The Three People Walking Across The Pergola Patio

[Royell Storing]

I believe SA Lems Johns did Not get back inside the LBJ SS Follow-Up Car. Johns eventually arrived at AF1 AFTER LBJ had been there awhile.. If Johns had jumped back inside that Follow-Up Car he would have arrived at AF1 when LBJ did. (Johns was assigned to the LBJ SS Detail). I think Johns arrived at AF1 when Jackie did. To me, there is No Way SA Lem Johns could have jumped out of that vehicle in the middle of Elm St and run up the street toward the LBJ convertible and Not be captured on Any assassination images or be sighted by Any of the eyewitnesses inside Dealey Plaza. That's just flat-out Unbelievable. Wiegman filmed JFK all the time so he would know the different SS Agents. I believe Wiegman's story of seeing SA Lem Johns at the Top of the Knoll.
That's why Trask's wording regarding the Sitzman Interview is Important with regard to the Factual Record. Trask very well could have used his own connect-the-dots thought process. He also did this at times in "POTP". Like I said before, it is Not unusual for assassination film snippets filmed by different camera men to be Spliced together for JFK Specials or VHS/DVD presentations.

[John Mytton]

1) Towner.


2) Darnell from JFK the Movie.


3) Darnell from MSNBC


Pink=3 women. Red=Darnell.


JohnM

[Royell Storing]

1) Towner.


2) Darnell from JFK the Movie.


3) Darnell from MSNBC


Pink=3 women. Red=Darnell.


JohnM

    Regarding the B/W Overhead Still Shot you have posted, what do you believe is scattered across the Knoll Grass between the Stemmons Sign and The Pergola? Do you think that might be Flowers? If so, that B/W Overhead still frame would have been taken well after the Towner snippet which is supposed to have been filmed roughly 10 minutes After the Kill Shot. The Towner film footage does Not show Anything scattered across the Knoll Grass as the Suited Man runs across that section of the Knoll.

[Thomas Graves]

    Yeah. An overhead still frame that alleges to show the 3 Women and Darnell on the Knoll Well Over 10 minutes following the Kill Shot is "wasting our time". That would be because Your Conclusion(s) are Not based on Fact. For starters, YOU see a Suited Man running across the Knoll on the Towner Film and YOU claim as a FACT that this Suited Man is Darnell having Finished Filming the interview of Sitzman standing by the Zapruder Perch. With, (1) the Towner Film having been Time Stamped as being filmed 10 minutes after the Kill Shot, vs (2) Your claiming Darnell had finished filming the Sitzman interview and Now the Towner film shows him running across the Knoll to film the 3 Women in front of him = do we Know for a FACT that the Sitzman Interview at the Zapruder Perch was conducted LESS than 10 minutes following the Kill Shot? This would mean that Only 8 minutes after the Kill Shot,  Darnell, the Interviewer, and Sitzman had ALL gathered together and put themselves into position by the pedestal for that filmed interview. On top of that, as we see in that interview, Sitzman already has a lighted cigarette in hand and appears quite calm and coherent when Only 8 minutes earlier she had witnessed the POTUS getting his head blown off.  Please take the time to gather FACTS and then Think your Opinion(s) through.     

Storing,

How ignorant are you?

There were no overhead shots of the grassy knoll area at that time.

Mytton used that one only for illustrative purposes, to show us where he believes 
the three women and Darnell were in relation to each other just before, during, and just after the Towner film "captured all four of them on film.

D'oh

-- MWT 

[Barry Pollard]

I believe SA Lems Johns did Not get back inside the LBJ SS Follow-Up Car. Johns eventually arrived at AF1 AFTER LBJ had been there awhile.. If Johns had jumped back inside that Follow-Up Car he would have arrived at AF1 when LBJ did. (Johns was assigned to the LBJ SS Detail). I think Johns arrived at AF1 when Jackie did. To me, there is No Way SA Lem Johns could have jumped out of that vehicle in the middle of Elm St and run up the street toward the LBJ convertible and Not be captured on Any assassination images or be sighted by Any of the eyewitnesses inside Dealey Plaza. That's just flat-out Unbelievable. Wiegman filmed JFK all the time so he would know the different SS Agents. I believe Wiegman's story of seeing SA Lem Johns at the Top of the Knoll.
That's why Trask's wording regarding the Sitzman Interview is Important with regard to the Factual Record. Trask very well could have used his own connect-the-dots thought process. He also did this at times in "POTP". Like I said before, it is Not unusual for assassination film snippets filmed by different camera men to be Spliced together for JFK Specials or VHS/DVD presentations.

