Did Oswald Go To Mexico City?

[Steve M. Galbraith]

The bus ticket from Nuevo Laredo at the Texas-Mexico border to Mexico City cost LHO 71.40 pesos ($5.71). The WC concluded that LHO began the month of September with $183.21 cash in hand. He skipped paying his rent and utilities bills that month.

And Ruth Paine testified that he never gave her any money for her help. No gas money, food nothing.

The claim that Oswald was some sort of FBI informant or CIA asset is simply not believable for me. Did they not pay him? Did the CIA not get him a job? If so, where did the money go? He never had a house, a car, a phone - anything. He ate very little, they had to rely on charity. He lived in terrible poverty once he came back to the US.

Sorry, this is not someone working for the CIA. It's simply not believable unless one thinks that this impoverished life was part of his cover. Which, of course, is the claim.

[Walt Cakebread]

And Ruth Paine testified that he never gave her any money for her help. No gas money, food nothing.

The claim that Oswald was some sort of FBI informant or CIA asset is simply not believable for me. Did they not pay him? Did the CIA not get him a job? If so, where did the money go? He never had a house, a car, a phone - anything. He ate very little, they had to rely on charity. He lived in terrible poverty once he came back to the US.

Sorry, this is not someone working for the CIA. It's simply not believable unless one thinks that this impoverished life was part of his cover. Which, of course, is the claim.

It's simply not believable unless one thinks that this impoverished life was part of his cover.

If Lee was being watched by the communists which is very probable....   What would they have concluded if he started living an extravagant life style  on his return from the USSR?  His public image was that of an outcast in the U.S.    So if he had suddenly started living "high on the hog" the spies would have known that he was not what he pretended to be when he "defected" to Russia.

[Charles Collins]

And Ruth Paine testified that he never gave her any money for her help. No gas money, food nothing.

The claim that Oswald was some sort of FBI informant or CIA asset is simply not believable for me. Did they not pay him? Did the CIA not get him a job? If so, where did the money go? He never had a house, a car, a phone - anything. He ate very little, they had to rely on charity. He lived in terrible poverty once he came back to the US.

Sorry, this is not someone working for the CIA. It's simply not believable unless one thinks that this impoverished life was part of his cover. Which, of course, is the claim.

The WC calculated that LHO left New Orleans with about $215, and he had approximately $130 when he arrived in Dallas. The trip, including transportation, lodging, food, and miscellaneous expenses, had cost him a total of $85.

[Steve M. Galbraith]

The WC calculated that LHO left New Orleans with about $215, and he had approximately $130 when he arrived in Dallas. The trip, including transportation, lodging, food, and miscellaneous expenses, had cost him a total of $85.

So what did he do with the missing $85? If it wasn't spent on the Mexico City trip then where did he spend it?

He spent that summer in NO agitating/protesting on behalf of Castro. He's saving his money. Why? Marina explained why. His subsequent actions explain why.

Duran testified that he showed her his FPCC card and told her about his efforts on behalf of Castro. In effect, proving his "revolutionary" credentials in an attempt to persuade the Cubans to let him in (and if they did decide to let this supposed impostor in then what was the purpose of impersonating him? What does this impostor do next? Go and do what? Refuse to go? What is the end game here?)

The money, his activity on behalf of Castro, his long time adoration for Castro, he tells Marina about the plan (she goes to the USSR; he goes to Cuba; then he sends for her), eyewitness accounts, physical evidence, circumstantial evidence...it's a pretty long list. Yes, there are "gaps" - such as the account by Azcue - but if you weigh the evidence he went versus the evidence it wasn't him then it seems to me you have to conclude he did go.

Now the question is: Was he impersonated on any of the phone calls once he was there? But that's another question for another post/thread.

[Thomas Graves]

So what did he do with the missing $85? If it wasn't spent on the Mexico City trip then where did he spend it?

He spent that summer in NO agitating/protesting on behalf of Castro. He's saving his money. Why? Marina explained why. His subsequent actions explain why.

