Oswald's Shirt

[Richard Smith]

OMG another Kook who now claims that he is not a "conspiracy theorist"!? Hahahaha, you guys!



JohnM

Yes, all the evidence is suspect and the product of fakery and lies going back months or years but no one is suggesting or implying there was a conspiracy.  LOL.  No explanation for who or why all this evidence is fabricated.  It just is.  The dilemma for CTers is that they apply an impossible standard proof when it comes to Oswald's guilt.  As a result nothing, including their closet conspiracy fantasy, can ever be proved under that standard.  Thus, they have to deny that they are suggesting anything.  It's a lazy, cowardly, and bizarre way to approach this or any other matter but the only way they can avoid acknowledging that the evidence overwhelmingly proves Oswald's guilt.

[Michael Chambers]

Oswald was always from childhood a quiet thoughtful non aggressive person as all his relatives, friends and anyone that knew him would and has testified.

This is true right up till his untimely end and so there is no way he would hurt a fly. 

[Steve Logan]

Being warned by a LNer is akin to seeing a shark's fin while swimming in the surf...

Just because one knows and refers to your foolishness does not make one an LNer.

https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,99.msg1042.html#msg1042

[John Iacoletti]

Yes, all the evidence is suspect and the product of fakery and lies going back months or years but no one is suggesting or implying there was a conspiracy.

Who said that all the evidence is suspect and the product of fakery and lies going back months or years?  Do you ever get tired of just making sh!t up?

The dilemma for CTers is that they apply an impossible standard proof when it comes to Oswald's guilt.  As a result nothing, including their closet conspiracy fantasy, can ever be proved under that standard.

Spoken like a guy trying to make excuses for his inability to prove his case beyond anything even approaching a reasonable doubt.  It's the fault of everyone else for just not accepting it anyway.

[Walt Cakebread]

There was a thread on this last year. It got really interesting. There was a lot of linked material.
We can try and revive it....



At 12:44, 14 minutes after the shooting, Dallas Police Inspector J. Herbert Sawyer called in a description of the presumed assassin. He announced: "The wanted person in this is a slender white male about 30, 5 feet 10, 165, carrying what looks to be a 30-30 or some type of Winchester." He was then asked to confirm that this was a rifle. He responded: "A rifle, yes." He was then asked "Any clothing description?" He responded "Current witness can't remember that."

As a side note the "slender white male about 30, 5 feet 10, 165" is the same exact description...word for word... of a guy that was in Mexico City claiming to be Lee Oswald. The middle name was also given...but it was not Harvey...it was Henry*
Meanwhile back to the shirt...
Motorcycle Officer Marrion Baker, who?d encountered Oswald in a stairway within a minute and a half of the shooting, described Oswald's clothing as different than the man seen in the window (11-22-63 Affidavit, 24H199): ?The man I saw was a white man approximately 30 years old, 5?9?, 165 pounds, dark hair and wearing a light brown jacket.?

I just posted this under the Oswald's Jacket thread...
A statement from Wes Frazier's sister.....


       
The complete post is here..
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,124.msg16375.html#msg16375

There was this Mary Bledsoe woman who stated she was a former landlady of Oswald's.****************************************************************
Again asked about the shirt...************************************************************
This stuff about the shirt must have really bothered the Commission.
Ball would not let it go.Ball goes on and on...Enough for now about Bledsoe...
It continues like this for another page !!
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/bledsoe.htm



Was the shirt that Ms Randle saw, the same shirt that Patrolman Baker saw, & the same shirt that Ms Bledsoe saw which was the same shirt that Oswald was arrested in?
To be con't...all comments welcome.

Credit to Pat Speer's Threads of Evidence for picture links and some info.

Looks like the topic (The Shirt)  of the title of this thread has slipped.....Let's try to put it back on track and discuss the shirt .

Was the shirt that Ms Randle saw, the same shirt that Patrolman Baker saw, & the same shirt that Ms Bledsoe saw which was the same shirt that Oswald was arrested in?
To be con't...all comments welcome.