We don't even know if Lems got fully out of his car, let alone halfway to LBJ, so I am assuming he did not(especially the latter) because of exactly what you said, there's no evidence for it.
Wiegman met Johns at the TM, ask yourself how and why?  Why did Johns group go to the mart and not follow the limo to PH?  Seems obvious to me, his driver lost the lead cars and so went to the designated next stop like every other vehicle behind them.
Wiegman then tells of Johns himself going around gathering intel and when he hears the news, tells Dave, of all people and invites him to join him, Askins as well, on a trip to the hospital in a police car(which I thoroughly believe btw).  Nice to have friends.

[Thomas Graves]

We don't even know if Lems got fully out of his car, let alone halfway to LBJ, so I am assuming he did not(especially the latter) because of exactly what you said, there's no evidence for it.
Wiegman met Johns at the TM, ask yourself how and why?  Why did Johns group go to the mart and not follow the limo to PH?  Seems obvious to me, his driver lost the lead cars and so went to the designated next stop like every other vehicle behind them.
Wiegman then tells of Johns himself going around gathering intel and when he hears the news, tells Dave, of all people and invites him to join him, Askins as well, on a trip to the hospital in a police car(which I thoroughly believe btw).  Nice to have friends.

Wiegman met Johns at the Teller Machine??

The Mall???

The Mailbox??

[Royell Storing]

We don't even know if Lems got fully out of his car, let alone halfway to LBJ, so I am assuming he did not(especially the latter) because of exactly what you said, there's no evidence for it.
Wiegman met Johns at the TM, ask yourself how and why?  Why did Johns group go to the mart and not follow the limo to PH?  Seems obvious to me, his driver lost the lead cars and so went to the designated next stop like every other vehicle behind them.
Wiegman then tells of Johns himself going around gathering intel and when he hears the news, tells Dave, of all people and invites him to join him, Askins as well, on a trip to the hospital in a police car(which I thoroughly believe btw).  Nice to have friends.

    SA Lem Johns filed his "Original Report" on 11/29/63. I'm paraphrasing, but in John's "Original Report" he flat-out Details getting Out of the car and Running toward the Vice President's car and then hearing the 3rd shot fired. The SA Lem Johns "Original Report" would be the Evidence of what He/Lem Johns allegedly did physically upon hearing shots being fired. SA Johns also goes on within that report to say that he got a ride to Parkland Hospital with, "White House movie men".  Johns goes on to add that he arrived at Parkland Hospital at "approx 12:45 - 12:50 pm". So per SA Johns he got completely out of the LBJ SS Follow-Up Car & then ran up the middle of Elm St. Yet, there is Not a single assassination image of Johns doing Any of this, or Any Dealey Plaza Eyewitness that Ever reported seeing it.   

[Thomas Graves]

At the end of the day it comes down to making logical assumptions based on the evidence and within the context of this environment what I believe would be court accepted "proof beyond a reasonable doubt".

1. Both videos show 3 people walking side by side, with virtually no one else close by.
2. Both videos show 3 people walking away from the Elm street monument.
3. Both videos show same 3 people heading the same direction.
4. Both videos show a lady on our far right wearing a light headscarf.
5. Both videos show the person in the center to have a light coloured head.
6. Both videos show the person on our far left has a dark head.
7. Both videos show that all three are wearing clothing which appears dark in shadow.





Now sure there is a possibility that after these 3 people in the far off gif left the frame they were replaced by another three people that just happened to fill in all the above criteria but we all know from our personal lives that this possibility is extremely remote, so while it may never be proven to the illusive 100% Iacoletti standard, the reality is that these three people would have to be the same three.

JohnM

John,

Your analysis is spot on.

The three women are, from left-to-right, self-described American Indian Stella Mae Jacob and her two Texas School Book Company colleagues, Gloria Holt and Sharon Simmons -- the same three gals who were "caught" in the Zapruder film standing near the Stemmons sign.

Not Westbrook's "Uhh, probably (lilly-white) Carol Reed, Gloria Calvery, and me, Karen Westbrook," as guessed-at by Westbrook ... from behind and 54 years after-the-fact.

-- MWT