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Author Topic: Higgenbothan - Did he know Oswald?  (Read 4297 times)

Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: Higgenbothan - Did he know Oswald?
« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2021, 08:12:58 PM »
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Mr. Kurtz wrote an article on Oswald in 1980 (linked below) and supposedly later a book on the assassination (I can't find the source for this one). In neither publication did he mention seeing Oswald with Banister at any time. He does mention Oswald being seen by unnamed people with Banister. But again he himself is never mentioned as one of those sources.

It is only later in his 2013 book "Crime of the Century" that he says one of the sources was himself. I find it, well, strange that he wold never mention earlier that he HIMSELF saw Oswald with Banister.

It's certainly conceivable to me that Banister saw Oswald outside the Trade Mart distributing his flyers or advocating for Castro and was curious about him.  So wouldn't he talk to Oswald, try go find out what he was up to and who (if anyone) he was associated with? That is far different, of course, than what Kurtz said he saw them doing.

Banister's secretary and fiance Delphine Roberts told the Garrison investigators that he would often talk to groups on the left or right as part of his job gathering intelligence for his work. She also never mentioned during the interview seeing Banister with Oswald or him mentioning after the assassination about knowing Oswald. Years later however she said that Oswald regularly visited Banister's officer.

In any case, Kurtz's 1980 piece is here: http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/ngarchive/4231952.pdf

Years later however she said that Oswald regularly visited Banister's office.

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Re: Higgenbothan - Did he know Oswald?
« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2021, 08:12:58 PM »


Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: Higgenbothan - Did he know Oswald?
« Reply #9 on: February 28, 2021, 08:17:57 PM »
Ironically, Jack Martins is strong proof that Oswald never set foot in Bannisters office. After the assassination on Nov 25th and Nov 27th, Jack Martins gave two statements to the FBI in which he was bending over backwards trying to tie Ferrie to Oswald. Here are the two statements: https://www.jfk-online.com/jpsjmfbi63.html 

If Oswald had been in Bannisters office and had met with both Bannister and Ferrie (as Martins said to Jim Garrison - see below), wasn't the Nov 25th 1963 FBI statement Martins gave the perfect time to tell the FBI that Oswald had been Bannisters officer and had met with both Bannister and Ferrie? The very fact Martins makes no mention of Bannister anywhere in the FBI statement (even though Bannister had just beat him) is strong evidence that Oswald was never in Bannisters office that summer especially since Jack Martins was in that office the whole time that summer.

Here is what Jack Martins told Jim Garrisson (a very different story from what he told the FBI on Nov 25th and 27th). If Martins wanted to tie Ferrie to Oswald, then Martins should have told the FBI what he told Jim Garrison. The fact that he didn't, is evidence that Martins simply made it up later for Jim Garrison. Or Garrison himself made up the story.


Jim Garrison, On the Trail of the Assassins (1988)

Martin was seated across my desk, his anxious gaze fixed on my every move. An on-again, off-again alcoholic, he was a thin man with deeply circled, worried eyes. Although he had been written off as a nonentity by many, I had long regarded him as a quick-witted and highly observant, if slightly disorganized, private detective. I had known him casually as far back as my days as an assistant D.A. and always had gotten along well with him.

"Jack," I said, "why don't you relax a little? You should know by now that you're among friends here."

He nodded nervously. He was seated in the roomy, upholstered chair across from my desk, but he looked most uncomfortable. I offered him some coffee. "You're not under cross-examination. Jack," I said "I just want a little help. Understand?"

"The police report says the reason Banister beat you was you had an argument over telephone bills." I pulled a copy of the police report from my desk drawer and shoved it across to him. "Here, take a look at it." He bent his head over and examined it as if he had never seen it before. I was sure that he had seen it many times, probably even had a copy at home.

After a moment he looked up without saying a word. His eyes told me he was deeply concerned about something.

"Now, does a simple argument over phone bills sound like a believable explanation to you?" I asked.

