Roger Craig

[John Mytton]

- the existing Alyea footage is blurry and lacking in identification detail

 



JohnM

[Walt Cakebread]

This is from Alyea's account of finding the rifle:

Shortly after we arrived back on the 6th floor, Deputy Eugene Boone located the assassin's rifle almost completely hidden by some overhanging boxes near the stairwell. I filmed it as it was found. In my shot, the figure of Captain Fritz is standing within the enclosure next to the rifle.

He is present when the rifle is found and filmed Fritz walking into the rifle "enclosure", standing next to the rifle. There is footage of this below. As you say, the Alyea film is very poor quality but it is a record of the discovery of the rifle, Studebaker taking pics of it, Day retrieving it from it's "hiding place", examining it with Fritz then dusting it for prints.
The clip below shows Fritz walking into the enclosure as Alyea describes. The image is poor quality but by his feet it is possible to make out the butt of a rifle in an upright position:



As I say, the rest of Alyea's footage concerning the rifle follows it through to Day dusting the rifle at which point it is possible to make out it is a rifle indistinguishable from the MC.

The clip below shows Fritz walking into the enclosure as Alyea describes. The image is poor quality but by his feet it is possible to make out the butt of a rifle in an upright position:

Are you kidding?....  If you believe that you can see the butt of the carcano near Fritz's feet.....  You probably can see the sniper in the bushes on the GK, also..... 

[Dan O'meara]

The clip below shows Fritz walking into the enclosure as Alyea describes. The image is poor quality but by his feet it is possible to make out the butt of a rifle in an upright position:

Are you kidding?....  If you believe that you can see the butt of the carcano near Fritz's feet.....  You probably can see the sniper in the bushes on the GK, also.....

Tom Alyea stated:

I filmed it as it was found. In my shot, the figure of Captain Fritz is standing within the enclosure next to the rifle.


This clip shows Fritz standing within the enclosure where the rifle is.
Can you see where the rifle is Walt?
Because this is the area where the rifle is located, this is the arrangement of boxes used to hide the rifle.
So, are you saying there is no rifle there Walt?

[Walt Cakebread]

Tom Alyea stated:

I filmed it as it was found. In my shot, the figure of Captain Fritz is standing within the enclosure next to the rifle.


This clip shows Fritz standing within the enclosure where the rifle is.
Can you see where the rifle is Walt?
Because this is the area where the rifle is located, this is the arrangement of boxes used to hide the rifle.
So, are you saying there is no rifle there Walt?

are you saying there is no rifle there Walt?

I can't see it..... Do you believe that the small white spot BENEATH the overhanging box is the rifle?    And how could a fleeing assassin have placed that rifle BENEATH the overhanging box??

this is the area where the rifle is located,

I'll accept that the rifle was found 15' 4" from the  North wall ....Is this white spot 15 ' 4"  from the N wall? 

this is the arrangement of boxes used to hide the rifle.

So the rifle was HIDDEN?......  The official tale says that Lee ran by that site and hastily dumped the rifle....( he didn't hide it)  How ever Tom Alyea said that it was obvious that the hiding place  had been prepared BEFORE the shooting and this was long before anybody knew that the LHO's Speculated Elapsed time from the SE corner window to the 2nd floor lunchroom was less than 90 seconds. Alyea simply assumed that the fleeing assassin would not have had time to hide the rifle as it had been hidden. Alyea didn't know that LHO had talked to Officer Baker in the 2nd floor lunchroom just 90 seconds after the FIRST ( THAT'S CORRECT) first shot was fired.    It LHO had been the assassin he would have had to have been faster than a speeding bullet to have hidden the rifle beneath the boxes where Boone and Weitzman found by using their bright flashlights. 

[Dan O'meara]

are you saying there is no rifle there Walt?

I can't see it..... Do you believe that the small white spot BENEATH the overhanging box is the rifle?    And how could a fleeing assassin have placed that rifle BENEATH the overhanging box??

this is the area where the rifle is located,

I'll accept that the rifle was found 15' 4" from the  North wall ....Is this white spot 15 ' 4"  from the N wall? 

this is the arrangement of boxes used to hide the rifle.

