There was No Roll Call at the TSBD !

[Walt Cakebread]

What do you note Walt that is not true in this FBI report?

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10730&relPageId=15&search=norman]

Compare that to what he told the WC:

Mr. BALL - Were you with anybody when you were at the window? Did you talk to anybody?
Mr. JARMAN - No; I did not.
Mr. BALL - Were you with anybody when you were walking around finishing your sandwich?
Mr. JARMAN - No; I wasn't, I was trying to get through so I could get out on the street.
Mr. BALL - Did you see Lee Oswald?
Mr. JARMAN - No; I didn't.
Mr. BALL - After his arrest, he stated to a police officer that he had had lunch with you. Did you have lunch with him?
Mr. JARMAN - No, sir; I didn't.
Mr. BALL - When you finished your sandwich and your bottle of pop, what did you do?
Mr. JARMAN - I throwed the paper that I had the sandwich in in the box over close to the telephone and I took the pop bottle and put it in the case over by the Dr. Pepper machine.
Mr. BALL - And then what did you do?
Mr. JARMAN - Then I went out in front of the building.
Mr. BALL - With who?
Mr. JARMAN - Harold Norman, Bonnie Ray, and Danny Arce and myself.
Mr. BALL - You say Bonnie Ray Williams?
Mr. JARMAN - Bonnie Ray Williams.
Mr. BALL - Do you remember him going with you?
Mr. JARMAN - No; I am sorry. Excuse me, but it was Harold Norman and myself and Daniel Arce.

What do you note Walt that is not true in this FBI report?

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10730&relPageId=15&search=norman]

Tony, I don't believe the report is so much " untrue" but it is totally inaccurate..... which makes it untrue....

I believe that Norman and Jarman did eat lunch together in the Domino Room at about noon....but Williams did not go outside with Jarman and Norman....  Why Williams went up to the sixth floor??  I don't know....But, I suspect that he was being set up as an accomplice  to be found dead up there after the coup d e'tat.

Williams was a young naive kid who would have done what he was told to do by Roy Truly, or Bill Shelley....If one of them had told him that they had a task for him, and they wanted  to go up to the sixth floor and wait for them ....He would have complied without question......

[Jack Nessan]

Rowland did exaggerate.....BRW's age. Why do Jarman and Norman get away with repeatedly lying about Williams being with them on the elevator ascent up until their appearances before the WC? How come they get a free pass?

It wasn't quite that benign. Rowland states he seen a person hanging out the window. How would he know how tall that person was how much he weighed. He also describes him as balding with gray hair and a wrinkled face. Quite a description about someone that earlier in his statement he wasn't sure of anything about the person including his race.

[Jack Nessan]

You can go through any WC testimony and find errors and conflicting pieces of information. Why didn't the WC simply ask Arnold for clarification if they were unsure about something? He was a witness and not a suspect of any crime.

As a comparison.

Arent you the one claiming that every witness who heard three shots were in error? So is everyone now embellishing their statement? It was the WC who asked Rowland the questions not the other way around.

If you filter Rowland's testimony down to its fundamental core, without any embellishments, he saw two people on the 6th floor, one an armed white male and the other an unarmed Negro gentleman. We know there was an unarmed Negro gentleman on the 6th floor. That was FACT.

The WC was also aware of this fact but somehow were not able to see the connection. Sure, Rowland added way too much detail but the fundamentals were there. TWO people on the 6TH floor at the same time.

You are trying to make a silk purse out of a sows ear with Rowland. The only person who discredited Rowland's testimony is Arnold himself.  By the end of Rowlands testimony with the WC, Arnold had managed to destroy any credibility he had as a witness or even that he had seen a gunman on the 6th floor at all.
Unknown to Arnold the window starts 14 inches above the floor and the window completely open only measures 30 inches above the sill. Rowland describes seeing the gunman from just above his knees to several feet above his head. That is impossible in a 2 and 1/2 foot opening.
The open window Rowland supposedly seen the gunman is less than  4 feet high  from the floor with a two and 1/2 foot opening when the window is wide open. The window sill is one foot and four inches from the floor. It is the same window as the window in the SN.



