T.F. Bowley, A Wind-Up Wristwatch & 1:17

[Martin Weidmann]

Whaleys manifest has Oswald in his taxi not later than 12:45 and this was in conflict with Roger Craig’s observation of Oswald at 12:45 at the SW corner of TSBD and him running to the rambler station wagon driven by DC man.

So the ticket would be useful (they thought)  to reinforce the Whaley taxi ride and a ticket added to Oswald’s shirt , so that Roger Craig whom had been a Deputy Sheriff of the Year, could be more effectively discredited.

But they got the wrong estimate (imo) on the shooting of Tippet occurring at 1:15 because maybe somebody thought ( (like Bill Brown 🤔) that the DOA 1:15 document meant the same thing as  a physician “estimate” of death and therefore Tippit died 1:15 at 10th and Patton)

IF however, Oswald did in fact tell Fritz about boarding a bus , and IF Oswald really did shoot Tippit, then is it reasonable to suspect that Oswald maybe just made that up to try To aid himself by discrediting ( in his mind) the Whaley taxi ride ( perhaps Oswald saw Whaley write in the 12:45 block of his manifest) by Oswald claiming to be on a bus getting a ticket at 12:45?

This is why I’d rather just disregard the bus ticket and Oswald on the bus as late as 12:43 as unsubstantiated and just go with Whaleys 15 minute variable 12:30-12:45 manifest block in which case it’s possible therefore that Oswald got in the taxi as early as 12:40.

Then the 1:07 timeline arrival to 10th and Patton works , the clocks and watches of Bowley and Markam don’t have be running 6 minutes slow, and Tippit is shot by 1:09 and the  Bowley call made at 1:10, and the ambulance dispatched gets to the scene by 1:12, loads the body in 30 seconds, returns to hospital by 1:14:30, unloads  body to emergency room in another 30 secs, where the doctor notes the time is 1:15 as he pronounces Tippit dead.

Then the 1:07 timeline arrival to 10th and Patton works , the clocks and watches of Bowley and Markam don’t have be running 6 minutes slow, and Tippit is shot by 1:09 and the  Bowley call made at 1:10, and the ambulance dispatched gets to the scene by 1:12, loads the body in 30 seconds, returns to hospital by 1:14:30, unloads  body to emergency room in another 30 secs, where the doctor notes the time is 1:15 as he pronounces Tippit dead.

You've got, Zeon. There's a mountain of evidence that places Tippit's shooting somewhere between 1:08 and 1:10 and the only thing that does not compute with that are the DPD recordings/transcripts, which as far as time stamps go can not considered to be reliable according to Bowles, who actually was the man in charge of the DPD radio operators.

I would love to do a time trial, based on the actual witness testimonies and see what would be the result, but I seriously doubt that there will be one LN to go along with that.

[Bill Brown]

Whaleys manifest has Oswald in his taxi not later than 12:45 and this was in conflict with Roger Craig’s observation of Oswald at 12:45 at the SW corner of TSBD and him running to the rambler station wagon driven by DC man.

So the ticket would be useful (they thought)  to reinforce the Whaley taxi ride and a ticket added to Oswald’s shirt , so that Roger Craig whom had been a Deputy Sheriff of the Year, could be more effectively discredited.

But they got the wrong estimate (imo) on the shooting of Tippet occurring at 1:15 because maybe somebody thought ( (like Bill Brown 🤔) that the DOA 1:15 document meant the same thing as  a physician “estimate” of death and therefore Tippit died 1:15 at 10th and Patton)

IF however, Oswald did in fact tell Fritz about boarding a bus , and IF Oswald really did shoot Tippit, then is it reasonable to suspect that Oswald maybe just made that up to try To aid himself by discrediting ( in his mind) the Whaley taxi ride ( perhaps Oswald saw Whaley write in the 12:45 block of his manifest) by Oswald claiming to be on a bus getting a ticket at 12:45?

This is why I’d rather just disregard the bus ticket and Oswald on the bus as late as 12:43 as unsubstantiated and just go with Whaleys 15 minute variable 12:30-12:45 manifest block in which case it’s possible therefore that Oswald got in the taxi as early as 12:40.

Then the 1:07 timeline arrival to 10th and Patton works , the clocks and watches of Bowley and Markam don’t have be running 6 minutes slow, and Tippit is shot by 1:09 and the  Bowley call made at 1:10, and the ambulance dispatched gets to the scene by 1:12, loads the body in 30 seconds, returns to hospital by 1:14:30, unloads  body to emergency room in another 30 secs, where the doctor notes the time is 1:15 as he pronounces Tippit dead.

