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Author Topic: The Simplest Conspiracy Theory  (Read 9330 times)

Online Dan O'meara

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Re: The Simplest Conspiracy Theory
« Reply #64 on: April 14, 2025, 09:23:56 AM »
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This is an interesting conundrum, I've speculated in the past that Oswald crossed the floor with his rifle just in case he came across another employee who was stopping his flight from the scene of the crime, but there is still questions and further speculation.

• Why didn't Oswald just leave the rifle in the sniper's nest because if he did come across another employee on this floor he could have kept going and just mumbled something like he did with Reid?
• Did Oswald leave the rifle at the opposite side of the floor to delay it's discovery and hence give him more time but would an extra hour or so make a real difference because the shells in the sniper's nest were already a bit of a give away?
• Why didn't Oswald take the rifle down the stairs but I guess if he was discovered by the cops this would mean instant death.

To me the first option seems to make the most sense, just get the heck out of there and leave any immediate connection far behind?

JohnM

An LNer could argue that Oswald carried the rifle as far as he did because he was wiping it clean of fingerprints as he was moving. He finished as he reached the top of the stairs and just placed the rifle in the most convenient spot.
Personally, I think Oswald was heading for the border as soon as he left the TSBD building so I don't see why he would need to wipe the rifle clean. The fact he'd 'fled the scene' was enough to nail him as prime suspect.

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Re: The Simplest Conspiracy Theory
« Reply #64 on: April 14, 2025, 09:23:56 AM »


Offline Lance Payette

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Re: The Simplest Conspiracy Theory
« Reply #65 on: April 14, 2025, 01:22:28 PM »
This is an interesting conundrum, I've speculated in the past that Oswald crossed the floor with his rifle just in case he came across another employee who was stopping his flight from the scene of the crime, but there is still questions and further speculation.

• Why didn't Oswald just leave the rifle in the sniper's nest because if he did come across another employee on this floor he could have kept going and just mumbled something like he did with Reid?
• Did Oswald leave the rifle at the opposite side of the floor to delay it's discovery and hence give him more time but would an extra hour or so make a real difference because the shells in the sniper's nest were already a bit of a give away?
• Why didn't Oswald take the rifle down the stairs but I guess if he was discovered by the cops this would mean instant death.

To me the first option seems to make the most sense, just get the heck out of there and leave any immediate connection far behind?

JohnM

Perhaps an even more interesting conundrum exists for CTers: Why didn't the evil conspirators who planted the rifle in the TSBD leave it in plain view in the sniper's nest? Why did they leave a problematical dented shell? Once again, diabolical geniuses at steps 1-3-5-7-9, bungling idiots (fortunately for CTers!) at steps 2-4-6-8-10.

Online John Mytton

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Re: The Simplest Conspiracy Theory
« Reply #66 on: April 14, 2025, 02:10:34 PM »
Perhaps an even more interesting conundrum exists for CTers: Why didn't the evil conspirators who planted the rifle in the TSBD leave it in plain view in the sniper's nest? Why did they leave a problematical dented shell? Once again, diabolical geniuses at steps 1-3-5-7-9, bungling idiots (fortunately for CTers!) at steps 2-4-6-8-10.

Some very good points.

If I was a conspirator I would have half a dozen people "positively identify" Oswald in the Sniper's nest, then it's game over and we wouldn't be here!
Well, actually, come to think about it, there would be CT's like Iacoletti and Weidmann who would screech "unfair line-ups", Oswald's rifle "LOL", etc etc.
So applying this logic to the real World, I guess even if Oswald was positively identified by half of Dallas while Oswald was pulling the trigger, it wouldn't mean much. -sigh-

JohnM
« Last Edit: April 14, 2025, 02:33:06 PM by John Mytton »

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Re: The Simplest Conspiracy Theory
« Reply #66 on: April 14, 2025, 02:10:34 PM »


Online Richard Smith

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Re: The Simplest Conspiracy Theory
« Reply #67 on: April 14, 2025, 03:20:56 PM »
This is an interesting conundrum, I've speculated in the past that Oswald crossed the floor with his rifle just in case he came across another employee who was stopping his flight from the scene of the crime, but there is still questions and further speculation.

• Why didn't Oswald just leave the rifle in the sniper's nest because if he did come across another employee on this floor he could have kept going and just mumbled something like he did with Reid?
• Did Oswald leave the rifle at the opposite side of the floor to delay it's discovery and hence give him more time but would an extra hour or so make a real difference because the shells in the sniper's nest were already a bit of a give away?
• Why didn't Oswald take the rifle down the stairs but I guess if he was discovered by the cops this would mean instant death.

To me the first option seems to make the most sense, just get the heck out of there and leave any immediate connection far behind?

JohnM

I agree that Oswald carries his rifle until he is near the stairway in case he needs to use it to escape the floor.   For all he knows, maybe someone else was on the floor and heard the shots.  Once he is on his way down the stairs, he is just another employee in the building.  My guess is that he carried around the clipboard to linger on the floor before the assassination to make it look as though he had a job-related reason to be there.  He puts the clipboard down when retrieving his rifle.  Which means the rifle was likely hid in a similar place before and after the assassination.   Oswald knows there is no getting away with this crime.  Hiding the rifle just buys him a little time.   This is where CTers ask why he tried to escape if he knew that the police were going to capture or kill him.   I can only say that he had nothing to lose by playing out his hand.  Almost every criminal does so no matter how hopeless the situation.  Oswald was likely surprised he got out of the building.   If he had any plan, it is to head toward the border on a bus.  He is familiar with that drill.  It's not impossible that he could have done so given several hours head start.  Encountering Tippit was fatal.  After that, Oswald is just moving in the direction of least resistance.  Entering the movie theatre would have been a good move if he had bought a ticket and not drawn the attention of bystanders.   
« Last Edit: April 14, 2025, 03:22:20 PM by Richard Smith »

Offline Zeon Mason

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Re: The Simplest Conspiracy Theory
« Reply #68 on: April 15, 2025, 02:57:15 AM »
At the very least, Oswald’s weird behavior at Brewers store ie: just stopping inside the door but not going to look at merchandise, is the 1st indication that Oswald was fearing to be seen by police cars.