Mr. SPECTER - You say you only saw a small portion of what?
Mr. ROWLAND - Of his pants from his waist down.
Mr. SPECTER - Which half of the window was open, the bottom half or the top half?
Mr. ROWLAND - It was the bottom half.
Mr. SPECTER - And how much, if any, of his body was obscured by the window frame from that point down to the floor?
Mr. ROWLAND - From where I was standing I could see from his head to about 6 inches below his waist, below his belt.
Mr. SPECTER - Could you see as far as his knees?
Mr. ROWLAND - No.



Mr. SPECTER - How much of the rifle was separated from your line of vision by the window?
Mr. ROWLAND - The entire rifle was in my view.
Mr. SPECTER - In the open part of the window?
Mr. ROWLAND - Yes.
Mr. SPECTER - And how much of his body, if any, was in the open view where there was no window between your eyes and the object of his body?
Mr. ROWLAND - Approximately two-thirds of his body just below his waist.
Mr. SPECTER - Up to what point?
Mr. ROWLAND - Mid point between the waist and the knees, this is again in my proportion to his height that I make that judgment.
Mr. SPECTER - So from the waist, some point between his knees and his waist, you started to see hi clear in the window?
Mr. ROWLAND - Yes.
Mr. SPECTER - And from that point how far up his body were you able to see without any obstruction of a window between you and him?
Mr. ROWLAND - To the top of his head. There was some space on top of that where I could see the wall behind him.
Mr. SPECTER - What is your best estimate of the space between the top of his head and the open window at the perspective you were observing?
Mr. ROWLAND - Two and a half, three feet, something on that--that is something very hard to ascertain. That would just be an estimation on my part.

A hunting rifle is at least 40+ inches long


Mr. SPECTER - How much, if any, or all of that rifle could you see?
Mr. ROWLAND - All of it.
Mr. SPECTER - You could see from the base of the stock down to the tip of the end of the rifle?
Mr. ROWLAND - Yes.
Mr. SPECTER - The barrel of the rifle?



Arnold's little story to his wife ended up taking on a life of its own and he was caught up in it. Time and time again Arnold shows he doesn't have the correct description of how the person should have appeared in the window no matter were the gunman was standing in the room. He is both describing the person as if he is standing next to the window and also far back into the room. At no point in time is Rowland properly describing what the gunman would have appeared to look like in the window with a 30 inch opening. That is what Specter and the WC discovered in the course of his interview. Rowland was repeatedly shown to be fabricating his story and had absolutely no credibility as a witness.

[Walt Cakebread]

Don't worry abou humiliating yourself. Go to any sporting goods store and tell them you would like to purchase a 30 odd six rifle and a box of 30 odd six ammunition.

99% of the proprietors of a gun shop / sporting goods store would probably say..... "Oh, believe you mean a thirty aught six rifle an ammunition"....

A rifle built to fire the .30-06 Springfield cartridge can be referred to by many different names.....Such rifles are commonly referred to as simply an "Aught Six"....   but some folks call their rifle a "thirty aught six"....or a "thirty odd six"....   The term "odd six" is generally used by folks who don't know that the word "aught" was once commonly used in place of the more modern word "zero"...   and they think that the word "odd" is the correct word......

[Walt Cakebread]

Yes we do and further we know that BRW went down to the fifth floor because he heard "movement" coming from the floor below. The issue being was that Norman and Jarman didn't arrive to the 5th floor until at least 12.25 pm - a time that mirrored when Arnold no longer saw the Negro gentleman in the SE corner of the 6th floor.



The HSCA did not call up BRW. 

Remarkable.

 we know that BRW went down to the fifth floor because he heard "movement" coming from the floor below.

I don't believe that Williams heard " movement" or voices on the floor Below ....Because Williams was at the east end of the sixth floor and Norman and Jarman were opening windows at the west end of the fifth floor which was  about 90 feet away from Williams.   I do believe that Williams heard the elevator stop on the fifth floor and he may have thought that the person with the authority who had told him to go up to the sixth floor was on that elevator.....

[Jack Nessan]

What exactly do you think his contribution is?

If you can show that LHO was the shooter then explain it.

Brennan stated he seen the gunman firing from the 6th floor of the TSBD and like so many other eyewitnesses stated that there was only two shots. An examination of CE 543 and the other shells and compared to the chamber of the rifle can identify why CE43  lacks the indentation on the side of the shell that is present on all the other 35 shells examined and noted by Tink Thompson in his book Six Seconds in Dallas. Included in the group is the unfired cartridge CE141 which also possess the same indentation .