The police tapes tell you when the shots were fired and it was not before 1:09. For example, Domingo Benavides stated that after the killer went around the corner, he sat in his truck "for a second or two" (The Warren Report, part 3, CBS-TV, 1967) and then went over to the patrol car to report the shooting on the police radio. Benavides begins keying the mic at around 1:15/1:16. Do you believe Benavides cowered down inside his truck for 7 or 8 minutes?

By the way, Bowles says nothing about the tapes ever being off by as much as 7 or 8 minutes.

[Martin Weidmann]

The police tapes tell you when the shots were fired and it was not before 1:09. For example, Domingo Benavides stated that after the killer went around the corner, he sat in his truck "for a second or two" (The Warren Report, part 3, CBS-TV, 1967) and then went over to the patrol car to report the shooting on the police radio. Benavides begins keying the mic at around 1:15/1:16. Do you believe Benavides cowered down inside his truck for 7 or 8 minutes?

By the way, Bowles says nothing about the tapes ever being off by as much as 7 or 8 minutes.

A classic example of how the DPD recordings/transcripts trump everything else, when they really don't.

For example, Domingo Benavides stated that after the killer went around the corner, he sat in his truck "for a second or two" (The Warren Report, part 3, CBS-TV, 1967) and then went over to the patrol car to report the shooting on the police radio.

At other times he said several minutes..

Benavides begins keying the mic at around 1:15/1:16. Do you believe Benavides cowered down inside his truck for 7 or 8 minutes?

There is no conclusive evidence that Benavides begins keying the mic at around 1:15/1:16. That's just something Dale Myers concluded based on no evidence whatsoever.

By the way, Bowles says nothing about the tapes ever being off by as much as 7 or 8 minutes.

True.. he just said that operator's clocks would be off to the main clock in the office which in turn would be off by one or two minues to the main town hall clock, which in turn would be off from "real time"

Question for you, Bill; how can Tippit be pronounced dead at the hospital at 1:15 (confirmed by DPD officers that were present as well as the release for autopsy document) when he wasn't killed until 1:14 or 1:15 at 10th street?

[Duncan MacRae]

The police tapes tell you when the shots were fired and it was not before 1:09. For example, Domingo Benavides stated that after the killer went around the corner, he sat in his truck "for a second or two" (The Warren Report, part 3, CBS-TV, 1967) and then went over to the patrol car to report the shooting on the police radio. Benavides begins keying the mic at around 1:15/1:16. Do you believe Benavides cowered down inside his truck for 7 or 8 minutes?

By the way, Bowles says nothing about the tapes ever being off by as much as 7 or 8 minutes.

[John Mytton]

Then the 1:07 timeline arrival to 10th and Patton works , the clocks and watches of Bowley and Markam don’t have be running 6 minutes slow, and Tippit is shot by 1:09 and the  Bowley call made at 1:10, and the ambulance dispatched gets to the scene by 1:12, loads the body in 30 seconds, returns to hospital by 1:14:30, unloads  body to emergency room in another 30 secs, where the doctor notes the time is 1:15 as he pronounces Tippit dead.

You've got, Zeon. There's a mountain of evidence that places Tippit's shooting somewhere between 1:08 and 1:10 and the only thing that does not compute with that are the DPD recordings/transcripts, which as far as time stamps go can not considered to be reliable according to Bowles, who actually was the man in charge of the DPD radio operators.

I would love to do a time trial, based on the actual witness testimonies and see what would be the result, but I seriously doubt that there will be one LN to go along with that.

Martin, it doesn't matter what time people guessed, the eyewitness testimony clearly says that Tippit's murderer was Oswald!

Mr. BELIN - You used the name Oswald. How did you know this man was Oswald?
Mr. BENAVIDES - From the pictures I had seen. It looked like a guy, resembled the guy. That was the reason I figured it was Oswald.

Mr. BELIN. Did you see anything else as you heard her screaming?
Mrs. V DAVIS. Well, we saw Oswald. We didn't know it was Oswald at the time. We saw that boy cut across the lawn emptying the shells out of the gun.

Mr. BALL. Did you recognize anyone in that room?
Mrs. B DAVIS. Yes, sir. I recognized number 2.

Mr. CALLAWAY. No. And he said, "We want to be sure, we want to try to wrap him up real tight on killing this officer. We think he is the same one that shot the President. But if we can wrap him up tight on killing this officer, we have got him." So they brought four men in.
I stepped to the back of the room, so I could kind of see him from the same distance which I had seen him before. And when he came out, I knew him.
Mr. BALL. You mean he looked like the same man?
Mr. CALLAWAY. Yes.

Mr. BALL. Then what did you do?
Mr. GUINYARD. I was looking--trying to see and after I heard the third shot, then Oswald came through on Patton running---came right through the yard in front of the big white house---there's a big two-story white house---there's two of them there and he come through the one right on the corner of Patton.

