The LHO Escape -- Panic and Shock

[John Mytton]

Instead of providing actual evidence, which he hasn't got,......

Huh?, What?, You can't be serious?  I'm the only one that has provided a stack of powerful irrefutable evidence and as is your right, you have attempted to refute my evidence but your scattershot attempts to create reasonable doubt which involve attacking any person or organisation that stand in your way, are so far pisspoor.

My advice would be to forget about wasting your time with endless unprovable allegations and just accept the truth, Oswald all by his lonesome killed two men on the Twenty Second of November Nineteen Sixty Three! See easy peasy!

Sincerely

JohnM

[Richard Smith]

And now you are seemingly attempting to link me with ufo stuff lol . and in addition again putting your words in my mouth . i never said Priscilla made up anything about the money , what i did was reiterate that the money was money kept in an old wallet at the very least over a period of 5 weeks and up to 2 months prior to the assassination , and before they ever lived at the paines . the very person you cite (marina ) stated as much all be it as you can see i did not quote her . i feel i need to say that because i feel the next attack on me will probably be that i made some sort of claim without citing a quote .

I know what marina said about the old wallet , i have posted it here multiple times , i dont need to question her on it . if i was to question her my questions would be on far more important matters believe me .

Huh?  She wrote in her book that LHO left the money on the morning of the assassination.  You responded to that by suggesting that she had CIA connections.  What point would you be making by linking her to the CIA in that context unless you were implying that she made it up to frame Oswald.  You said as much indicating that it was to influence the HSCA.  But here is the deal.  Marina is still alive.  If it isn't true, wouldn't she want to set the record straight?  Has anyone contacted her?  Why not?

[Richard Smith]

Wow, so many words and silly excuses trying to justify Martins teeny weeny conspiracy. Hilarious!

But I will respond to one of his claims.

So in Kleins normal business transaction, they received the order but Martin says and I quote him verbatim "We don't know what actually happened after that." but we do know Martin, we do know!

Oswald received the exact same rifle that Kleins sent.

Oswald was photographed with C2766.



And the very same rifle that Kleins sent was found on the 6th floor of Oswald's workplace!



Now 3..2..1 like clockwork, Martin will claim that the HSCA expert was wrong about Oswald being photographed with C2766 and don't forget dear reader that the backyard rifle was the same make and model as the one Oswald was sent, and at the time Kleins new stock was for the 36 inch model which means that this relatively rare make of rifle was made even more obscure by the shorter new stock!
And then Martin will spin some malarkey about how Oswald didn't put C2766 on the 6th floor but allude to some mysterious unknown person/persons somehow over the previous 8 months somehow acquired C2766 and snuck it into the building to set Oswald up??

You simply can't make this stuff up, but you just gotta laugh at the unbelievable lengths that these Oswald apologists will go to to claim Oswald's innocence. Hardy Ha Ha!!

JohnM

Great post John.  And if Oswald wasn't sent this rifle with that serial number, what happened to it?  Was it still it the possession of Klein's?  Is it still at the Dallas post office unclaimed?  The contrarians don't care about the consequences of their lunacy having any validity.  If X didn't happen as they baselessly suggest in contradiction to all the evidence and common sense, then something else like Y or Z must have happened and there is zippo evidence of either.  Oswald is pictured holding the rifle.  It was found at his place of employment.  The rifle that his wife confirmed that he owned and stored in the Paine's garage is gone on 11.22 and can't be accounted for in any other way except as the rifle found on the 6th floor.  That rifle has the same serial number as the rifle Klein's sent to his PO Box.  And his print is on that rifle.  No reasonable person could believe that the Oswald did not possess this rifle.  "Reasonable" is where the problem lies.  Not with the evidence.

[Martin Weidmann]

Huh?, What?, You can't be serious?  I'm the only one that has provided a stack of powerful irrefutable evidence and as is your right, you have attempted to refute my evidence but your scattershot attempts to create reasonable doubt which involve attacking any person or organisation that stand in your way, are so far pisspoor.

My advice would be to forget about wasting your time with endless unprovable allegations and just accept the truth, Oswald all by his lonesome killed two men on the Twenty Second of November Nineteen Sixty Three! See easy peasy!

Sincerely

JohnM

I'm the only one that has provided a stack of powerful irrefutable evidence

No need to display your delusion, John.... I already know what LNs consider weak sauce to be "powerful irrefutable evidence". It's hilarious!

