1
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Chris Scally
« Last post by Royell Storing on November 20, 2024, 06:58:06 PM »Relentlessly thorough researcher. He will be missed.
Recent Posts
Relentlessly thorough researcher. He will be missed.
2
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Who Shot Dallas Police Officer J D Tippit In Oak Cliff?
« Last post by Bill Brown on November 20, 2024, 02:11:20 PM »bill will you next be telling is one of your favorite lines where you say benavides identified oswald as tippits killer ? . you tried that before at different times . you know he never identified oswald at the time of the line ups nor during his testimony in 1964.
Mr. BENAVIDES - Later on that evening, about 4 o'clock, there was two officers came by and asked for me, Mr. Callaway asked me---I had told them that I had seen the officer, and the reporters were there and I was trying to hide from the reporters because they will just bother you all the time.
Then I found out that they thought this was the guy that killed the President. At the time I didn't know the President was dead or he had been shot.
I was just trying to hide from the reporters and everything, and these two officers came around and asked me if I'd seen him, and I told him yes, and told them what I had seen, and they asked me if I could identify him, and I said I don't think I could. It this time I was sure, I wasn't sure that I could or not. I wasn't going to say I could identify and go down and couldn't have.
Mr. BELIN - Did he ever take you to the police station and ask you if you could identify him?
Mr. BENAVIDES - No; they didn't.
but you did once try to claim he did identify oswald in testimony , because YOU SAID he mentioned oswald by name lol .
Mr. BELIN - What did you see then?
Mr. BENAVIDES - I then pulled on up and I seen this officer standing by the door.
The door was open to the car, and I was pretty close to him, and I seen Oswald, or the man that shot him,
standing on the other side of the car.
now lets read further .
Mr. BELIN - You used the name Oswald. How did you know this man was Oswald?
Mr. BENAVIDES - From the pictures I had seen. It looked like a guy, resembled the guy. That was the reason I figured it was Oswald.
Mr. BELIN - Were they newspaper pictures or television pictures, or both, or neither?
Mr. BENAVIDES - Well, television pictures and newspaper pictures. The thing lasted about a month, I believe, it seemed like.
so benavides did not identify oswald the day tippit was killed . he never went to a line up because he said quote " they asked me if I could identify him, and I said I don't think I could " .
but you did not stop there bill in the past did you ? . when the above failed you again claimed that benavides identified oswald . now we first need to mention the fact that you have said that statements made some time after the fact are unreliable , and usually you refuse to accept them . i recall you used that argument one time in relation to oswalds landlady earlene roberts . you said her statement about seeing a police car outside was only made about a week after the fact . but when it comes to witnesses who say that which you like you make an exception dont you ? . yes you accept a statement by benavides that oswald was the person who shot tippit . a statement given quite a few YEARS after the fact .
The only thing I've ever said about Benavides is that he uses the name Oswald in his testimony. I do not rely on him as a witness in an attempt to prove Oswald's guilt. All over the internet, I have listed the witnesses who positively identified Oswald as the cop-killer and I never include Benavides on that list.
3
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Chris Scally
« Last post by Bill Brown on November 20, 2024, 01:49:32 PM »I have heard that Chris Scally passed away last night 
4
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: U.S. Politics
« Last post by Royell Storing on November 19, 2024, 06:04:59 PM »The SS protection around Trump and Vance immediately needs to be air tight. Iran, Russia, the US Military Muckety-Mucks, and the rabid Dem Losers will do whatever it takes to prevent Trump/Vance from taking the oath of office and the reins of power. Trump's enjoying the atmosphere around a UFC Octagon may have ended.
5
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Who Shot Dallas Police Officer J D Tippit In Oak Cliff?
« Last post by Richard Smith on November 19, 2024, 04:38:35 PM »Oswald had so much bad luck that day according to CTers. He knocks off work after the assassination without asking permission. He gets his gun to go to the movies. He is the only person on planet Earth to be in TSBD at the moment shots were fired at the president who walks past the scene of the Tippit shooting (the only DPD officer to be murdered in a several year span) on his way to the movie. What are the odds? He looks so much like the real killer that multiple witnesses ID him as the shooter (or in pedantic CTer terms the guy holding the gun at the scene). He decides to ditch his jacket along the route. He pauses to do some window shopping and looks so suspicious that the salesman follows him. He sneaks into the movies without paying for his ticket. He decides to resist arrest and pull a gun when police approach him in the TT not waiting even for an explanation for what they want while shouting that "it's all over now." He has the same two brands of ammo on him when searched that were used to kill Tippit. So unlucky. LOL
6
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Who Shot Dallas Police Officer J D Tippit In Oak Cliff?