Mr. LIEBELER. Let me show you some pictures that we have here. I show you a picture that has been marked Garner Exhibit No. 1 and ask you if that is the man that you saw going down the street on the 22d of November as you have already told us.
Mr.REYNOLDS. Yes.

Mr. BELIN. Four? Did any one of the people look anything like strike that. Did you identify anyone in the lineup?
Mr. SCOGGINS. I identified the one we are talking about, Oswald. I identified him.

RUSSELL positively identified a photograph of LEE HARVEY OSWALD, New Orleans Police Department # 112723, taken August 9, 1963, as being identical with the individual he had observed at the scene of the shooting of Dallas Police Officer J.D. TIPPIT on the afternoon of November 22, 1963, at Dallas, Texas.
 
Mr. BALL. What about number two, what did you mean when you said number two?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Number two was the man I saw shoot the policeman.

Oswald was also identified holding a gun.

Mr. BALL. Which way?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Towards Jefferson, right across that way.
Mr. DULLES. Did he have the pistol in his hand at this time?
Mrs. MARKHAM. He had the gun when I saw him.

Mr. BELIN - All right. Now, you said you saw the man with the gun throw the shells?
Mr. BENAVIDES - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Well, did you see the man empty his gun?
Mr. BENAVIDES - That is what he was doing. He took one out and threw it

Mr. BALL. And what did you see the man doing?
Mrs. DAVIS. Well, first off she went to screaming before I had paid too much attention to him, and pointing at him, and he was, what I thought, was emptying the gun.
Mr. BALL. He had a gun in his hand?
Mrs. DAVIS. Yes.

Mr. BELIN. Did you see anything else as you heard her screaming?
Mrs. DAVIS. Well, we saw Oswald. We didn't know it was Oswald at the time. We saw that boy cut across the lawn emptying the shells out of the gun.

Mr. BALL. And how was he holding the gun?
Mr. CALLAWAY. We used to say in the Marine Corps in a raised pistol position.

Mr. BALL. What did you see him doing?
Mr. GUINYARD. He came through there running and knocking empty shells out of his pistol and he had it up just like this with his hand.
Mr. BALL. With which hand?
Mr. GUINYARD. With his right hand; just kicking them out.
Mr. BALL. He had it up?

Mr. B.M. PATTERSON, 4635 Hartford Street, Dallas, Texas, currently employed by Wyatt's Cafeteria, 2647 South Lancaster, Dallas, Texas, advised he was present at the used car lot of JOHNNY REYNOLDS' on the afternoon of November 22, 1963.

PATTERSON advised that at approximately 1:30 PM, he was standing on JONNY REYNOLDS' used car lot together with L.J. LEWIS and HAROLD RUSSELL when they heard shots coming from the vicinity of 10th and Patton Avenue, Dallas, Texas. A minute or so later they observed a white male approximately 30 years of age, running south on Patton Avenue, carrying what appeared to be a revolver in his hand and was obviously trying to reload same while running.

Mr. LIEBELER. Did you see this man's face that had the gun in his hand?
Mr.REYNOLDS. Very good.

HAROLD RUSSELL, employee, Johnny Reynolds Used Car Lot, 500 Jefferson Street, Dallas, Texas, advised that on the afternoon of November 22, 1963, he was standing on the lot of Reynolds Used Cars together with L.J. LEWIS and PAT PATTERSON, at which time they heard shots come from the vicinity of Patton and Tenth Street, and a few seconds later they observed a young white man running south on Patton Avenue carrying a pistol or revolver which the individual was attempting to either reload or place in his belt line.

Mr. BELIN. Did he have anything in his hand?
Mr. SCOGGINS. He had a pistol in his left hand.

Jack Tatum
Next. this man with a gun in his hand ran toward the back of the squad car, but instead of running away he stepped into the street and shot the police officer who was lying in the street.

The Police Officers who were confronted with the murdering Oswald.

Mr. McDONALD - My left hand, at this point.
Mr. BALL - And had he withdrawn the pistol
Mr. McDONALD - He was drawing it as I put my hand.
Mr. BALL - From his waist?
Mr. McDONALD - Yes, sir.

Mr. BELIN. When you saw Oswald's hand by his belt, which hand did you see then?
Mr. WALKER. He had ahold of the handle of it.
Mr. BELIN. Handle of what?
Mr. WALKER. The revolver.
Mr. BELIN. Was there a revolver there?
Mr. WALKER. Yes; there was.

Mr. HUTSON. McDonald was at this time simultaneously trying to hold this person's right hand. Somehow this person moved his right hand to his waist, and I saw a revolver come out, and McDonald was holding on to it with his right hand, and this gun was waving up toward the back of the seat like this.

Oswald even admitted to various law enforcement officers that he was carrying a gun.