LHO is the most likely candidate- his rifle and pistol matched to the shells and bullets, his fingerprints, photos holding the rifle and pistol, shoots Tippit, Shoots at Walker, and caught trying to hide and escape.

[Walt Cakebread]

You are trying to make a silk purse out of a sows ear with Rowland. The only person who discredited Rowland's testimony is Arnold himself.  By the end of Rowlands testimony with the WC, Arnold had managed to destroy any credibility he had as a witness or even that he had seen a gunman on the 6th floor at all.
Unknown to Arnold the window starts 14 inches above the floor and the window completely open only measures 30 inches above the sill. Rowland describes seeing the gunman from just above his knees to several feet above his head. That is impossible in a 2 and 1/2 foot opening.
The open window Rowland supposedly seen the gunman is less than  4 feet high  from the floor with a two and 1/2 foot opening when the window is wide open. The window sill is one foot and four inches from the floor. It is the same window as the window in the SN.



Mr. SPECTER - You say you only saw a small portion of what?
Mr. ROWLAND - Of his pants from his waist down.
Mr. SPECTER - Which half of the window was open, the bottom half or the top half?
Mr. ROWLAND - It was the bottom half.
Mr. SPECTER - And how much, if any, of his body was obscured by the window frame from that point down to the floor?
Mr. ROWLAND - From where I was standing I could see from his head to about 6 inches below his waist, below his belt.
Mr. SPECTER - Could you see as far as his knees?
Mr. ROWLAND - No.



Mr. SPECTER - How much of the rifle was separated from your line of vision by the window?
Mr. ROWLAND - The entire rifle was in my view.
Mr. SPECTER - In the open part of the window?
Mr. ROWLAND - Yes.
Mr. SPECTER - And how much of his body, if any, was in the open view where there was no window between your eyes and the object of his body?
Mr. ROWLAND - Approximately two-thirds of his body just below his waist.
Mr. SPECTER - Up to what point?
Mr. ROWLAND - Mid point between the waist and the knees, this is again in my proportion to his height that I make that judgment.
Mr. SPECTER - So from the waist, some point between his knees and his waist, you started to see hi clear in the window?
Mr. ROWLAND - Yes.
Mr. SPECTER - And from that point how far up his body were you able to see without any obstruction of a window between you and him?
Mr. ROWLAND - To the top of his head. There was some space on top of that where I could see the wall behind him.
Mr. SPECTER - What is your best estimate of the space between the top of his head and the open window at the perspective you were observing?
Mr. ROWLAND - Two and a half, three feet, something on that--that is something very hard to ascertain. That would just be an estimation on my part.

A hunting rifle is at least 40+ inches long


Mr. SPECTER - How much, if any, or all of that rifle could you see?
Mr. ROWLAND - All of it.
Mr. SPECTER - You could see from the base of the stock down to the tip of the end of the rifle?
Mr. ROWLAND - Yes.
Mr. SPECTER - The barrel of the rifle?



Arnold's little story to his wife ended up taking on a life of its own and he was caught up in it. Time and time again Arnold shows he doesn't have the correct description of how the person should have appeared in the window no matter were the gunman was standing in the room. He is both describing the person as if he is standing next to the window and also far back into the room. At no point in time is Rowland properly describing what the gunman would have appeared to look like in the window with a 30 inch opening. That is what Specter and the WC discovered in the course of his interview. Rowland was repeatedly shown to be fabricating his story and had absolutely no credibility as a witness.

By the end of Rowlands testimony with the WC, Arnold had managed to destroy any credibility he had as a witness or even that he had seen a gunman on the 6th floor at all.

No....That's what the slime Warren Commission lawyers had hoped they could do....ie; destroy Rowland's  account of seeing a man dressed in light colored clothing with a hunting ( aka sniper) rifle on the sixth floor just minutes prior to the coup d e'tat.....

[Colin Crow]

It wasn't quite that benign. Rowland states he seen a person hanging out the window. How would he know how tall that person was how much he weighed. He also describes him as balding with gray hair and a wrinkled face. Quite a description about someone that earlier in his statement he wasn't sure of anything about the person including his race.

But we know williams was there, his lunch was noticed there by all police first on the scene. Rowland merely confirms what should have been apparent. Williams was in the SN until about 12.25 or later.