« Last post by Fergus O'Brien on November 19, 2024, 01:22:06 PM »bill will you next be telling is one of your favorite lines where you say benavides identified oswald as tippits killer ? . you tried that before at different times . you know he never identified oswald at the time of the line ups nor during his testimony in 1964.
Mr. BENAVIDES - Later on that evening, about 4 o'clock, there was two officers came by and asked for me, Mr. Callaway asked me---I had told them that I had seen the officer, and the reporters were there and I was trying to hide from the reporters because they will just bother you all the time.
Then I found out that they thought this was the guy that killed the President. At the time I didn't know the President was dead or he had been shot.
I was just trying to hide from the reporters and everything, and these two officers came around and asked me if I'd seen him, and I told him yes, and told them what I had seen, and they asked me if I could identify him, and I said I don't think I could. It this time I was sure, I wasn't sure that I could or not. I wasn't going to say I could identify and go down and couldn't have.
Mr. BELIN - Did he ever take you to the police station and ask you if you could identify him?
Mr. BENAVIDES - No; they didn't.
but you did once try to claim he did identify oswald in testimony , because YOU SAID he mentioned oswald by name lol .
Mr. BELIN - What did you see then?
Mr. BENAVIDES - I then pulled on up and I seen this officer standing by the door.
The door was open to the car, and I was pretty close to him, and I seen Oswald, or the man that shot him,
standing on the other side of the car.
now lets read further .
Mr. BELIN - You used the name Oswald. How did you know this man was Oswald?
Mr. BENAVIDES - From the pictures I had seen. It looked like a guy, resembled the guy. That was the reason I figured it was Oswald.
Mr. BELIN - Were they newspaper pictures or television pictures, or both, or neither?
Mr. BENAVIDES - Well, television pictures and newspaper pictures. The thing lasted about a month, I believe, it seemed like.
so benavides did not identify oswald the day tippit was killed . he never went to a line up because he said quote " they asked me if I could identify him, and I said I don't think I could " .
but you did not stop there bill in the past did you ? . when the above failed you again claimed that benavides identified oswald . now we first need to mention the fact that you have said that statements made some time after the fact are unreliable , and usually you refuse to accept them . i recall you used that argument one time in relation to oswalds landlady earlene roberts . you said her statement about seeing a police car outside was only made about a week after the fact . but when it comes to witnesses who say that which you like you make an exception dont you ? . yes you accept a statement by benavides that oswald was the person who shot tippit . a statement given quite a few YEARS after the fact .
Mr. BENAVIDES - Later on that evening, about 4 o'clock, there was two officers came by and asked for me, Mr. Callaway asked me---I had told them that I had seen the officer, and the reporters were there and I was trying to hide from the reporters because they will just bother you all the time.
Then I found out that they thought this was the guy that killed the President. At the time I didn't know the President was dead or he had been shot.
I was just trying to hide from the reporters and everything, and these two officers came around and asked me if I'd seen him, and I told him yes, and told them what I had seen, and they asked me if I could identify him, and I said I don't think I could. It this time I was sure, I wasn't sure that I could or not. I wasn't going to say I could identify and go down and couldn't have.
Mr. BELIN - Did he ever take you to the police station and ask you if you could identify him?
Mr. BENAVIDES - No; they didn't.
but you did once try to claim he did identify oswald in testimony , because YOU SAID he mentioned oswald by name lol .
Mr. BELIN - What did you see then?
Mr. BENAVIDES - I then pulled on up and I seen this officer standing by the door.
The door was open to the car, and I was pretty close to him, and I seen Oswald, or the man that shot him,
standing on the other side of the car.
now lets read further .
Mr. BELIN - You used the name Oswald. How did you know this man was Oswald?
Mr. BENAVIDES - From the pictures I had seen. It looked like a guy, resembled the guy. That was the reason I figured it was Oswald.
Mr. BELIN - Were they newspaper pictures or television pictures, or both, or neither?
Mr. BENAVIDES - Well, television pictures and newspaper pictures. The thing lasted about a month, I believe, it seemed like.
so benavides did not identify oswald the day tippit was killed . he never went to a line up because he said quote " they asked me if I could identify him, and I said I don't think I could " .
but you did not stop there bill in the past did you ? . when the above failed you again claimed that benavides identified oswald . now we first need to mention the fact that you have said that statements made some time after the fact are unreliable , and usually you refuse to accept them . i recall you used that argument one time in relation to oswalds landlady earlene roberts . you said her statement about seeing a police car outside was only made about a week after the fact . but when it comes to witnesses who say that which you like you make an exception dont you ? . yes you accept a statement by benavides that oswald was the person who shot tippit . a statement given quite a few YEARS after the fact .