So the rifle was HIDDEN?......  The official tale says that Lee ran by that site and hastily dumped the rifle....( he didn't hide it)  How ever Tom Alyea said that it was obvious that the hiding place  had been prepared BEFORE the shooting and this was long before anybody knew that the LHO's Speculated Elapsed time from the SE corner window to the 2nd floor lunchroom was less than 90 seconds. Alyea simply assumed that the fleeing assassin would not have had time to hide the rifle as it had been hidden. Alyea didn't know that LHO had talked to Officer Baker in the 2nd floor lunchroom just 90 seconds after the FIRST ( THAT'S CORRECT) first shot was fired.    It LHO had been the assassin he would have had to have been faster than a speeding bullet to have hidden the rifle beneath the boxes where Boone and Weitzman found by using their bright flashlights.

The point I was making that I was surprised the "Mauser" story was still doing the rounds as Alyea had filmed the discovery of the rifle.
The section of the film regarding the rifle starts with Fritz entering the enclosure with the rifle at his feet, as stated by Alyea.
It's not about whether or not Oswald hid the rifle there, it's about the discovery of the rifle being filmed.
Granted, the footage is very poor quality and the rifle hardly stands out but it is possible to make it out.
In the picture below there is a white cloth or piece of paper next to the rifle pointed out by a red arrow:

how to use print screen

In the still below the same white cloth/paper is pointed out by a red arrow, the rifle by the green arrow:



I cobbled together as many clips about the rile from different sources. I think it shows the discovery of the MC through to it being dusted for prints.
I'm not arguing about how the rifle ended up in the "enclosure", just trying to show that Alyea seemed to capture it's discovery:

[Walt Cakebread]

The point I was making that I was surprised the "Mauser" story was still doing the rounds as Alyea had filmed the discovery of the rifle.
The section of the film regarding the rifle starts with Fritz entering the enclosure with the rifle at his feet, as stated by Alyea.
It's not about whether or not Oswald hid the rifle there, it's about the discovery of the rifle being filmed.
Granted, the footage is very poor quality and the rifle hardly stands out but it is possible to make it out.
In the picture below there is a white cloth or piece of paper next to the rifle pointed out by a red arrow:

how to use print screen

In the still below the same white cloth/paper is pointed out by a red arrow, the rifle by the green arrow:



I cobbled together as many clips about the rile from different sources. I think it shows the discovery of the MC through to it being dusted for prints.
I'm not arguing about how the rifle ended up in the "enclosure", just trying to show that Alyea seemed to capture it's discovery:

There is a box to the south of the rifle  in the photos....The east side of that box seems to align with the foregrip of the carcano in the official DPD in situ photo.

In the photo with the red and green arrows the east edge of that box aligns with the  comb of the stock. ( when comparing the two photos the east edge of the box is 20 " back from the place it appears in the official DPD photo.  (approximately 20 inches toward the butt of the rifle )

I can't access the "cobbled together" video....

[Dan O'meara]

There is a box to the south of the rifle  in the photos....The east side of that box seems to align with the foregrip of the carcano in the official DPD in situ photo.

In the photo with the red and green arrows the east edge of that box aligns with the  comb of the stock. ( when comparing the two photos the east edge of the box is 20 " back from the place it appears in the official DPD photo.  (approximately 20 inches toward the butt of the rifle )

I can't access the "cobbled together" video....

If you go to YouTube and type in "Alyea rifle discovery compilation", you should get it.

[Walt Cakebread]

This is from Alyea's account of finding the rifle:

Shortly after we arrived back on the 6th floor, Deputy Eugene Boone located the assassin's rifle almost completely hidden by some overhanging boxes near the stairwell. I filmed it as it was found. In my shot, the figure of Captain Fritz is standing within the enclosure next to the rifle.

He is present when the rifle is found and filmed Fritz walking into the rifle "enclosure", standing next to the rifle. There is footage of this below. As you say, the Alyea film is very poor quality but it is a record of the discovery of the rifle, Studebaker taking pics of it, Day retrieving it from it's "hiding place", examining it with Fritz then dusting it for prints.
The clip below shows Fritz walking into the enclosure as Alyea describes. The image is poor quality but by his feet it is possible to make out the butt of a rifle in an upright position:



As I say, the rest of Alyea's footage concerning the rifle follows it through to Day dusting the rifle at which point it is possible to make out it is a rifle indistinguishable from the MC.

"  In my shot"   Alyea refers to a single shot....And the footage seems to show the sequence of Captain Fritz's movements backwards....