Mr. STERN - Was he asked whether he was carrying a pistol at the time he was in the Texas Theatre?
Mr. BOOKHOUT - Yes; that was brought up. He admitted that he was carrying a pistol at the time he was arrested.

Mr. McCLOY. Was it a sharpshooter's or a marksman's? There are two different types, you know.
Mr. HOSTY. I believe it was a sharpshooter, sir. He then told Captain Fritz that he had been living at 1026 North Beckley, that is in Dallas, Tex., at 1026 North Beckley under the name O. H. Lee and not under his true name.
Oswald admitted that he was present in the Texas School Book Depository Building on the 22d of November 1963, where he had been employed since the 15th of October. Oswald told Captain Fritz that he was a laborer in this building and had access to the entire building. It had offices on the first and second floors with storage on third, fourth, fifth and sixth floors.
Oswald told Captain Fritz that he went to lunch at approximately noon on the 22d of November, ate his lunch in the lunchroom, and had gone and gotten a Coca Cola from the Coca Cola machine to have with his lunch. He claimed that he was in the lunchroom at the time President Kennedy passed the building.
He was asked why he left the School Book Depository that day, and he stated that in all the confusion he was certain that there would be no more work for the rest of the day, that everybody was too upset, there was too much confusion, so he just decided that there would be no work for the rest of the day and so he went home. He got on a bus and went home. He went to his residence on North Beckley, changed his clothes, and then went to a movie.
Captain Fritz asked him if he always carried a pistol when he went to the movie, and he said he carried it because he felt like it. He admitted that he did have a pistol on him at the time of his arrest, in this theatre, in the Oak Cliff area of Dallas. He further admitted that he had resisted arrest and had received a bump and a cut as a result of his resisting of arrest. He then denied that he had killed Officer Tippit or President Kennedy.

Mr. BALL. What did he say?
Mr. FRITZ. He told me he went over and caught a bus and rode the bus to North Beckley near where he lived and went by home and changed clothes and got his pistol and went to the show. I asked him why he took his pistol and he said, "Well, you know about a pistol; I just carried it." Let's see if I asked him anything else right that minute. That is just about it.

JohnM

[John Mytton]

1. Roberts didn't say Oswald was buttoning up a jacket but specifically testified that Oswald was "zipping up" a jacket.

2. Oswald was positively identified at or moving away from the Tippit crime scene while wearing a jacket.

3. Oswald was arrested without a jacket.

4. Oswald was positively identified as carrying a gun while at or moving away from the Tippit crime scene. Callaway said that while he was in the Marines, he described the way Oswald was holding the gun was what he recalled as the "the raised pistol position". Didn't Oswald receive Marine training?

5. The same parking lot where Oswald was seen entering, was later found to have a discarded jacket that Marina testified belonged to Oswald.
6. Oswald's jacket that Marina later proved was Oswald's was not long after filmed in the Parking lot.

7. Some members theorize that the Dallas Police without knowing that multiple Eyewitnesses saw Oswald wearing a jacket and/or that he was arrested without a jacket, took the jacket from Irving and placed it in the Parking lot? Talk about desperation based on stupidity.
8. The same shells that were discarded by Oswald at the crime scene Exclusively matched Oswald's revolver.

9. Out of the hundreds of square miles of Dallas, the only Police Officer shot in years, was a stone's throw from both Oswald's rooming house and the the Theater where Oswald was arrested.

10. Why would anybody else have any motive to kill Tippit who was the first Police Officer gunned down in Dallas for many years, but perhaps an escaping assassin would have reason to commit another murder.

11. After Oswald left the Rooming House and before Oswald was arrested, Tippit was killed.
12. Oswald's reason for being on the side streets, was obviously because after killing Kennedy, he was avoiding the main roads. Duh!
13. Oswald while being arrested tried to use the same revolver to kill more cops.
14. Oswald admitted to Fritz that he was carrying his revolver, ""Well, you know about a pistol; I just carried it."


JohnM

[Zeon Mason]

In that video clip of police guy in his black looking uniform holding what looks like a white jacket , the 2 cars in the background seem to  be the same white as the jacket.

Since Mr. Mytton  has previously suggested the jacket really is not white but is in fact a light GRAY, then since the 2 cars are the same tone as the jacket , then both of the cars must be light gray also?

Did Marina see the video of the officer holding the jacket and from that video she concluded that jacket was the light gray jacket belonging to Oswald?

[Zeon Mason]

If the DOA  1:15 time stamp is the Time Tippit was pronounced dead at the hospital , then Benavides did not wait 6 or 7 minutes in his truck.

Thank you Bill Brown for reinforcing the 1:07 Markam sighting of Oswald as the more probable time Oswald ( or similar looking man) arrived at 10th&Patton. 🙂