7
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Who Shot Dallas Police Officer J D Tippit In Oak Cliff?
« Last post by Fergus O'Brien on November 19, 2024, 01:01:52 PM »William Whaley
Cab Driver
"He showed no respect for the policemen, he told them what he thought about them.
They knew what they were doing and they were trying to railroad him and he wanted his lawyer.
At that time he had on a pair of black pants and white T-shirt, that is all he had on.
But you could have picked him out without identifying him by just listening to him because he was bawling out the policeman,
telling them it wasn't right to put him in line with these teenagers and all of that and they asked me which one and I told them.
It was him all right, the same man."
And then Mr. Whaley says this:
Mr. WHALEY. I signed that statement before they carried me down to see the lineup.
I signed this statement, and then they carried me down to the lineup at 2:30 in the afternoon.
....and without even going off the record...Belin does his best to remain calm, keep his head on,
but never quite confirms what it is signed, that was not typed.
Mr. BELIN. Now, when you signed it--
what I want to know is, before you went down,
had they already put on there a statement that the man you saw was the No. 3 man in the lineup?
Mr. WHALEY. I don't remember that. I don't remember whether it said three or two, or what.
Mr. BELIN. Did they have any statements on there before you went down to the lineup?
Mr. WHALEY. I never saw what they had in there. It was all written out by hand. The statement I saw,
I think, was this one, and that could be writing.
I might not even seen this one yet. I signed my name because they said that is what I said.
Mr. Whaley goes on to explain that he was confused. That there was a hand written statement and a typed statement.
And he does say he also signed a hand written one. - or a blank one. It is unclear.
But this question will come again with another witness to the lineups.
A Mix, not a Match - Line Ups 1 and 2
Did the "fillers" resemble the descriptions of the killer as given by the witnesses?
credit and thanks to mr capasse for his work here .
Cab Driver
"He showed no respect for the policemen, he told them what he thought about them.
They knew what they were doing and they were trying to railroad him and he wanted his lawyer.
At that time he had on a pair of black pants and white T-shirt, that is all he had on.
But you could have picked him out without identifying him by just listening to him because he was bawling out the policeman,
telling them it wasn't right to put him in line with these teenagers and all of that and they asked me which one and I told them.
It was him all right, the same man."
And then Mr. Whaley says this:
Mr. WHALEY. I signed that statement before they carried me down to see the lineup.
I signed this statement, and then they carried me down to the lineup at 2:30 in the afternoon.
....and without even going off the record...Belin does his best to remain calm, keep his head on,
but never quite confirms what it is signed, that was not typed.
Mr. BELIN. Now, when you signed it--
what I want to know is, before you went down,
had they already put on there a statement that the man you saw was the No. 3 man in the lineup?
Mr. WHALEY. I don't remember that. I don't remember whether it said three or two, or what.
Mr. BELIN. Did they have any statements on there before you went down to the lineup?
Mr. WHALEY. I never saw what they had in there. It was all written out by hand. The statement I saw,
I think, was this one, and that could be writing.
I might not even seen this one yet. I signed my name because they said that is what I said.
Mr. Whaley goes on to explain that he was confused. That there was a hand written statement and a typed statement.
And he does say he also signed a hand written one. - or a blank one. It is unclear.
But this question will come again with another witness to the lineups.
A Mix, not a Match - Line Ups 1 and 2
Did the "fillers" resemble the descriptions of the killer as given by the witnesses?
credit and thanks to mr capasse for his work here .
8
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: U.S. Politics
« Last post by Richard Smith on November 19, 2024, 12:56:24 PM »Old Joe and Trudeau continue to be humiliated and disrespected at the G20. They even took the group photo without them. Incredible. I can understand why their weakness and incompetence is allowing for this, but it is still an insult to America. Meanwhile they are treating the president of China like royalty. Fortunately, change is coming in 60 days.
9
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Who Shot Dallas Police Officer J D Tippit In Oak Cliff?
« Last post by Fergus O'Brien on November 19, 2024, 12:42:43 PM »Mr. BALL. Now when you went into the room you looked these people over, these four men?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL. Did you recognize anyone in the lineup?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No, sir.
