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Author Topic: The Shifting Single-Bullet Theory--It Always "Works" No Matter What  (Read 30986 times)

Offline Jim Hawthorn

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Re: The Shifting Single-Bullet Theory--It Always "Works" No Matter What
« Reply #136 on: February 22, 2024, 04:02:34 PM »
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Re: The Shifting Single-Bullet Theory--It Always "Works" No Matter What
« Reply #136 on: February 22, 2024, 04:02:34 PM »


Offline Jack Nessan

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Re: The Shifting Single-Bullet Theory--It Always "Works" No Matter What
« Reply #137 on: February 22, 2024, 05:00:06 PM »
JBC said he was hit by a shot he did not hear, but he only heard two shots total. 

JBC’s own Warren Commission statement, confirmed by both Jackie’s and Nellie’s statements, stated he was hit by the first shot, Bill Newman’s TV interview, DPD Hargis all tell a different story, that he was hit by the first shot. Both SA Greer and SA Kellerman have two shots and then accelerate. Everyone in the car and most around the car only relate two shots. In case you don’t hear that on your videos. 

Where is the statement where JBC pretty much states the exact opposite of his reactions? Completely contradicting himself. It seems to be a huge problem with his statements. Maybe it relates to the severity of his wounding and he simple does not know or recall.

Nellie’s same day statement issued through Jullian Read: “Nellie does not know about a third shot”. So, she went from not knowing to describing him hit by the first shot in her WC statement to mimicking the everchanging storyline after that. Where are the videos showing that?

Offline Jim Hawthorn

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Re: The Shifting Single-Bullet Theory--It Always "Works" No Matter What
« Reply #138 on: February 22, 2024, 05:10:40 PM »
JBC said he was hit by a shot he did not hear, but he only heard two shots total. 

JBC’s own Warren Commission statement, confirmed by both Jackie’s and Nellie’s statements, stated he was hit by the first shot, Bill Newman’s TV interview, DPD Hargis all tell a different story, that he was hit by the first shot. Both SA Greer and SA Kellerman have two shots and then accelerate. Everyone in the car and most around the car only relate two shots. In case you don’t hear that on your videos. 

Where is the statement where JBC pretty much states the exact opposite of his reactions? Completely contradicting himself. It seems to be a huge problem with his statements. Maybe it relates to the severity of his wounding and he simple does not know or recall.

Nellie’s same day statement issued through Jullian Read: “Nellie does not know about a third shot”. So, she went from not knowing to describing him hit by the first shot in her WC statement to mimicking the everchanging storyline after that. Where are the videos showing that?

Yes, I agree that their perception could have easily been blurred by the shock and the rapidity of what happened.

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Re: The Shifting Single-Bullet Theory--It Always "Works" No Matter What
« Reply #138 on: February 22, 2024, 05:10:40 PM »


Offline Andrew Mason

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Re: The Shifting Single-Bullet Theory--It Always "Works" No Matter What
« Reply #139 on: February 23, 2024, 05:48:18 PM »
JBC said he was hit by a shot he did not hear, but he only heard two shots total. 
So that's three shots. Two that he heard and one that he felt strike him in between: ie. at a time after hearing the first and turning around to check on JFK but before hearing and feeling the effects of the third.

Quote
JBC’s own Warren Commission statement, confirmed by both Jackie’s and Nellie’s statements, stated he was hit by the first shot
Which part of the following statement are you having difficulty with (4 H 135-136)?:

Mr. SPECTER. In your view, which bullet caused the injury to your chest,
Governor CONNALLY. The second one.
Mr. SPECTER. And what is your reason for that conclusion, sir?
Governor CONNALLY. Well, in my judgment, it just couldn’t conceivably have
been the first one because I heard the sound of the shot. In the first place, I
don’t know anything about the velocity of this particular bullet, but any rifle
has a velocity that exceeds the speed of sound, and when I heard the sound
of that first shot, that bullet had already reached where I was, or it had reached
that far, and after I heard that shot. I had the time to turn to my right, and
start to turn to my left before I felt anything.

Quote
Both SA Greer and SA Kellerman have two shots and then accelerate. Everyone in the car and most around the car only relate two shots. In case you don’t hear that on your videos.
Both Greer (2 H 119) and Kellerman (2 H 278) said there were three shots.  Greer even explained that he turned around immediately after - almost simultaneously with - the second shot, then turned forward and then back again before the third shot occurred.