Then Oswald going past the ticket booth without stopping to look at the police cars going back and forth as Julia Postal and other people were doing, is further reason to believe Oswald was fearing being seen by police cars, and wanted to hide asap.

Oswald was not wearing a jacket when seen by Brewer at approx 1:30pm, nor when Oswald was seen by Brewer going past the ticket booth as Brewer followed Oswald.

Add the witness Markam at the Tippit scene pointing out Oswald as the man she saw shooting Tippit ( she saw his face close up) it gets a little difficult to counter the scenario that Oswald shot Tippit while wearing a jacket, then fled the scene , and ditched the jacket.

The only CT alternative I ever read on this forum to attempt to explain Oswald in front of Brewers store not wearing a jacket , was by Alan Ford.

The basic scenario was that Oswald had never gone to McWatters bus, and instead he had gone straight to Whaleys Taxi , entering it at about 12:40. That allowed Oswald to have entered his boarding house as early as 12:52.

Oswald changed from his reddish brown shirt to his other brown shirt with the hole in the sleeve and put on his blue jacket. He exited the boarding house about 4 minutes later at 12:56.

Oswald then walked to  the Texas theater  arriving there at 12:14. He bought a ticket and went in to the concession stand and bought popcorn from Butch Burroughs at 12:15. Oswald  then moved around to several different seats, sitting in one by Jack Davis at about 1:20 possibly ( Davis not exactly certain of the time but estimated 1:20)

Oswald then took off his  blue jacket, leaving it in the seat, and exited  the theater to walk over to Brewers store to look at some shoes since the movie was not going to start for another 15 minutes. Oswald then returned to the theatre about 1:35, not stopping by the ticket booth because he had already paid for a ticket earlier.

The rest of this Alan Ford  CT scenario gets even more improbable with the explanation for the revolver in McDonalds hands and how that revolver was linked to bullets and shells and how it was all planted after the fact.And the light gray jacket was taken from Oswald’s room and planted while his blue jacket which was left in the theater, moved to the Domino room of TSBD a month later ( for some reason?)

It’s about as bizarre a CT theory as Fords
“Oswald out front burning a flag by the mail box”scenario and  Baker originally running towards the mailbox until he changed his mind and went up the TSBD steps. 🙄

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Re: The Simplest Conspiracy Theory
« Reply #68 on: April 15, 2025, 02:57:15 AM »


Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: The Simplest Conspiracy Theory
« Reply #69 on: April 16, 2025, 12:12:30 AM »
He chose a floor where a floor laying crew was working and where boxes were piled high to one side. He created a nest of sorts with the boxes. He did fire with three TSBD employees directly under the window from which he was firing. I don't think he "quickly snuck upstairs" or "realized he had a chance." I think he was in place with sufficient time to carry out his act. I don't think it would have made the slightest difference to him if there had been employees on the 6th floor. Once the decision was made, he was going to shoot JFK, period. What he would have done after the shooting if there had been employees up there - shoot them (I doubt it), shot himself (unlikely), left the floor brandishing the gun (possible) - is anyone's guess. He may have carried the rifle as far as he did precisely because he wasn't sure he was alone. Nothing about the circumstances suggests to me the mindset of "I'll shoot JFK only if the coast is clear and I have a realistic chance of walking out of here alive."

An even cooler story than Graves'!  You all are very imaginative.

Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: The Simplest Conspiracy Theory
« Reply #70 on: April 16, 2025, 12:15:48 AM »
Perhaps an even more interesting conundrum exists for CTers: Why didn't the evil conspirators who planted the rifle in the TSBD leave it in plain view in the sniper's nest? Why did they leave a problematical dented shell? Once again, diabolical geniuses at steps 1-3-5-7-9, bungling idiots (fortunately for CTers!) at steps 2-4-6-8-10.

Trying to have it both ways, take 9999999.

If the evidence were solid, Oswald did it.

If the evidence is weak, contradictory, and problematical, Oswald did it.

Online Tom Graves

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Re: The Simplest Conspiracy Theory
« Reply #71 on: April 16, 2025, 12:51:51 AM »
If the evidence is weak, contradictory, and problematical, Oswald did it. (sarcasm)

The evidence against the former sharpshooting Marine and self-described Marxist, Lee Harvey Oswald, may seem contradictory and problematical at times, Iacoletti, but how is it weak?

In lieu of a more rational "theory," i.e., one that doesn't require the witting participation of lots of evil, evil bad guys and really, really bad gals, yeah, Oswald did it.

What rational theory have you come up with so far, Iacoletti?
« Last Edit: April 16, 2025, 12:54:16 AM by Tom Graves »

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Re: The Simplest Conspiracy Theory
« Reply #71 on: April 16, 2025, 12:51:51 AM »