Mr. BALL. You did not? Did you see anybody--I have asked you that question before did you recognize anybody from their face?
Mrs. MARKHAM. From their face, no.
Mr. BALL. Did you identify anybody in these four people?
Mrs. MARKHAM. I didn't know nobody.
Mr. BALL. I know you didn't know anybody, but did anybody in that lineup look like anybody you had seen before?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No. I had never seen none of them, none of these men.
Mr. BALL. No one of the four?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No one of them.
Mr. BALL. No one of all four?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No, sir.
Mr. BALL. Was there a number two man in there?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Number two is the one I picked.
Mr. BALL. Well, I thought you just told me that you hadn't--
Mrs. MARKHAM. I thought you wanted me to describe their clothing.
Mr. BALL. No. I wanted to know if that day when you were in there if you saw anyone in there--
Mrs. MARKHAM. Number two.
Mr. BALL. What did you say when you saw number two?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Well, let me tell you. I said the second man, and they kept asking me which one, which one. I said, number two. When I said number two, I just got weak.
Mr. BALL. What about number two, what did you mean when you said number two?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Number two was the man I saw shoot the policeman.
Mr. BALL. You recognized him from his appearance?
Mrs. MARKHAM. I asked--I looked at him. When I saw this man I wasn't sure, but I had cold chills just run all over me.
Mr. BALL. When you saw him?
Mrs. MARKHAM. When I saw the man. But I wasn't sure, so, you see, I told them I wanted to be sure, and looked, at his face is what I was looking at, mostly is what I looked at, on account of his eyes, the way he looked at me. So I asked them if they would turn him sideways. They did, and then they turned him back around, and I said the second, and they said, which one, and I said number two. So when I said that, well, I just kind of fell over. Everybody in there, you know, was beginning to talk, and I don't know, just--
Mrs. MARKHAM. Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL. Did you recognize anyone in the lineup?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No, sir.
Mr. BALL. You did not? Did you see anybody--I have asked you that question before did you recognize anybody from their face?
Mrs. MARKHAM. From their face, no.
Mr. BALL. Did you identify anybody in these four people?
Mrs. MARKHAM. I didn't know nobody.
Mr. BALL. I know you didn't know anybody, but did anybody in that lineup look like anybody you had seen before?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No. I had never seen none of them, none of these men.
Mr. BALL. No one of the four?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No one of them.
Mr. BALL. No one of all four?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No, sir.
Mr. BALL. Was there a number two man in there?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Number two is the one I picked.
Mr. BALL. Well, I thought you just told me that you hadn't--
Mrs. MARKHAM. I thought you wanted me to describe their clothing.
Mr. BALL. No. I wanted to know if that day when you were in there if you saw anyone in there--
Mrs. MARKHAM. Number two.
Mr. BALL. What did you say when you saw number two?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Well, let me tell you. I said the second man, and they kept asking me which one, which one. I said, number two. When I said number two, I just got weak.
Mr. BALL. What about number two, what did you mean when you said number two?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Number two was the man I saw shoot the policeman.
Mr. BALL. You recognized him from his appearance?
Mrs. MARKHAM. I asked--I looked at him. When I saw this man I wasn't sure, but I had cold chills just run all over me.
Mr. BALL. When you saw him?
Mrs. MARKHAM. When I saw the man. But I wasn't sure, so, you see, I told them I wanted to be sure, and looked, at his face is what I was looking at, mostly is what I looked at, on account of his eyes, the way he looked at me. So I asked them if they would turn him sideways. They did, and then they turned him back around, and I said the second, and they said, which one, and I said number two. So when I said that, well, I just kind of fell over. Everybody in there, you know, was beginning to talk, and I don't know, just--
10
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Who Shot Dallas Police Officer J D Tippit In Oak Cliff?
« Last post by Bill Brown on November 19, 2024, 07:33:14 AM »William Scoggins Warren Commission testimony...
Mr. BELIN. How many people were in the lineup, if you can remember?
Mr. SCOGGINS. Four.
Mr. BELIN. Four? Did any one of the people look anything like strike that. Did you identify anyone in the lineup?
Mr. SCOGGINS. I identified the one we are talking about, Oswald. I identified him.
Mr. BELIN. How many people were in the lineup, if you can remember?
Mr. SCOGGINS. Four.
Mr. BELIN. Four? Did any one of the people look anything like strike that. Did you identify anyone in the lineup?
Mr. SCOGGINS. I identified the one we are talking about, Oswald. I identified him.