I waited. Then, dreamily, he shook his head slowly. "No," he admitted. "It involved more than that."

"How much more?"

Again I waited. He breathed deeply, sucking in the air.

"It started like it was going to be nothing at all," he began. "We'd both been drinking at Katzenjammer's - maybe more than usual, because of the assassination and all. Banister especially."

Pausing to chug down another cup of coffee, he made a real effort to collect his thoughts.

"Well, when we came back to the office. Banister started hitching about one thing and then another. He was in a mean mood. Then all of a sudden, he accused me of going through his private files. Now I never went through his private stuff ever - absolutely never. And that really ticked me off."

He hesitated for a long moment.

"Go on. Jack," I said gently.

"I guess I blew up," he continued, his face flushed with memories of injustice. "That's when I told him he'd better not talk to me like that. I told him I remembered the people I had seen around the office that summer. And that's when he hit me. Fast as a flash - pulled out that big Magnum and slammed me on the side of the head with it."

"Just because you remembered the people you'd seen at his office the past summer?" I asked.

"Yeah, that's all it took. He went bananas on that one."

"And just who were the people you'd seen in the office that summer?" I prodded softly.

"There was a bunch of them. It was like a circus. There were all those Cubans - coming in and going out, coming in and going out. They all looked alike to me."

Someone once commenced that whenever you really want to do something unseen, whenever you go to great pains to make sure that you are unobserved, there always turns out to be someone who was sitting under the oak tree. At the strange place that was Banister's office. Jack Martin, unnoticed in the middle of it all, was the one sitting under the oak tree.

He drew a long breath and then went on. "Then there were all these other characters. There was Dave Ferrie - you know about him by now."

"Was he there very often?" I asked.

"Often? He practically lived there."

Then Martin fell silent. I saw by the look in his eyes that he had come to a full stop.

I was not about to let my weekend visit to 544 Camp Street go down the drain that easily, so I gave him a hand. 'And Lee Harvey Oswald'" I added.

Jack swallowed, then nodded. It was almost as if he felt relief in finally having a burden lifted from him. "Yeah, he was there too. Sometimes he'd be meeting with Guy Banister with the door shut. Other times he'd be shooting the bull with Dave Ferrie. But he was there all right."

"What was Guy Banister doing while all this was going on?"

"Hell, he was the one running the circus."

"What about his private detective work?"

"Not much of that came in, but when it did, I handled it. That's why I was there."

"So, Jack," I said. "Just what was going on at Banister's office?"

He held up his hand. "I can't answer that," he said firmly. "I can't go into that stuff at all." Unexpectedly, he stood up. "I think I'd better go," he said.

"Hold on. Jack. What's the problem with our going into what was happening at Banister's office?"

"What's the problem?" he said. "What's the problem?" he repeated, as if in disbelief. "The problem is that we're going to bring the goddamned federal government down on our backs. Do I need to spell it out? I could get killed - and so could you."

He turned around. "I'd better go," he mumbled. He wobbled as he headed for the door.



Ironically, Jack Martins is strong proof that Oswald never set foot in Bannisters office.

Ironically ...You've posted a fair amount of information that refutes your statement above....Way ta go... Quick Draw.... 

I'll bet it smarts when ya shoot yerself in the foot....

Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: Higgenbothan - Did he know Oswald?
« Reply #10 on: February 28, 2021, 08:46:07 PM »
Ironically, Jack Martins is strong proof that Oswald never set foot in Bannisters office. After the assassination on Nov 25th and Nov 27th, Jack Martins gave two statements to the FBI in which he was bending over backwards trying to tie Ferrie to Oswald. Here are the two statements: https://www.jfk-online.com/jpsjmfbi63.html 

If Oswald had been in Bannisters office and had met with both Bannister and Ferrie (as Martins said to Jim Garrison - see below), wasn't the Nov 25th 1963 FBI statement Martins gave the perfect time to tell the FBI that Oswald had been Bannisters officer and had met with both Bannister and Ferrie? The very fact Martins makes no mention of Bannister anywhere in the FBI statement (even though Bannister had just beat him) is strong evidence that Oswald was never in Bannisters office that summer especially since Jack Martins was in that office the whole time that summer.