I've said it before and I'll say it again; anybody who claims that a photograph of Oswald holding a rifle, taken 8 months earlier, somehow not only proves that Oswald owned a rifle but that its was CE2766 as well, needs his head examined.

you have attempted to refute my evidence but your scattershot attempts to create reasonable doubt which involve attacking any person or organisation that stand in your way, are so far pisspoor.

Yeah right,... too bad that you can't provide even a shred of the evidence I asked you for. Typical for somebody who lives in a world of assumptions and speculation!

My advice would be

Stop right there... you are just about the last person I would ask for advice.

forget about wasting your time with endless unprovable allegations

What unprovable allegations did I make exactly?

Btw I mean real ones.... not those you imagined in your confused mind....

[Martin Weidmann]

Great post John.  And if Oswald wasn't sent this rifle with that serial number, what happened to it?  Was it still it the possession of Klein's?  Is it still at the Dallas post office unclaimed?  The contrarians don't care about the consequences of their lunacy having any validity.  If X didn't happen as they baselessly suggest in contradiction to all the evidence and common sense, then something else like Y or Z must have happened and there is zippo evidence of either.  Oswald is pictured holding the rifle.  It was found at his place of employment.  The rifle that his wife confirmed that he owned and stored in the Paine's garage is gone on 11.22 and can't be accounted for in any other way except as the rifle found on the 6th floor.  That rifle has the same serial number as the rifle Klein's sent to his PO Box.  And his print is on that rifle.  No reasonable person could believe that the Oswald did not possess this rifle.  "Reasonable" is where the problem lies.  Not with the evidence.

And if Oswald wasn't sent this rifle with that serial number, what happened to it?

So, now the argument becomes that Oswald must have been sent CE2766 because we don't know what else could have happened to it..... Pathetic.

Oswald is pictured holding the rifle.

Not so fast... Oswald was photographed holding a rifle. Now where is the proof this was the rifle he allegedly received from Klein's (as you claim) and that he actually owned that rifle? Let me guess, you just assume it, right?

The rifle that his wife confirmed that he owned and stored in the Paine's garage is gone on 11.22

Marina said that she looked inside the blanket in the garage once, in late September 1963. Marina did not say it was Oswald's rifle or that he stored it in the Paine's garage. But even if it was Oswald's rifle. where is your proof that a rifle that was only seen by Marina in late September was still there on 11/21/63? Let me guess... another assumption, right?

That rifle has the same serial number as the rifle Klein's sent to his PO Box.

There is no evidence that Klein's sent a rifle to Oswald's P.O. box.... Prove me wrong!

And his print is on that rifle.

Nazi propaganda minister Joseph Goebbels said; “Repeat a lie often enough and it becomes the truth”. This is a good example of how this works. In reality the FBI examined the rifle in the night after the assassination and found no prints.

No reasonable person could believe that the Oswald did not possess this rifle.

Hilarious... Calling anybody who isn't convinced by the fairytale story you defend unreasonable is just about the most unreasonable thing anybody can do.

What you are really saying is that people are automatically unreasonable if they do not have the same opinion as you. Delusions of grandeur, perhaps?

[John Mytton]

Great post John.  And if Oswald wasn't sent this rifle with that serial number, what happened to it?  Was it still it the possession of Klein's?  Is it still at the Dallas post office unclaimed?  The contrarians don't care about the consequences of their lunacy having any validity.  If X didn't happen as they baselessly suggest in contradiction to all the evidence and common sense, then something else like Y or Z must have happened and there is zippo evidence of either.  Oswald is pictured holding the rifle.  It was found at his place of employment.  The rifle that his wife confirmed that he owned and stored in the Paine's garage is gone on 11.22 and can't be accounted for in any other way except as the rifle found on the 6th floor.  That rifle has the same serial number as the rifle Klein's sent to his PO Box.  And his print is on that rifle.  No reasonable person could believe that the Oswald did not possess this rifle.  "Reasonable" is where the problem lies.  Not with the evidence.

The contrarians don't care about the consequences of their lunacy having any validity.

It really is bizarre, earlier when I confronted Martin about the enormity of his endless allegations he tried to cover his tracks and said that Oswald may have sent the coupon, but, and listen to this, then Kliens who received a normal order on a normal day didn't do their normal procedure and apparently we don't know what happened to the rifle. And he's serious!?!?
Kleins had a post office address but for some reason we don't know what happened to the rifle, like what the F? The extent that a devout contrarian will go to keep the rifle out of Oswald's hands is beyond belief. I mean there can be value in playing devils advocate but surely common sense and what happens in the real world must be considered.