Duran testified that he showed her his FPCC card and told her about his efforts on behalf of Castro. In effect, proving his "revolutionary" credentials in an attempt to persuade the Cubans to let him in (and if they did decide to let this supposed impostor in then what was the purpose of impersonating him? What does this impostor do next? Go and do what? Refuse to go? What is the end game here?)

The money, his activity on behalf of Castro, his long time adoration for Castro, he tells Marina about the plan (she goes to the USSR; he goes to Cuba; then he sends for her), eyewitness accounts, physical evidence, circumstantial evidence...it's a pretty long list. Yes, there are "gaps" - such as the account by Azcue - but if you weigh the evidence he went versus the evidence it wasn't him then it seems to me you have to conclude he did go.

Now the question is: Was he impersonated on any of the phone calls once he was there? But that's another question for another post/thread.

Galbraith,

Why did Sylvia Duran and Eusebio Azcue (especially Azcue) both describe the "Oswald" at the Cuban consulate -- the man who had given Duran the taken-in-the-USSR passport-sized photos -- in such a way that perfectly described the physically distinctive (short, skinny, blond hair, blue eyes, 35 years old, very thin-faced) KGB colonel Nikolai Leonov, mentor to Raul Castro  and Che Guevara and "Third Secretary and Assistant Cultural Attache" at the Soviet embassy?

--  MWT 

PS  And, as Peter Dale Scott points out at the end of John Newman's two-part March 18, 2018 YouTube "Spy Wars" presentation, there's a scrap of paper in CIA files indicating that the September 28 and October 1 "Oswald" spoke bad English and bad Russian over the phone.

My theory:  The KGB impersonator (Leonov?) spoke bad English naturally, and intentionally spoke bad Russian because he didn't realize how fluent Oswald was in that language.

[Joffrey van de Wiel]

Supposedly he went there to get visa that would allow travel to the Soviet Union by way of Cuba.


LHO wasn't intending to go back to the Soviet Union. His intentions were to send Marina back there and for himself to stay in Cuba. (Ruth Paine's offer to take care of Marina & their kids temporarily solved that issue for him.) He prepared a resume to give to the Cubans to show his "credentials." Here are the notes he prepared while in New Orleans:

Page 1. https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1133#relPageId=361&tab=page

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During interrogation on November 22, 1963, Oswald denied having visited Mexico City and I can find no plausible reason why he would lie about it, as it had nothing to do with the crimes of which he was accused.


Perhaps he realized that admitting visiting Mexico City would implicate his visit to the Cuban Consulate and he didn't want to tie the Cubans to the assassination. LHO reportedly not only denied it, but also got visibly upset (like he did when Hosty entered the interrogation) when his visit to Mexico City was brought up.

LHO wasn't intending to go back to the Soviet Union. His intentions were to send Marina back there and for himself to stay in Cuba. (Ruth Paine's offer to take care of Marina & their kids temporarily solved that issue for him.) He prepared a resume to give to the Cubans to show his "credentials." Here are the notes he prepared while in New Orleans

Charles,

Thanks for posting Oswald's notes he made in preparation for the Mexico trip - but he overdid it. Silvia Duran became suspicious when he presented his communist, pro revolutionary Cuba credentials as can be seen here when she was being questioned by an investigator for the HSCA:

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=954&search=silvia_duran#relPageId=39&tab=page

I never heard of the story that he planned to stay in Cuba while shipping Marina back to the USSR - did she know about it? What about the children? Please share the source for your statement so I can catch up on this (for me) new information?

Perhaps he realized that admitting visiting Mexico City would implicate his visit to the Cuban Consulate and he didn't want to tie the Cubans to the assassination. LHO reportedly not only denied it, but also got visibly upset (like he did when Hosty entered the interrogation) when his visit to Mexico City was brought up.