Quote
Nellie’s same day statement issued through Jullian Read: “Nellie does not know about a third shot”. So, she went from not knowing to describing him hit by the first shot in her WC statement to mimicking the everchanging storyline after that. Where are the videos showing that?
Do you have a cite for this statement?  Her WC statement is pretty clear that she heard three shots (4 H 149).  She watched JFK react to the first shot but never looked back after the second shot that she saw her husband recoil from.  She says she then heard and felt the effects from the third shot striking JFK in the head.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2024, 06:33:10 PM by Andrew Mason »

Offline Zeon Mason

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Re: The Shifting Single-Bullet Theory--It Always "Works" No Matter What
« Reply #140 on: February 23, 2024, 11:47:15 PM »
If not the SBT then what?
It would have to be a silenced shot that’s occurring that was the 1st shot hitting JFK in the throat AND back?
Or if it was a silenced shot that hit only JC at about Z224-225. fired within approx 1 sec after JFK was hit in the back and throat by a loud sounding shot at perhaps  between Z195-Z210?

Could the  apparent simultaneous reaction of both JFK and JC at Z223-225 be plausibly caused by 2 separate shots from 2 gunman, if one of them used a silenced rifle?

Since they never demonstrated a thru connection from the throat wound of JFK to his back wound or via versa, does this mean yet ANOTHER shot had to have been fired in the throat of JFK front the front of the limo almost simultaneous with one to his back from behind the limo?

If so then a minimum of 5 shots had to be fired by at least 3 shooters, of which TWO of 5 shots were silenced shots.

The SS agents reaction is starting only at approx Z255, so they must have heard at least one loud noise about 1 sec earlier which. suggests the shot that hit JC at Z224 was probably a loud shot.

It’s doubtful that SS agents would take 3 or more seconds to react to a loud shot which was fired at Z195 which they could also see hit JFK.

So it seems to me that IF NOT the SBT then there’s a much more complicated sequence of one  gunman using a silenced rifle, perhaps small caliber like 22 cal or 5.56 mm, that hit JFK in the back and one silenced shot from yet ANOTHER gunman fired from the FRONT of the limo , which hit JFK in the throat, causing an entrance hole in the throat( as early observations /perceptions indicated)

These 2 silenced shots fired at Z195-210 , causing JFK reaction followed by the first LOUD shot hitting JC separately at Z 224-225

The 2nd and 3rd shots must have been from one gunman using an unsuppressed semi auto rifle because the spacing of the last 2 shots was probably not more than 1.5 sec apart, given the “back to back” perception of majority of ear witness.

But that causes another question if the 3 loud shots were fired by just one gunman or was there yet another gunman using a loud rifle, who fired his rifle 1 sec before the other gunman fired at Z313?

That then would require FOUR!? Gunman, 2 with silenced rifles and 2 with loud rifles.

That seems a bit beyond plausible imo, so scratch one of the loud sounding rifle gunman, which causes the solution to be that one gunman used a semi auto rifle, fired and hit JFK at Z313, followed by a 3rd loud shot 0.5 -1.0 sec AFTER Z313  which shot flew high due to muzzle rise effect when firing an semi auto rifle rapidly. That’s the shot that hit the curb near Tague, and since it was NOT an MC bullet, but rather a conical shaped bullet of different metal composition than the MC,6.5 mm ball nosed bullet,  thus explaining absence of material residue from an MC type bullet in the curb analysis.

There’s still to much complication here , however , with using 2 other gunman with silenced rifles so scratch one of the silenced gunman firing from the front of the limo. That also requires accepting the back shot in JFK did in fact exit his throat and that they just failed to find the thru  connection because of (insert explanation here).

Therefore  , so far, the next simplistic alternative theory to replace the SBT requires at least 2 gunman with one using a silenced rifle and firing one silenced shot that hit only JFK in the back, exiting his throat and then disappearing , while the 2nd gunman at the 6th floor SE window of TSBD , fired 3 loud shots, the 1st at Z224 which caused  JCs right shoulder turn, then reaction of SS agents by Z255, followed by 2nd and 3rd loud shots fired at Z313 and Z 335, of which Z335 shot missed high and struck curb near Tague.

This alternative to the SBT of 2 gunman still seems a bit too complicated , so since it’s  unnecessary to use 2 gunman when just one will do, especially if using a semi auto rifle., scratch the silenced rifle gunman.

