Users Currently Browsing This Topic:
0 Members

Author Topic: TSBD Encirclement & Sealing.... Who? When? Where? Why? How?  (Read 8436 times)

Offline Martin Weidmann

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7444
Re: TSBD Encirclement & Sealing.... Who? When? Where? Why? How?
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2024, 11:31:20 PM »
Advertisement
Oswald takes 48 sec to get to the 2nd floor. Oswald spends a further 52 sec near the lunchroom. Oswald exits to Houston & walks north along Houston (say 40 sec)(total time say 140 sec).
Oswald sees Barnett on sentry at the dock. Oswald duz a u-turn & walks south along Houston (& then crosses Houston)(seen by Buell Frazier) (total time say 160 sec).
That fits (just). Barnett inferred that Barnett was near the dock untill almost 140 sec after the shots (Barnett said that he had returned to Elm St at about 150 sec).
So, at say 140 sec, Oswald was looking at Barnett (briefly)(before doing a u-turn), & Barnett was looking towards Oswald (briefly)(after starting to head south).
Yep, that works, just.

Oswald takes 48 sec to get to the 2nd floor. Oswald spends a further 52 sec near the lunchroom.

Why would he hang around at the lunchroom when he simply could have walked through the office space and leave the building through the front entrance?

Also, a time trial placed Oswald at the top of the stairs on the 6th floor at around 28 seconds after the shots (at the earliest). He only needed 20 seconds to go from the 6th floor to the 2nd floor and Adams and Styles didn't see him? I doubt it.

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: TSBD Encirclement & Sealing.... Who? When? Where? Why? How?
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2024, 11:31:20 PM »


Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 910
Re: TSBD Encirclement & Sealing.... Who? When? Where? Why? How?
« Reply #9 on: January 08, 2024, 01:07:00 AM »
Oswald takes 48 sec to get to the 2nd floor. Oswald spends a further 52 sec near the lunchroom.

Why would he hang around at the lunchroom when he simply could have walked through the office space and leave the building through the front entrance?

Also, a time trial placed Oswald at the top of the stairs on the 6th floor at around 28 seconds after the shots (at the earliest). He only needed 20 seconds to go from the 6th floor to the 2nd floor and Adams and Styles didn't see him? I doubt it.
Oswald gets to the 2nd floor after 48 sec.  He stops.  What to do next? 
Should he continue down to the first floor? 
Should he go to the first floor via the front stairs? 
Should he lay low in the lunch room? 
His jacket is in the Domino Room.
Uh Oh -- He hears Adams & Styles klomping down the stairs in a real hurry on a mission.
Best to visit the coke machine & hope that whoever it is goes clean past.
They pass. He comes back out. What to do next?
He can't decide.  He will be less conspicuous if he takes the front stairs, but he would then have to walk back into & throo the storage area to get his jacket in the Domino Room.
He decides to continue down the back stairs.
He makes a start but then Truly hollers up the elevator shaft, so he goes back up.
Then he hears Baker & Truly galloping up the stairs, & he retreats to the coke machine a second time.
He walks slow & cool. 
He would have been better off diving into the lunchroom in a hurry, & laying low, he knows there is no-one in there, but he knows that if seen rushing (by Truly & Co) it will be a sure sign that he is guilty of something.
He nearly makes it, another couple of slow steps & he will be out of sight.
But damn, Baker spots a bit of him throo the glass of the door & says to come back.
Truly confirms that Oswald works here, & Baker & Truly gallop off.
Oswald gets a coke to look less guilty & more cool if confronted again.  And assassinations go better with coke.
The back stairs are now dangerous.  He heads for the front stairs, either forgetting about his jacket or deciding that his jacket is a dead duck.
But just in case more dumb cops are entering along the corridor he goes via the office.
Damn, he meets Jeraldean Reid as she returns to her desk.  She says something as they pass & he mumbles something back.  Its not a good look.  He has no business in the office, unless wanting change for the coke machine. Its not even a short cut to the stairs. Damn.  Anyhow no big deal.
He goes down the front stairs & mixes with the growing throng in the lobby near the front door without raising any suspicion.
Someone asks him about a phone.
Ok, things aint so bad, praps he can take a chance & get his jacket from the Domino Room anyhow.
Hmmm – he can get his jacket by going out the front door & down the steps & around & entering via the Houston dock (like he does each morning), & walking 13 paces to the jacket. 
Getting caught walking in shouldn’t result in getting bitten by a cop.
So, off he goes, but he gets a little ways up Houston & he sees Officer Barnett on sentry duty at the dock, & Barnett looks vicious.
So, a quick U-turn & back down Houston.  Buell Frazier sees him walking south along Houston.
No, the jacket is a dead duck.  He decides to get out of there asap, he crosses Houston & then crosses Elm.
Tippit is waiting.