Well, he could have omitted his visits to the Cuban and Soviet diplomatic compounds and admit having travelled to Mexico City as a tourist or something. He couldn't have known that the FBI, via the CIA, had already learned of his endeavors regarding the visa. Both agencies had enough information that would have warranted close surveillance, but that never happened which is in light of the tragic consequences a severe error of judgement.

[Charles Collins]

Charles,

Thanks for posting Oswald's notes he made in preparation for the Mexico trip - but he overdid it. Silvia Duran became suspicious when he presented his communist, pro revolutionary Cuba credentials as can be seen here when she was being questioned by an investigator for the HSCA:

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=954&search=silvia_duran#relPageId=39&tab=page

I never heard of the story that he planned to stay in Cuba while shipping Marina back to the USSR - did she know about it? What about the children? Please share the source for your statement so I can catch up on this (for me) new information?

Well, he could have omitted his visits to the Cuban and Soviet diplomatic compounds and admit having travelled to Mexico City as a tourist or something. He couldn't have known that the FBI, via the CIA, had already learned of his endeavors regarding the visa. Both agencies had enough information that would have warranted close surveillance, but that never happened which is in light of the tragic consequences a severe error of judgement.

Please share the source for your statement so I can catch up on this (for me) new information?


https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1133#relPageId=49&tab=page

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1133#relPageId=50&tab=page

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1133#relPageId=51&tab=page

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1133#relPageId=52&tab=page

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1133#relPageId=53&tab=page

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1133#relPageId=54&tab=page


Please take notice that in LHO's letter (attached to Marina's letter) he requests that his visa be considered separately. Marina was unaware of the request for the separate visa until well after the assassination. LHO had told Marina he wanted to go back to Russia with her and the kid(s). But he had no such intentions as the resume he prepared for the Cubans and the separate letter show.

[Jerry Freeman]

The claim that Oswald was some sort of FBI informant or CIA asset is simply not believable for me. Did they not pay him? Did the CIA not get him a job? If so, where did the money go? He never had a house, a car, a phone - anything. He ate very little, they had to rely on charity. He lived in terrible poverty once he came back to the US.
Sorry, this is not someone working for the CIA. It's simply not believable unless one thinks that this impoverished life was part of his cover. Which, of course, is the claim.

What about the claim by Mr Alba owner of the garage next to the Reilly Co where Oswald worked?

Alba gave an interview in the '70s stating that he saw Oswald regularly accepting white envelopes from G-men in what he knew to be FBI company cars as they entered or exited his garage. Alba recalled watching Oswald approach an FBI car outside the garage and receive a white envelope that was handed to him through a cracked window before concealing it under his shirt. Alba later said Oswald "met the car again a couple of days later and talked briefly with the driver," whom, as detailed in "JFK and the Unspeakable..." Alba knew as an "FBI agent visiting New Orleans from Washington." He further stated that he did not know the content of the envelopes. He explained to his interviewer that he had refused previous interviews or photos, even for money, because he was worried about the safety of his family. He refused to be filmed for the interview.   

https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,2365.msg75368.html#msg75368

There seems to be a lot of unbelievable stuff.
 Oswald might have had 2 or 3 grand when he left New Orleans but still... that does not prove he went to Mexico.

  Employees at the hotel and the nearby restaurant where he ate meals also said the man was Oswald.

 
 Can testimony on that be linked? These statements are repeated constantly without obvious support.

Marina explained why.

The Commission guys could always count on Marina to state the desired results but it has long gone overboard with the incredible.
 
It still seems that Sylvia Odio got a better look at Oswald than anyone and yet her SWORN testimony remains ignored.

Perhaps he realized that admitting visiting Mexico City would implicate his visit to the Cuban Consulate and he didn't want to tie the Cubans to the assassination. LHO reportedly not only denied it, but also got visibly upset (like he did when Hosty entered the interrogation) when his visit to Mexico City was brought up.

Too much "perhaps" there. Where exactly is it that Oswald 'gets visibly upset' with this question?