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Author Topic: Poll claims Oswald seen as ......  (Read 35082 times)

Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: Poll claims Oswald seen as ......
« Reply #192 on: October 02, 2022, 04:03:19 PM »
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The evidence linking Oswald to the crime did not just magically appear.   

What evidence linking Oswald to the crime? The evidence you refuse to specify, or the evidence you continually lie about and misrepresent?

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Re: Poll claims Oswald seen as ......
« Reply #192 on: October 02, 2022, 04:03:19 PM »


Offline Martin Weidmann

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Re: Poll claims Oswald seen as ......
« Reply #193 on: October 02, 2022, 04:08:20 PM »
More strawman BS. How does that imply a conspiracy?

And why are you so invested in trying to make Martin a conspiracy theorist anyway?

And why are you so invested in trying to make Martin a conspiracy theorist anyway?

The poor fellow needs something to try and divert attention away from the fact that he can not produce a shred of evidence for his claims that Oswald was on the 6th floor when the shots were fired and/or that he managed to come down the stairs unnoticed, within roughly 75 seconds after the last shot.

He does not (and will never understand) that he has already lost the argument and will continue to live in his alternate reality.

Offline Martin Weidmann

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Re: Poll claims Oswald seen as ......
« Reply #194 on: October 02, 2022, 04:16:31 PM »
If Oswald did not commit this crime and was framed by the placement of evidence on the 6th floor, then by implication there must have been a conspiracy.  If someone comes here endlessly suggesting that Oswald couldn't have done it by, for example, concluding that he didn't come down the stairs, then the only implication that can be drawn is that this person is a CTer.  They don't have to espouse a specific nutty theory like they think "LBJ" or the "CIA" was behind the assassination.  They merely have to conclude that Oswald didn't do it to be a CTer because there would have to be a conspiracy to frame Oswald for the crime etc.  The evidence linking Oswald to the crime did not just magically appear.   Suggesting that Oswald didn't or couldn't do it is not the end of the discussion as contrarians desire.  That conclusion contains obvious implications for the involvement of others to commit the assassination and then frame Oswald.  No matter how much folks like Martin run from the implications of their own baseless conclusions.

They merely have to conclude that Oswald didn't do it to be a CTer because there would have to be a conspiracy to frame Oswald for the crime etc.

Hilarious! According to Richard, you don't have to have a theory about the conspiracy (if there was one) and you can still be a Conspiracy Theorist

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/conspiracy%20theorist

Conspiracy theorist noun

plural conspiracy theorists

Definition of conspiracy theorist
: a person who proposes or believes in a conspiracy theory

It's utterly beyond me how somebody can propose or believe in a conspiracy theory that he hasn't got.   :D
« Last Edit: October 02, 2022, 04:20:11 PM by Martin Weidmann »

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Re: Poll claims Oswald seen as ......
« Reply #194 on: October 02, 2022, 04:16:31 PM »


Offline Bill Chapman

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Re: Poll claims Oswald seen as ......
« Reply #195 on: October 02, 2022, 04:53:05 PM »
BY pictures was PR to name LHO as DH


BC


Offline Martin Weidmann

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Re: Poll claims Oswald seen as ......
« Reply #196 on: October 02, 2022, 05:25:11 PM »
The following definitions say you only need to believe a conspiracy theory ("the idea that a group of people secretly worked together to cause a particular event") is afoot, not that you have to provide a specific theory.
  • someone who believes in a conspiracy theory (= the idea that an event or situation is the result of a secret plan made by powerful people)
  • One who believes in, follows, or advances a conspiracy theory.


And this certainly sums up you and Iacoletti, with your aversion to practically-all LN evidence, LN books/websites, the LN findings of the WC, most of the LN work done by the FBI, the HSCA finding that the shots that struck JFK/JBC were fired from the SN by Oswald, etc.:

    "A conspiracy theory is not the same as a conspiracy; instead, it refers
     to a hypothesized conspiracy with specific characteristics, such as an
     opposition to the mainstream consensus among those people (such as
     scientists or historians) who are qualified to evaluate its accuracy."

