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Author Topic: Why Was Oswald's Military Spy Plane Knowledge Considered Of No Value To USSR ?  (Read 3904 times)

Online Watson Phillips

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October 1956 - Oswald enlists in the Marine Corp and specializes in aircraft surveillance and use of radar. Is designated aviation electronics operator.

September 1957 - Oswald is transferred to Atsugi Naval Air Facility in Japan. The U2 spy plane is operating out of Atsugi at this time.

October 1959 - Oswald defects to the USSR.

October 31, 1959 - Oswald goes to US embassy in Moscow to renounce his US citizenship and tells embassy staff he is going to tell the Soviets what he knows about his time as a radar operator in the Marines.

May 1, 1960 - Francis Gary Powers takes off on a U2 mission from Pakistan to flyover the USSR and is shot down by surface to air missiles.

June 1, 1962 - Oswald returns to the US and is given a $435 loan by the embassy.


Did Oswald provide valuable information about the U2 program to the USSR that allowed them to track and shoot down Powers U2 flight? It seems possible yet no one ever discusses this possibility. You would think someone in USGOV would have been suspicious of a marine defector to the USSR on this timeline after the Powers shootdown. Yet - Oswald is allowed to return to the US and given a loan to do so. How did this not set off some type of alarm bells? We know the CIA / FBI were aware of him - but was he ever interrogated on his return about sharing U2 program secrets? If not - why not? If so, where is that record?


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Offline Steve M. Galbraith

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October 1956 - Oswald enlists in the Marine Corp and specializes in aircraft surveillance and use of radar. Is designated aviation electronics operator.

September 1957 - Oswald is transferred to Atsugi Naval Air Facility in Japan. The U2 spy plane is operating out of Atsugi at this time.

October 1959 - Oswald defects to the USSR.

October 31, 1959 - Oswald goes to US embassy in Moscow to renounce his US citizenship and tells embassy staff he is going to tell the Soviets what he knows about his time as a radar operator in the Marines.

May 1, 1960 - Francis Gary Powers takes off on a U2 mission from Pakistan to flyover the USSR and is shot down by surface to air missiles.

June 1, 1962 - Oswald returns to the US and is given a $435 loan by the embassy.


Did Oswald provide valuable information about the U2 program to the USSR that allowed them to track and shoot down Powers U2 flight? It seems possible yet no one ever discusses this possibility. You would think someone in USGOV would have been suspicious of a marine defector to the USSR on this timeline after the Powers shootdown. Yet - Oswald is allowed to return to the US and given a loan to do so. How did this not set off some type of alarm bells? We know the CIA / FBI were aware of him - but was he ever interrogated on his return about sharing U2 program secrets? If not - why not? If so, where is that record?
A Soviet military intelligence officer and double agent, Pyotr Popov, told the CIA in 1958 that the Soviets had acquired operational details of the U2. According to the accounts when the CIA was told about it they were stunned. If you do a search for: "Pyotr Popov and U-2" you'll get the details.

Short version: Oswald didn't have any information that the Soviets already knew.

And if you read the Epstein book "Legend", you'll learn that Oswald didn't know much about the U2 that the other Marines in his unit didn't know. They - Oswald and his fellow radar operators - watched the U2 take off on their screens and then land. Soviet radar operators could see much of this too (except for the landing/taking off).
« Last Edit: April 08, 2025, 12:55:52 AM by Steve M. Galbraith »

Online Charles Collins

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I am going from memory only, so I could be mistaken. But I seem to remember that when the U.S. military learned of LHO's "defection" they changed all the friend/foe identification codes that aircraft used when approaching U.S. controlled air spaces. Those codes were supposedly considered the most sensitive information that LHO might be able to share with the Soviets. By changing those codes, they believed that they eliminated the main threat that LHO's defection posed. I would think it would be prudent to change those codes routinely every so often anyway, regardless of any potential leaks. So, I suspect this wasn't a big deal to them.

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Offline Steve M. Galbraith

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I am going from memory only, so I could be mistaken. But I seem to remember that when the U.S. military learned of LHO's "defection" they changed all the friend/foe identification codes that aircraft used when approaching U.S. controlled air spaces. Those codes were supposedly considered the most sensitive information that LHO might be able to share with the Soviets. By changing those codes, they believed that they eliminated the main threat that LHO's defection posed. I would think it would be prudent to change those codes routinely every so often anyway, regardless of any potential leaks. So, I suspect this wasn't a big deal to them.
Yes, the "assistant operations officer" of Oswald's unit at the time, John Donovan, said they had to change all of the IFF codes. But they would do that periodically anyway.