This is why I gravitated towards a CT alternate theory that accepts  the SBT partly ( with modification ) by using just ONE gunman with a semi auto rifle whom began his shooting at Z 224 , that shot going thru both JC and JFK but which bullet had to be disposed of and replaced by CE 399 because the bullet recovered from JCs thigh was a conical shaped ie “pointed bullet” of different caliber (probably 7.62mm)

It’s a simple alternative theory that incudes the SBT in part , and it works except for the fact that there was only an MC  rifle found on the 6th floor and Harold Norman described the clack/click sounds he heard and in his opinion thought they were  generated from a bolt action rifle.

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Re: The Shifting Single-Bullet Theory--It Always "Works" No Matter What
« Reply #140 on: February 23, 2024, 11:47:15 PM »


Offline Jack Nessan

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Re: The Shifting Single-Bullet Theory--It Always "Works" No Matter What
« Reply #141 on: February 24, 2024, 03:01:00 AM »
So that's three shots. Two that he heard and one that he felt strike him in between: ie. at a time after hearing the first and turning around to check on JFK but before hearing and feeling the effects of the third.
Which part of the following statement are you having difficulty with (4 H 135-136)?:

Mr. SPECTER. In your view, which bullet caused the injury to your chest,
Governor CONNALLY. The second one.
Mr. SPECTER. And what is your reason for that conclusion, sir?
Governor CONNALLY. Well, in my judgment, it just couldn’t conceivably have
been the first one because I heard the sound of the shot. In the first place, I
don’t know anything about the velocity of this particular bullet, but any rifle
has a velocity that exceeds the speed of sound, and when I heard the sound
of that first shot, that bullet had already reached where I was, or it had reached
that far, and after I heard that shot. I had the time to turn to my right, and
start to turn to my left before I felt anything.
Both Greer (2 H 119) and Kellerman (2 H 278) said there were three shots.  Greer even explained that he turned around immediately after - almost simultaneously with - the second shot, then turned forward and then back again before the third shot occurred.
Do you have a cite for this statement?  Her WC statement is pretty clear that she heard three shots (4 H 149).  She watched JFK react to the first shot but never looked back after the second shot that she saw her husband recoil from.  She says she then heard and felt the effects from the third shot striking JFK in the head.

Andrew, you have had this spoon fed to you at least 25 other times. This time you post the answers for me to your cherry-picked uniformed post so I know you can at least understand these people have more to their respective statements than what you have just posted.

Offline Jack Nessan

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Re: The Shifting Single-Bullet Theory--It Always "Works" No Matter What
« Reply #142 on: February 24, 2024, 03:11:20 AM »
If not the SBT then what?
It would have to be a silenced shot that’s occurring that was the 1st shot hitting JFK in the throat AND back?
Or if it was a silenced shot that hit only JC at about Z224-225. fired within approx 1 sec after JFK was hit in the back and throat by a loud sounding shot at perhaps  between Z195-Z210?

Could the  apparent simultaneous reaction of both JFK and JC at Z223-225 be plausibly caused by 2 separate shots from 2 gunman, if one of them used a silenced rifle?

Since they never demonstrated a thru connection from the throat wound of JFK to his back wound or via versa, does this mean yet ANOTHER shot had to have been fired in the throat of JFK front the front of the limo almost simultaneous with one to his back from behind the limo?

If so then a minimum of 5 shots had to be fired by at least 3 shooters, of which TWO of 5 shots were silenced shots.

The SS agents reaction is starting only at approx Z255, so they must have heard at least one loud noise about 1 sec earlier which. suggests the shot that hit JC at Z224 was probably a loud shot.

It’s doubtful that SS agents would take 3 or more seconds to react to a loud shot which was fired at Z195 which they could also see hit JFK.

So it seems to me that IF NOT the SBT then there’s a much more complicated sequence of one  gunman using a silenced rifle, perhaps small caliber like 22 cal or 5.56 mm, that hit JFK in the back and one silenced shot from yet ANOTHER gunman fired from the FRONT of the limo , which hit JFK in the throat, causing an entrance hole in the throat( as early observations /perceptions indicated)

These 2 silenced shots fired at Z195-210 , causing JFK reaction followed by the first LOUD shot hitting JC separately at Z 224-225

The 2nd and 3rd shots must have been from one gunman using an unsuppressed semi auto rifle because the spacing of the last 2 shots was probably not more than 1.5 sec apart, given the “back to back” perception of majority of ear witness.

