Ruth Paine remembers the Assassination

[Walt Cakebread]

Intriguing idea.
Could you help out with a citation for this " informant " admission?
Thanks.

Ruth Paine admitted that she spied on Lee Oswald and reported her observations to the FBI.    When she clandestinely read the letter that Lee wrote to the Russian embassy she became angry because Lee had referred to the FBI as "notorious "....   Ruth Paine thought that the FBI was a perfect,  all American, red, white, and blue organization....  And Hoover's mother was also a Quaker.  ( Don't know if J. Edna Hoover was Quaker)   Ruth may have assumed that Hoover was a Quaker.

Lee knew that he could deflect suspicion by including outrageous, or provocative statements, in written correspondence, thus he referred to the FBI as "notorious" while knowing that the letter would be opened by the FBI before it reached the Russian Embassy .... Lee deliberately used the term "notorious" to grab the attention of the FBI agent who read the letter.  The Russians would see the "notorious FBI " as a defamatory, or derogatory term and pay no attention to it.

Lee had used this strategy many times in writing  to his "mother" from Russia ....   He stated that his loyalty was to Russia and he would take up arms against Americans if required.   That kind of stuff was for the eyes of the Russian censors. 


 

[John Tonkovich]

Walt is playing fast and loose with the term “informant”. Hosty asked her some questions about Oswald and she answered them.

Thanks.
As to Ruth, her testimony - through the years- raises more questions than it gives  real answers.
Doesn't mean I think she's a...spy or an informer or any such thing. Just not very truthful.

[John Tonkovich]

Thanks.
As to Ruth, her testimony - through the years- raises more questions than it gives  real answers.
Doesn't mean I think she's a...spy or an informer or any such thing. Just not very truthful.

Addendum: There's also the issue of Ruth and her calendar, with it's Oct 23rd ( "but I meant November, really") notation about LHO and ordering of the rifle.

And Michael, with his (30 years later ) mention of seeing the Backyard photograph in spring, 1963.

And the Minox camera/light meter, negatives

All of the above could mean..absolutely nothing.
But the lack of investigation into these two - at the time of the assassination- is disappointing. And was - For whatever reason- deliberate, on the part of the WC.

[Steve M. Galbraith]

Ruth Paine admitted that she spied on Lee Oswald and reported her observations to the FBI.    When she clandestinely read the letter that Lee wrote to the Russian embassy she became angry because Lee had referred to the FBI as "notorious "....   Ruth Paine thought that the FBI was a perfect,  all American, red, white, and blue organization....  And Hoover's mother was also a Quaker.  ( Don't know if J. Edna Hoover was Quaker)   Ruth may have assumed that Hoover was a Quaker.

Lee knew that he could deflect suspicion by including outrageous, or provocative statements, in written correspondence, thus he referred to the FBI as "notorious" while knowing that the letter would be opened by the FBI before it reached the Russian Embassy .... Lee deliberately used the term "notorious" to grab the attention of the FBI agent who read the letter.  The Russians would see the "notorious FBI " as a defamatory, or derogatory term and pay no attention to it.

Lee had used this strategy many times in writing  to his "mother" from Russia ....   He stated that his loyalty was to Russia and he would take up arms against Americans if required.   That kind of stuff was for the eyes of the Russian censors. 


 

Did Paine tell the FBI about the letter? Its contents? Answer: No. She showed it to her husband Michael who also dismissed it as nothing. Some informants.

According to the KGB officers/Embassy staffers at the Soviet Embassy in Mexico City, Oswald showed them his revolver and told them he need it to protect himself from the "notorious" FBI. Exact same characterization.

As to Ruth Paine: Paine is and was a political leftist - she went to Central America in the 1980s and volunteered work for the Nicaraguan government helping the poor. I've read/seen no evidence whatsoever that she believed the FBI represented "Mom's apple pie and the Fourth of July."

[John Tonkovich]

Did Paine tell the FBI about the letter? It's contents? Answer: No. She showed it to her husband Michael who also dismissed it as nothing. Some informants.

