia spur you to start complaining about our expenditures. You were pretty silent during the months of stalemate. Is it possible you are more concerned about Russia failing than our spending money?

The Hitler rationale that Martin from "Europe" denies anyone has used.

[Martin Weidmann]

The Hitler rationale that Martin from "Europe" denies anyone has used.

Where did I say that?

Why do you need to lie every time you write something?

[Richard Smith]

Where did I say that?

Why do you need to lie every time you write something?

LOL. Rabbit hole here we come.  This thread is available for anyone to read. 

[Martin Weidmann]

LOL. Rabbit hole here we come.  This thread is available for anyone to read.

Yes, so why waste their time by not pointing out where I said it?

Just the number of the message will do.... Go on then!

[Richard Smith]

Yes, so why waste their time by not pointing out where I said it?

Just the number of the message will do.... Go on then!

Post #289 in this thread. 

"Nobody is saying that Russia will overrun Europe, because they won't. They don't have the guts or the means to take on NATO."

This is a blatant falsehood.  You weren't speaking just for yourself.  You said that "nobody" is saying Russia will overrun "Europe."  That is a demonstrable lie.  One of the primary arguments for supporting Ukraine in this war by leftists and right-wing war mongers is not to repeat the mistake of WWII by appeasing Hitler.   A poster on this board has repeatedly made that claim.  You know that are now running away again instead of apologizing for your dishonesty or ignorance of the facts. 

[Richard Smith]

The creeping escalation of force continues in Ukraine with Old Joe has now agreeing to send F-16s.  This is a repeat of Vietnam.  Incremental military escalation as the objective fails to be achieved.  Eventually the decision will have to be made to send in American ground troops.  As in Vietnam, and with the weapons systems already sent to Ukraine, the US government will deny that it plans to do so then it will send them in.  A catastrophe that will play out for years absent dumb luck like Putin having a heart attack.

[Richard Smith]

The creeping escalation of force continues in Ukraine with Old Joe now agreeing to send F-16s.  This is a repeat of Vietnam.  Incremental military escalation as the objective fails to be achieved.  Eventually the decision will have to be made to send in American ground troops.  As in Vietnam, and with the weapons systems already sent to Ukraine, the US government will deny that it plans to do so then it will send them in.  A catastrophe that will play out for years absent dumb luck like Putin having a heart attack.