But that causes another question if the 3 loud shots were fired by just one gunman or was there yet another gunman using a loud rifle, who fired his rifle 1 sec before the other gunman fired at Z313?

That then would require FOUR!? Gunman, 2 with silenced rifles and 2 with loud rifles.

That seems a bit beyond plausible imo, so scratch one of the loud sounding rifle gunman, which causes the solution to be that one gunman used a semi auto rifle, fired and hit JFK at Z313, followed by a 3rd loud shot 0.5 -1.0 sec AFTER Z313  which shot flew high due to muzzle rise effect when firing an semi auto rifle rapidly. That’s the shot that hit the curb near Tague, and since it was NOT an MC bullet, but rather a conical shaped bullet of different metal composition than the MC,6.5 mm ball nosed bullet,  thus explaining absence of material residue from an MC type bullet in the curb analysis.

There’s still to much complication here , however , with using 2 other gunman with silenced rifles so scratch one of the silenced gunman firing from the front of the limo. That also requires accepting the back shot in JFK did in fact exit his throat and that they just failed to find the thru  connection because of (insert explanation here).

Therefore  , so far, the next simplistic alternative theory to replace the SBT requires at least 2 gunman with one using a silenced rifle and firing one silenced shot that hit only JFK in the back, exiting his throat and then disappearing , while the 2nd gunman at the 6th floor SE window of TSBD , fired 3 loud shots, the 1st at Z224 which caused  JCs right shoulder turn, then reaction of SS agents by Z255, followed by 2nd and 3rd loud shots fired at Z313 and Z 335, of which Z335 shot missed high and struck curb near Tague.

This alternative to the SBT of 2 gunman still seems a bit too complicated , so since it’s  unnecessary to use 2 gunman when just one will do, especially if using a semi auto rifle., scratch the silenced rifle gunman.

This is why I gravitated towards a CT alternate theory that accepts  the SBT partly ( with modification ) by using just ONE gunman with a semi auto rifle whom began his shooting at Z 224 , that shot going thru both JC and JFK but which bullet had to be disposed of and replaced by CE 399 because the bullet recovered from JCs thigh was a conical shaped ie “pointed bullet” of different caliber (probably 7.62mm)

It’s a simple alternative theory that incudes the SBT in part , and it works except for the fact that there was only an MC  rifle found on the 6th floor and Harold Norman described the clack/click sounds he heard and in his opinion thought they were  generated from a bolt action rifle.

Duncan just posted the James Altgens interview. James Altgens is a two shot witness. His two shot statement was read on ABC TV 3 minutes after Walter Cronkite's CBS news flash of the Merriman Smith bulletin of three shots. Altgens was the only news reporter out of seventy news reporters in Dealey Plaza that was an eyewitness. Merriman Smith was an earwitness with another reporter in the car with him stating there was only two shots.

Factor in just two shots into your scenarios. The overriding issue is there is no way to account or explain the bullet wound in JBC's back if the bullet does not first pass through JFK.

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

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Re: The Shifting Single-Bullet Theory--It Always "Works" No Matter What
« Reply #143 on: February 24, 2024, 09:32:27 PM »
Duncan just posted the James Altgens interview. James Altgens is a two shot witness. His two shot statement was read on ABC TV 3 minutes after Walter Cronkite's CBS news flash of the Merriman Smith bulletin of three shots. Altgens was the only news reporter out of seventy news reporters in Dealey Plaza that was an eyewitness. Merriman Smith was an earwitness with another reporter in the car with him stating there was only two shots.

Factor in just two shots into your scenarios. The overriding issue is there is no way to account or explain the bullet wound in JBC's back if the bullet does not first pass through JFK.
Anyone watching in Houston, & then running around & down to watch some more at Elm St, would not properly hear Oswald's first shot at pseudo Z105, they would hear Oswald's shot-2 at Z218, & they would hear Hickey's auto burst at Z300-Z312.
Lemmeeseenow, who could that be ----  ah yes, it could be Altgens, & it could be Bell --- they both said that there were 2 shots.

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Re: The Shifting Single-Bullet Theory--It Always "Works" No Matter What
« Reply #143 on: February 24, 2024, 09:32:27 PM »