What i dont explain above is that Oswald fired twice, & then he stood up & back from the window (as per Brennan's testimony) & Oswald saw Hickey fire an accidental auto burst (of at least 4 shots) that hit jfk in the head.
So, my Oswald had a few seconds of start compared to the Oswald-fired-3-shots crowd.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2024, 02:11:35 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 910
Re: TSBD Encirclement & Sealing.... Who? When? Where? Why? How?
« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2024, 10:36:36 PM »
Circumnavigation Route taken by Adams & Styles & Foster.
I am starting to doubt that Foster could have beaten Adams & Styles to the NW corner of TSBD.
Thems 2 boxcars had zero to do with the TSBD. We can see a white truck loading or unloading one ovem. This was late arvo on Fri 22nov1963.


« Last Edit: January 13, 2024, 02:10:15 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: TSBD Encirclement & Sealing.... Who? When? Where? Why? How?
« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2024, 10:36:36 PM »


Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 910
Re: TSBD Encirclement & Sealing.... Who? When? Where? Why? How?
« Reply #11 on: January 09, 2024, 10:50:51 PM »
Adams & Styles might have exited via the large overhead door, if open,
 in which case Truly & Baker would have been more likely to not see them (even if on first floor at same time).
The plan is wrong, there was no chamfer of the north west corner of the TSBD, there was a full height window there (giving light to the stairwell), but that window was in the western wall not in a chamfer.


« Last Edit: January 13, 2024, 02:09:37 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

Offline Martin Weidmann

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7444
Re: TSBD Encirclement & Sealing.... Who? When? Where? Why? How?
« Reply #12 on: January 09, 2024, 11:00:44 PM »
Route taken by Adams & Styles & Foster.
I am starting to doubt that Foster could have beaten Adams & Styles to the NW corner of TSBD.



Thanks for adapting the picture. I wouldn't know how even begin to know how to do that.

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: TSBD Encirclement & Sealing.... Who? When? Where? Why? How?
« Reply #12 on: January 09, 2024, 11:00:44 PM »


Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 910
Re: TSBD Encirclement & Sealing.... Who? When? Where? Why? How?
« Reply #13 on: January 10, 2024, 12:27:53 AM »
Thanks for adapting the picture. I wouldn't know how even begin to know how to do that.
I doubt that i am smarter than the average bear.
I open a jpg pix in Microsoft Office 2010. Then i can crop the pix to make it smaller to cut out non-essential areas.
I then open the jpg pix in Paint. Paint allows me to paint/draw lines etc & some standard shapes (eg stars & arrows & words etc).
Microsoft Office 2010 & Paint are sitting on my old computer, as a part of the original package i think, i think everyone has them (my wife always organised our computers, she was a genius)(died 6 years ago).
I then upload the jpg pix (now cropped & painted) to my free postimages account.
I then find the postimages name/code for my uploaded image, & i include that code in my forum posting (i have to add [ img ] in front of code & [ /img ] on end of code).
In the [img] i can make it say [img width=800] to make the image larger (or smaller) in my forum posting if desirable.
The whole process took about 10 minutes for that pix today. Postimages is amazingly friendly, once u get to know it.
« Last Edit: January 11, 2024, 09:22:40 PM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 910
Re: TSBD Encirclement & Sealing.... Who? When? Where? Why? How?
« Reply #14 on: January 11, 2024, 01:53:36 PM »
Here is a view of the Houston Dock.
Actually, according to Romack, Barnett went further than the drawn star, i should have drawn Barnett's star further north, between the first 2 sets of tracks (total number of tracks crossing Houston St is 6 i think).
Romack said that Barnett kept walking/running until Barnett could see down the rear of the building, ie Barnett ran to almost the 2nd set of tracks (which is just out of picture).
In my earlier aerial pix the star drawn for Barnett's furthest location is correctly drawn between Track-1 & Track-2.
In the pix below we can see a double-side-entry-(drainage)-pit at about where Barnett would have stopped.
Usually that kind of DSEP is constructed in conjunction with concrete kerbing & tarmac (ie along the side of a fully constructed road), but (as can be seen) the kerbing on the west side of Houston St south of the tracks has stopped short of the tracks. And it looks like gravel (or crushed rock) to me (not tarmac) at the entrance to the DSEP ie between the tracks.
Adams had said that Barnett (ie a cop) was 2 yd out into Houston St when she saw him. Prap he was near the DSEP. Or, praps he had gone back south to near the kerb proper.
If Barnett was facing Romack (ie talking to Romack) then Barnett might have missed seeing Adams & Styles, but Romack should not have missed seeing.

In the below pix we see a boxcar. On that Fri 22nov1963 there were 2 boxcars on the track.
And as can be seen the 1st track splits, & 1A goes along close to the annexe. 1B also bends a little & ends much further west than 1A (1B was empty on that Friday).
I doubt that 1A (ie rail boxcars) were ever used by the TSBD (inbound or outbound). I reckon that the TSBD used road transport only (& possibly pigeons).
Rail boxcars would have delivered fruit & veggies to the Houston Dock & to the Elm Dock in the old days. In thems days the docks were fully open along the rail track (no doors needed).

By the way, the high fence partly blocking the Adams & Styles circumnavigation of the TSBD (see earlier aereal photo) was constructed by the TSBD (according to Truly).

« Last Edit: January 13, 2024, 02:09:02 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 910
Re: TSBD Encirclement & Sealing.... Who? When? Where? Why? How?
« Reply #15 on: January 12, 2024, 03:13:43 AM »
Frazier chases after Shelley & Lovelady for 20yd before doubling back to the front stairs, & then walking to the corner.
Frasier then sees Oswald (from a distance of 10ft to 12ft) walking from (Frazier thinks) the Houston Dock (but Oswald actually exited via the front door while Frazier was away).
Oswald wanted to enter via the Houston Dock, to get his jacket from the Domino Room.
But Oswald sees Officer Barnett on sentry near the Dock, & Barnett looks vicious, so, Oswald duz a u-turn, & kisses his jacket goodbye.
Frazier sees Oswald cross Houston St, & then cross a half of Elm St, before Oswald disappears into the crowd.
This is about 140 sec after the shots.
Officer Barnett follows closely behind Oswald (not shown), & takes up sentry near that corner (not shown). This is about 150 sec after the shots.
Brennan comes out of hiding (not shown) & tells Barnett that Brennan saw Oswald with a rifle in an upper window (not shown).

At 150 sec Adams & Styles (walking around the rear to the TSBD) would not yet have reached Elms St extn.
They eventually get to the front doors.

Shelley & Lovelady are at 150 sec standing at the end of Elm St extn watching the antics in the railway carpark.
They eventually return to the TSBD, entering via the western ramp & door that Shelley uses every morning from the staff carpark into the Elm St loading dock.


« Last Edit: January 13, 2024, 02:08:24 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: TSBD Encirclement & Sealing.... Who? When? Where? Why? How?
« Reply #15 on: January 12, 2024, 03:13:43 AM »