"Was the shirt that Ms Randle saw, the same shirt that Patrolman Baker saw",

Most probably,.....the shirt that LMR saw was the same shirt that Officer Marrion Baker saw .... And I assume that you're referring to the reddish brown SHIRT that Lee was wearing in the second floor lunchroom at 12:32 pm 11/22/63.    But this is NOT the tan (khaki) JACKET that Baker saw being worn by the man on either the third or fourth floor.

"the same shirt that Ms Bledsoe saw "

I don't believe Mrs Bledsoe....She was a senile old woman and I doubt that she was observant enough to know how Cecil Mc Watters was dressed.......

which was the same shirt that Oswald was arrested in?

Lee went to his room and changed his clothes.....IF Mrs Bledsoe made a mental note of the shirt....  that shirt would have been in the dresser in his room at 1026 N. Beckley and it was NOT the shirt that Lee was wearing at the theater. 

[Jerry Freeman]

Wes Frazier whom Oswald rode right next to on the trip to work couldn't seem to remember his shirt.

Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; I don't believe I have because most time I noticed when Lee had it, I say he put off his shirt and just wear a T-shirt the biggest part of the time so really what shirt he wore that day I really didn't see it or didn't pay enough attention to it whether he did have a shirt on.

Howard Brennan...claimed that the gunman was ?a white man in his early 30?s, slender, nice looking, slender and would weigh about 165 to 175 pounds. He had on light colored clothing?
...claimed that the man was standing up when aiming the rifle, but the sash window made this impossible; it was open only up to about waist height or knee high.
....was unable to pick out Oswald out of a line-up.
He was scared? Why? Probably more from the cops than a gang or from the boogie man.

Although the Warren Commission enthusiastically promoted Brennan as the star witness in its case against Oswald, the House Select Committee on Assassinations was more sceptical, and declined to use Brennan.

[Walt Cakebread]

Wes Frazier whom Oswald rode right next to on the trip to work couldn't seem to remember his shirt.Howard Brennan...claimed that the gunman was ?a white man in his early 30?s, slender, nice looking, slender and would weigh about 165 to 175 pounds. He had on light colored clothing?
...claimed that the man was standing up when aiming the rifle, but the sash window made this impossible; it was open only up to about waist height or knee high.
....was unable to pick out Oswald out of a line-up.
He was scared? Why? Probably more from the cops than a gang or from the boogie man.

Although the Warren Commission enthusiastically promoted Brennan as the star witness in its case against Oswald, the House Select Committee on Assassinations was more sceptical, and declined to use Brennan.

...claimed that the man was standing up when aiming the rifle, but the sash window made this impossible; it was open only up to about waist height or knee high.

but the sash window made this impossible;

Wait a minute.....What if Mr Brennan was not referring to the SE corner window?.....   And he wasn't...He said that he had seen the man in the light colored clothing behind the SE corner window BEFORE the motorcade arrived....NOT  during the shooting.  Read Brennan's original affidavit.....He clearly is NOT referring to the SE corner window as the place that he saw the man STANDING and aiming a HUNTING RIFLE from a window.

was unable to pick out Oswald out of a line-up.

This is dead wrong......He knew that Lee was the man that the cops wanted him to put the finger on because he'd seen the TV reports which showed Lee's photo and heard that Lee Harrrrrrvey Osssssswald ( booooo! Hissss!) was the villain.
BUT he DID identify recognize Lee Oswald in the line up.... but he told the cops that of those men in the line-up, Lee looked the most like the gunman...  but was NOT the gunman. 

[Jerry Freeman]

Arnold Rowland was interviewed by the FBI Nov 25 63
 

I looked toward the Texas School Book Depository which faces the South and is located on the corner of Elm and Houston. I observed the two rectangular windows at the extreme west end of the Texas School Book Depository next to the top floor were open. I saw what I believed to be a man standing about 12 to 15 feet back from the window on the right. He appeared to be slender in proportion to his height, was wearing a white or light colored shirt, either collarless or open at the neck. He appeared to have dark hair. He also appeared to holding a rifle with scope attached, in a ready position or in military terminology, port arms. I saw him only momentarily and he seemed to disappear in the shadows of the room.

H 16 p954