Here is what Jack Martins told Jim Garrisson (a very different story from what he told the FBI on Nov 25th and 27th). If Martins wanted to tie Ferrie to Oswald, then Martins should have told the FBI what he told Jim Garrison. The fact that he didn't, is evidence that Martins simply made it up later for Jim Garrison. Or Garrison himself made up the story.


Jim Garrison, On the Trail of the Assassins (1988)

Martin was seated across my desk, his anxious gaze fixed on my every move. An on-again, off-again alcoholic, he was a thin man with deeply circled, worried eyes. Although he had been written off as a nonentity by many, I had long regarded him as a quick-witted and highly observant, if slightly disorganized, private detective. I had known him casually as far back as my days as an assistant D.A. and always had gotten along well with him.

"Jack," I said, "why don't you relax a little? You should know by now that you're among friends here."

He nodded nervously. He was seated in the roomy, upholstered chair across from my desk, but he looked most uncomfortable. I offered him some coffee. "You're not under cross-examination. Jack," I said "I just want a little help. Understand?"

"The police report says the reason Banister beat you was you had an argument over telephone bills." I pulled a copy of the police report from my desk drawer and shoved it across to him. "Here, take a look at it." He bent his head over and examined it as if he had never seen it before. I was sure that he had seen it many times, probably even had a copy at home.

After a moment he looked up without saying a word. His eyes told me he was deeply concerned about something.

"Now, does a simple argument over phone bills sound like a believable explanation to you?" I asked.

I waited. Then, dreamily, he shook his head slowly. "No," he admitted. "It involved more than that."

"How much more?"

Again I waited. He breathed deeply, sucking in the air.

"It started like it was going to be nothing at all," he began. "We'd both been drinking at Katzenjammer's - maybe more than usual, because of the assassination and all. Banister especially."

Pausing to chug down another cup of coffee, he made a real effort to collect his thoughts.

"Well, when we came back to the office. Banister started hitching about one thing and then another. He was in a mean mood. Then all of a sudden, he accused me of going through his private files. Now I never went through his private stuff ever - absolutely never. And that really ticked me off."

He hesitated for a long moment.

"Go on. Jack," I said gently.

"I guess I blew up," he continued, his face flushed with memories of injustice. "That's when I told him he'd better not talk to me like that. I told him I remembered the people I had seen around the office that summer. And that's when he hit me. Fast as a flash - pulled out that big Magnum and slammed me on the side of the head with it."

"Just because you remembered the people you'd seen at his office the past summer?" I asked.

"Yeah, that's all it took. He went bananas on that one."

"And just who were the people you'd seen in the office that summer?" I prodded softly.

"There was a bunch of them. It was like a circus. There were all those Cubans - coming in and going out, coming in and going out. They all looked alike to me."

Someone once commenced that whenever you really want to do something unseen, whenever you go to great pains to make sure that you are unobserved, there always turns out to be someone who was sitting under the oak tree. At the strange place that was Banister's office. Jack Martin, unnoticed in the middle of it all, was the one sitting under the oak tree.

He drew a long breath and then went on. "Then there were all these other characters. There was Dave Ferrie - you know about him by now."

"Was he there very often?" I asked.

"Often? He practically lived there."

Then Martin fell silent. I saw by the look in his eyes that he had come to a full stop.

I was not about to let my weekend visit to 544 Camp Street go down the drain that easily, so I gave him a hand. 'And Lee Harvey Oswald'" I added.

Jack swallowed, then nodded. It was almost as if he felt relief in finally having a burden lifted from him. "Yeah, he was there too. Sometimes he'd be meeting with Guy Banister with the door shut. Other times he'd be shooting the bull with Dave Ferrie. But he was there all right."