This is just plain stupid. It's a logical conclusion that if Oswald wasn't the lone gunman, there must have been a conspiracy. By this definition everybody who does not believe or simply doubts that Oswald was the lone gunman would be a CT. The fact that they do not propose, support or even believe in a particular theory somehow doesn't matter. That's wacky!

Quote
The following definitions say you only need to believe a conspiracy theory ("the idea that a group of people secretly worked together to cause a particular event") is afoot, not that you have to provide a specific theory.
  • someone who believes in a conspiracy theory (= the idea that an event or situation is the result of a secret plan made by powerful people)
  • One who believes in, follows, or advances a conspiracy theory.

Hilarious.

I'm not sure where you got those definitions but I suggest you read them again before you say something else stupid.

You may not have noticed it but they clearly state that you have to believe in, follow or advance a conspiracy theory.

So, pray tell, in which theory do I believe in or have I ever followed or advanced?

Quote
And this certainly sums up you and Iacoletti, with your aversion to practically-all LN evidence, LN books/websites, the LN findings of the WC, most of the LN work done by the FBI, the HSCA finding that the shots that struck JFK/JBC were fired from the SN by Oswald, etc.:

    "A conspiracy theory is not the same as a conspiracy; instead, it refers
     to a hypothesized conspiracy with specific characteristics, such as an
     opposition to the mainstream consensus among those people (such as
     scientists or historians) who are qualified to evaluate its accuracy."

your aversion to practically-all LN evidence,

Oh please, stop whining! This is just a variation of the idiotic "your standard of evidence is too high" argument all over again.

I have an aversion to all the BS assumptions and speculations the LNs call evidence as well as the weakness of their arguments when they try to attach far more evidentiary value to a piece of evidence than is really there.

Along the same lines, I have a similar aversion to most CT arguments when they are not supported by conclusive evidence.

"A conspiracy theory is not the same as a conspiracy; instead, it refers to a hypothesized conspiracy with specific characteristics, such as an opposition to the mainstream consensus among those people (such as scientists or historians) who are qualified to evaluate its accuracy."

Pathetic. The classic appeal to authority fallacy again.... It's the biggest demonstration there is that somebody hasn't got a mind of his own and is happy to take anything they tell him at face value (that would be you, Jerry)

Translation; you have to believe what we say because we say it, no matter how incredible and unsupported by evidence it is what we say. If you disagree with us, you are a CT....

Counter argument; you can be an expert as much as you like, but if you have an agenda or get questionable evidence to work with (or both) your conclusions are going to be equally questionable.

The only book I have ever read about the Kennedy case is the WC report. Prior to reading it, I was just one more of those shallow minds who didn't give Oswald's alleged guilt a second thought. Once I finished reading the book it was beyond clear to me that whatever really happened on 11/22/63 it wasn't what the WC reported. The question for me was not if Oswald was innocent or if there had been a conspiracy. I came away from reading the report wondering if they simply wrapped this case around Oswald regardless of his guilt or innocence.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2022, 10:18:34 PM by Martin Weidmann »

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Re: Poll claims Oswald seen as ......
« Reply #196 on: October 02, 2022, 05:25:11 PM »


Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: Poll claims Oswald seen as ......
« Reply #197 on: October 02, 2022, 07:18:31 PM »
Jerry, how do you leap from “aversion to LN evidence” (which is all either not evidence at all, or is weak, circumstantial, and tainted in some way) to “a group of people secretly worked together to cause a particular event“?

Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: Poll claims Oswald seen as ......
« Reply #198 on: October 03, 2022, 05:32:55 AM »
I take that to mean that you can’t explain how you make that giant leap.

And it’s a fantasy narrative no matter who “accepts” it.

Offline Bill Chapman

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Re: Poll claims Oswald seen as ......
« Reply #199 on: October 03, 2022, 12:04:25 PM »
Oswald created his own mess and got what he deserved


billchapman_hunter of trolls_you_are_next


JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Poll claims Oswald seen as ......
« Reply #199 on: October 03, 2022, 12:04:25 PM »