And later the unfocused Martin with an inexistent game plan forgets about Oswald's transaction with Kliens and tries a new tact and says that the FBI, Oooh the evil FBI had possession of the microfilm and implies that they altered the microfilm to insert Oswald/Hidell into Kleins records but how does this event tie into Oswald being photographed with a rifle 8 months earlier, were the Conspirators just lucky that Oswald just happened to be photographed with a rifle and revolver?

I can understand why you have Martin on your "ignore list" he keeps writing checks that he can't cash and then ludicrously demands that we prove that he has money in the bank!

JohnM

[Martin Weidmann]

It really is bizarre, earlier when I confronted Martin about the enormity of his endless allegations he tried to cover his tracks and said that Oswald may have sent the coupon, but, and listen to this, then Kliens who received a normal order on a normal day didn't do their normal procedure and apparently we don't know what happened to the rifle. And he's serious!?!?
Kleins had a post office address but for some reason we don't know what happened to the rifle, like what the F? The extent that a devout contrarian will go to keep the rifle out of Oswald's hands is beyond belief. I mean there can be value in playing devils advocate but surely common sense and what happens in the real world must be considered.

And later the unfocused Martin with an inexistent game plan forgets about Oswald's transaction with Kliens and tries a new tact and says that the FBI, Oooh the evil FBI had possession of the microfilm and implies that they altered the microfilm to insert Oswald/Hidell into Kleins records but how does this event tie into Oswald being photographed with a rifle 8 months earlier, were the Conspirators just lucky that Oswald just happened to be photographed with a rifle and revolver?

I can understand why you have Martin on your "ignore list" he keeps writing checks that he can't cash and then ludicrously demands that we prove that he has money in the bank!

JohnM

When LNs start complaining about a person who disagrees with them, rather than discuss the case itself, you know they have already lost the argument.

It really is bizarre, earlier when I confronted Martin about the enormity of his endless allegations he tried to cover his tracks and said that Oswald may have sent the coupon, but, and listen to this, then Kliens who received a normal order on a normal day didn't do their normal procedure and apparently we don't know what happened to the rifle. And he's serious!?!?

Yes, he is serious. You keep on forgetting / ignoring that Hidell ordered a rifle (C20 - T750) from Klein's department 358! That's a 36" MC rifle, which, as it turned out Klein's no longer had in stock. Your idiotic assumption that Klein's simply would have sent another rifle is merely an assumption. There isn't a shred of proof for it. So, indeed, we do not know what happened to the Hidell order. Perhaps it was cancelled, because they could not fill the order. Who knows? Nobody, and that's the point!

Kleins had a post office address but for some reason we don't know what happened to the rifle, like what the F? The extent that a devout contrarian will go to keep the rifle out of Oswald's hands is beyond belief. I mean there can be value in playing devils advocate but surely common sense and what happens in the real world must be considered.

And there we have it. Whenever an LN can not produce evidence he uses the "common sense" argument, as if common sense (which is another word for pure speculation) somehow is actual evidence. It's pathetic.

And later the unfocused Martin with an inexistent game plan forgets about Oswald's transaction with Kliens and tries a new tact and says that the FBI, Oooh the evil FBI had possession of the microfilm and implies that they altered the microfilm to insert Oswald/Hidell into Kleins records but how does this event tie into Oswald being photographed with a rifle 8 months earlier, were the Conspirators just lucky that Oswald just happened to be photographed with a rifle and revolver?

Another example of flawed reasoning. Yes, Oswald was photographed holding a rifle, but you clearly can not prove that it was CE2766. I've asked you to do so a number of times and you have failed completely. If the rifle in the photograph isn't CE2766 your entire reasoning falls flat on it's face.

So, why don't you stop complaining and simply provide the evidence for your absurd claims?

Btw, yesterday I was photographed sitting behind the wheel of a F1 car. Does that now mean that I own that car?

[John Mytton]

Btw, yesterday I was photographed sitting behind the wheel of a F1 car. Does that now mean that I own that car?

Well Martin, if you paid for it, there was a record of the money you sent in your handwriting, you filled out the order form in your handwriting, if the order form was addressed to your PO Box, the company that sent it had a record of you buying it, you were photographed with the F1, the F1 at your workplace had the same licence plate that the company sent, and your wife saw the F1's spoiler poking out from behind a car cover then yeah sure, I'd be absolutely certain that you own the F1 car!

Oops, that didn't work out how you guessed it would, did it! Hehehe!

JohnM