WC testimony:
Mr. DONOVAN. I recall that he got a hardship discharge. We offered to get him a flight---that is a hop from El Toro to some place in Texas, his home. He refused. We considered that normal in that if you take a hop you sacrifice your transportation pay. We offered to take him to a bus or train station. He refused. But that is not particularly unusual, either.
I recall that he was gone for some period of time, and shortly before I got out of the Marine Corps, which was mid-December 1959, we received word that he had showed up in Moscow. This necessitated a lot of change of aircraft call signs, codes, radio frequencies, radar frequencies.

He had the access to the location of all bases in the west coast area, all radio frequencies for all squadrons, all tactical call signs, and the relative strength of all squadrons, number and type of aircraft in a squadron, who was the commanding officer, the authentication code of entering and exiting the ADIZ, which stands for Air Defense Identification Zone. He knew the range of our radar. He knew the range of our radio. And he knew the range of the surrounding units' radio and radar.
If you had asked me a month after I left that area, I could not have told you any but our own. Had I wanted to record them, I certainly could have secretly, and taken them with me. Unless he intentionally with malice aforethought wrote them down, I doubt if he would have been able to recall them a month later, either.

Mr. ELY. You recall that various codes were changed. Now, at what level were these changed? Was this an action of your specific unit, or a fairly widespread action?
Mr. DONOVAN. Well, I did not witness the changing in any other squadrons, but it would have to be, because the code is obviously between two or more units. Therefore, the other units had to change it. These codes are a grid, and two lines correspond.
And he gives the grid that you want, and he reads back "AB," or whatever the reply is supposed to be, the authentication is supposed to be.
Mr. ELY. Are authentication codes changed from time to time as a matter of course?
Mr. DONOVAN. They are changed from time to time, that is right.

« Last Edit: April 08, 2025, 01:08:43 AM by Steve M. Galbraith »

Offline Steve M. Galbraith

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The HSCA asked the Justice Department why they didn't prosecute Oswald for providing classified information to the Soviets. They said they concluded that they had no evidence to present to the Court that he violated the law. Oswald later denied giving any information to the Soviets and the Justice Department had nothing to indicate otherwise other than his earlier threat to do so.

Here's what they told the HSCA:





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Online Charles Collins

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Thanks for both of the above replies Steve. That’s some good information.

Online Watson Phillips

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A Soviet military intelligence officer and double agent, Pyotr Popov, told the CIA in 1958 that the Soviets had acquired operational details of the US. According to the accounts when the CIA was told about it they were stunned. If you do a search for: "Pyotr Popov and U-2" you'll get the details.

Short version: Oswald didn't have any information that the Soviets already knew.

And if you read the Epstein book "Legend", you'll learn that Oswald didn't know much about the U2 that the other Marines in his unit didn't know. They - Oswald and his fellow radar operators - watched the U2 take off on their screens and then land. Soviet radar operators could see much of this too (except for the landing/taking off).

Thanks Steve,
So does that mean the Soviets know nothing, or everything about Oswald's background when he showed up on their doorstep ?
Would he have been given a through interrogation by the soviets on his history before he was allowed to stay ?
Given Oswald's known desire to be someone of importance I find it hard to believe that Oswald wanting to show his importance & communist loyalty would not have hinted that he knew some things of value that they did not, and hinting at that they would not have satisfied themselves that he either did or did not .
Don't you think ?
Why were they so eager to get rid of Oswald after he had been there so long ?
Did they consider his military background to be a ploy he was sent to them with ?
Did this fellow Popov say anything about these other issues ?


Offline Steve M. Galbraith

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Yuri Nosenko said the Soviets didn't know he had any connection with the U-2 flights and apparently Oswald didn't admit to. However, I've also read that they did ask him about the U-2 and supposedly he gave them information they already knew. So who knows?

Mr. KLEIN. Who [Oswald] had been a radar operator and had worked on a base from which U-2 airplanes took off and landed, that he wasn't even interesting enough for the KGB to speak to him, to find out if he knew any of this information?
Mr. NOSENKO. Mr. Klein, I understand your position, but we didn't know that he had any connection with U-2 flights. That is one thing. And if you, Mr. Klein, are basing on what was written by Mr. Epstein in the book, it is a little bit from the air taken ideas. Mr. Epstein even telling that how important for KGB to know about such base that base. We knew it in the fifties when I worked in GRU at the Navy, in 1950, 1951, 1952. We knew every base and in Japan, at this Atsugi base, and we knew what kind of airplanes had been. We didn't know about U-2, no. Sure, it is very interesting, but when Oswald applied, requested to stay in the Soviet Union, we didn't know a word about his knowledge, anything concerning U-2 flights.
Mr. KLEIN. And you didn't ask him if he had any kind of information about that when he wanted to defect, is that correct ?
Mr. NOSENKO. No.
« Last Edit: April 08, 2025, 01:45:36 AM by Steve M. Galbraith »

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