"What was Guy Banister doing while all this was going on?"

"Hell, he was the one running the circus."

"What about his private detective work?"

"Not much of that came in, but when it did, I handled it. That's why I was there."

"So, Jack," I said. "Just what was going on at Banister's office?"

He held up his hand. "I can't answer that," he said firmly. "I can't go into that stuff at all." Unexpectedly, he stood up. "I think I'd better go," he said.

"Hold on. Jack. What's the problem with our going into what was happening at Banister's office?"

"What's the problem?" he said. "What's the problem?" he repeated, as if in disbelief. "The problem is that we're going to bring the goddamned federal government down on our backs. Do I need to spell it out? I could get killed - and so could you."

He turned around. "I'd better go," he mumbled. He wobbled as he headed for the door.

  I told him I remembered the people I had seen around the office that summer. And that's when he hit me. Fast as a flash - pulled out that big Magnum and slammed me on the side of the head with it."

Banister had tried to drink the Katz & Jammer's bar dry after the news of the murder of JFK.  Banister knew that his goose was cooked if anybody confirmed that he and Lee Oswald had been seen in long discussion in his office.....   And Jack Martin had just reminded Banister that he had seen (and probably heard) Bannister coaching Lee....

One of the most memorable scenes from the movie JFK....Has Bannister drunkenly stumbling along while talkin to Jack Martin.

Do you recall Banister's words???

"Just because you remembered the people you'd seen at his office the past summer?" I asked.

"Yeah, that's all it took. He went bananas on that one."

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Re: Higgenbothan - Did he know Oswald?
« Reply #10 on: February 28, 2021, 08:46:07 PM »


Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: Higgenbothan - Did he know Oswald?
« Reply #11 on: February 28, 2021, 09:40:06 PM »
Could Oswald have been trying to infiltrate Banister?

WOW!!....I'm amazed ...  Lee Oswald's mission was twofold.....Get him the hell outta Dallas ASAP...( after the Walker hoax) .And send him on a mission to see if he could discover who was behind the illegal attacks on Cuba that were creating a headache for JFK.  JFK suspected that the illegal operation of training and arming the Cuban exiles was being run out of New Orleans. Lee's job was to try to identify the leader...  Guy Banister......   

Offline Gerry Down

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Re: Higgenbothan - Did he know Oswald?
« Reply #12 on: February 28, 2021, 10:14:08 PM »
WOW!!....I'm amazed ...  Lee Oswald's mission was twofold.....Get him the hell outta Dallas ASAP...( after the Walker hoax) .And send him on a mission to see if he could discover who was behind the illegal attacks on Cuba that were creating a headache for JFK.  JFK suspected that the illegal operation of training and arming the Cuban exiles was being run out of New Orleans. Lee's job was to try to identify the leader...  Guy Banister......   

Are you being sarcastic? I cannot tell.

Btw, does anyone know which side of the Newman building faced which street? in the famous black and white photo of the Newman building (the only photo i've ever seen of it) i think the long side is on Camp street with the short side on Lafayette street.

This webpage: https://neworleanshistorical.org/items/show/1470 ......shows the modern day building which replaced the Newman building but it is not of much use in orientating the old black and white photo.

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Re: Higgenbothan - Did he know Oswald?
« Reply #12 on: February 28, 2021, 10:14:08 PM »


Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: Higgenbothan - Did he know Oswald?
« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2021, 10:21:50 PM »
Are you being sarcastic? I cannot tell.

Btw, does anyone know which side of the Newman building faced which street? in the famous black and white photo of the Newman building (the only photo i've ever seen of it) i think the long side is on Camp street with the short side on Lafayette street.

This webpage: https://neworleanshistorical.org/items/show/1470 ......shows the modern day building which replaced the Newman building but it is not of much use in orientating the old black and white photo.

When I'm being sarcastic...I usually use a  ;)

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Re: Higgenbothan - Did he know Oswald?
« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2021, 10:21:50 PM »