According to the KGB officers/Embassy staffers at the Soviet Embassy in Mexico City, Oswald showed them his revolver and told them he need it to protect himself from the "notorious" FBI. Exact same characterization.

As to Ruth Paine: Paine is and was a political leftist - she went to Central America in the 1980s and volunteered work for the Nicaraguan government helping the poor. I've read/seen no evidence whatsoever that she believed the FBI represented "Mom's apple pie and the Fourth of July."

Ruth Paine is a leftist.
Please explain.
Citations, if possible.
Thanks.

[Jon Banks]

As to Ruth Paine: Paine is and was a political leftist - she went to Central America in the 1980s and volunteered work for the Nicaraguan government helping the poor. I've read/seen no evidence whatsoever that she believed the FBI represented "Mom's apple pie and the Fourth of July."

Not to get too deep into the Weeds of political theory but Ruth Paine sounds like a Trotskyite.

The Trotskyite Left in modern times has come to be defined as the anti-Communist Left (At least Communism as practiced by the Soviets).

They are on the Left for the most part but suspicious of the Radical Left or the Authoritarian/Stalinist Left.

Some Trotskyites voluntarily informed the FBI about radical Left movements in the 1960s.

The co-Founder of Amnesty International, Luis Kutner, is probably the most high profile example of that sort of thing. He informed the FBI about radical Left groups and other things. He was also a Mob lawyer and knew Jack Ruby.

http://ourhiddenhistory.org/entry/luis-kutner-the-declassified-life-of-a-human-rights-icon

Also, didn’t Marina Oswald testify a few years after the assassination that she was told by the Secret Service that Ruth was close to the CIA?

[Richard Smith]

Most people don't know the first detail about the JFK assassination.
Says who...the big know it all?
Their opinion is worthless.
How much is yours worth?
a Quaker, housewife can be a sinister master spy involved in an assassination
What a pile of crap. I do not ---nor do I agree that Ruth Paine was involved with any plot to assassinate JFK.
However her connection with the Oswalds [whatever that attachment might have been] left her vulnerable and vulnerable people are infused then with fear and intimidation. Mrs Paine's contradictory statements have been posted several times and long time members know this and some choose to ignore it.
Fear is the greatest motivator.

So you don't think Paine was involved but then you go to imply that she was involved due apparently to "fear."  You make this allegation base on no evidence whatsoever. And  fear of what?  It's 2020.  When is Paine going to come forward and tell us that she was coerced into making certain statements.  If someone was influencing her testimony, why didn't they do the obvious if they were trying to frame Oswald like: get Paine to say that Oswald stored a rifle in her garage, that he hated JFK, that he acted strangely on the night before the assassination, and that she saw him carry a long bag on that morning?  That would have been very helpful.  Instead she doesn't do any of those things.  But she is suspect for some unspecified reason.

[Steve M. Galbraith]

Ruth Paine is a leftist.
Please explain.
Citations, if possible.
Thanks.

This is from John Simkin's site: "Ruth Paine has worked for a Nicaraguan relief group in St. Petersburg, Florida. She is also a peace activist. In 1982 she claimed: "This year, for the first time, I am withholding that portion of my income tax (40 percent), which I estimate goes toward military uses and war preparations" In 2004 she was interviewed by the St. Petersburg Times: "I believe in taxation. I believe in government.. But I also believe in our right to religious freedom. And I believe in the fact that we value dissent as a patriotic thing."

I shouldn't have written that she's a liberal/leftist today. I don't know what her current views are. But her views certainly seem to me be of a liberal/left point of view.

Here she is briefly discussing her work (this is from "Mrs. Paine's Garage" by Thomas Mallon) in Central America in the 1990s (ProNica is a charity/aid group that goes to Nicaragua and provides care/help to the poor there; whether one wants to call that pro-Sandinista or not can be debate) :



And this relates to her college years. Obviously, that she went to a liberal/left college doesn't prove she held those political views in 1963. Or today. But it does indicate the type of thinking or worldview I think she still has. As I said, whether that shows a liberal/left political view or a apolitical religious view can be argued.