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Author Topic: Lee Oswald--- 4.0 Marine?  (Read 3085 times)

Offline Jerry Freeman

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Lee Oswald--- 4.0 Marine?
« on: April 07, 2020, 01:35:24 AM »
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July 9, 1957: LHO reports to the Marine Corps Air Station at El Toro, California, and is
attached to the 4th Replacement Battalion.
August 22, 1957: LHO departs for Japan.
September 12, 1957: He arrives in Japan at Yokosuka, where he is assigned to the
Marine Air Control Squadron #1, Marine Air Group 11, 1st Marine Aircraft Wing, based in Atsugi.
October 27, 1957: LHO accidentally shoots himself in the arm with a derringer.
November 15, 1957: LHO is discharged from the hospital at Yokosuka.
November 20, 1957: LHO’s unit sails for the Philippine Islands.
March 7, 1958: LHO's unit sails for Atsugi.
March 18, 1958: The unit reaches Atsugi.
April 11, 1958: LHO is court-martialed for the first time for illegal possession of a firearm.
June 27, 1958: LHO is court-martialed for the second time for assaulting a superior and
sentenced to the brig.

August 13, 1958: LHO is released from confinement.
September 14, 1958: LHO and his unit sail for the South China Sea.
September, 1958: LHO's unit arrives in Taiwan, where he suffers a nervous breakdown...
and is sent back to Japan.

October 5, 1958: LHO arrives in Atsugi.
October 6, 1958: LHO is put on general duty.
October 31, 1958: LHO receives his last overseas rating, a 4.0.
November 2, 1958: LHO departs Japan.
November 15, 1958: He arrives in San Francisco.
November 19, 1958: LHO takes 30 days leave.
December 22, 1958: LHO is assigned once again to El Toro, this time with MACS-9.   
January, 1959: LHO is given his semi-annual ratings, which are average.
February 25, 1959: LHO requests a foreign language test in Russian and scores "poor".
March 9, 1959: LHO is promoted to Private 1st Class again.
July, 1959: LHO is given his semi-annual ratings, which are average.

October 27, 1957: LHO accidentally shoots himself in the arm with a derringer.
November 15, 1957: LHO is discharged from the hospital at Yokosuka.
That was three weeks at a location some 40 miles from the base where Oswald incurred a non life threatening and by all appearances.. superficial wound. They didn't have base facilities for this minor treatment? Now-a-days someone is discharged the same afternoon! 

April 11, 1958: LHO is court-martialed for the first time for illegal possession of a firearm.
I have never heard of a military tribunal of this rather low magnitude that took six months to transpire. What his punishment was I haven't determined. 

June 27, 1958: LHO is court-martialed for the second time for assaulting a superior and
sentenced to the brig.

I haven't had the time to explore much more...but somewhere along the line Oswald was busted in rank and did six weeks in the brig.
When I was in the Navy, for the first three days-- brig rats were automatically placed on bread and water :-[

October 31, 1958: LHO receives his last overseas rating, a 4.0. Happy Halloween there...The highest rating score in the service and this after two courts-marshal a nervous breakdown and a fist into the face of a superior?
In the Navy I got quarterly scores...mediocre at that.
I was a piss poor sailor [I guess] but I didn't get into any chargeable trouble...called 'getting written up'.

February 25, 1959: LHO requests a foreign language test in Russian and scores "poor".
Maybe the test was just not fair ::)
 

JFK Assassination Forum

Lee Oswald--- 4.0 Marine?
« on: April 07, 2020, 01:35:24 AM »


Offline Jerry Freeman

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Re: Lee Oswald--- 4.0 Marine?
« Reply #1 on: April 10, 2020, 02:20:14 AM »
Oswald in the Philippines was completely left out in the above timeline.
I wonder why. I went and looked up a couple of reports.
Quote
November 15, 1957: LHO is discharged from the hospital at Yokosuka.
November 20, 1957: LHO’s unit sails for the Philippine Islands.
March 7, 1958: LHO's unit sails for Atsugi.
March 18, 1958: The unit reaches Atsugi.
That is all that is mentioned in most narratives.
Vincent Bugliosi advances some points in Reclaiming though I wonder if he wasn't the source of some of his own speculation.
There was an incident where a marine [one of Oswald's classmates] while on guard duty was found dead one evening...apparently from an accidental self inflicted gunshot. That is what was ruled.
Bugsie conjectures that there had been a conspiracy theory regarding Oswald being involved. What conspiracy crowd that would "intrigue" completely escapes me.
https://books.google.com/books?id=q1VJAgAAQBAJ&pg=PT775&lpg=PT775&dq=was+oswald+in+the+philippines&source=bl&ots=6BU6S3VBrh&sig=ACfU3U194MaAEDWbzzdBOdjqehM3iWl0mQ&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiw-72PydzoAhUEnq0KHZyjDKs4ChDoATAIegQIDBBA#v=onepage&q=
It would seem that Oswald did not actually physically assault Tech Sgt Miguel Rodriguez [according to Edward Epstein] but rather spilled [on purpose?] a liquid on him in an attempt to provoke a fight. The cause being that the Sgt had relegated Oswald to being a menial mess cook. Is this really our historically mousey Lee Oswald?
The idea of a substitute Oswald [a Harvey and Lee so to speak] did not originate with John Armstrong. It was actually proposed some 20 years earlier in a fictional novel by a fellow called Larry Names....
https://books.google.com/books?id=QTVm0dYh9AcC&pg=PA41&lpg=PA41&dq=was+oswald+in+the+philippines&source=bl&ots=SgZsf8W_oi&sig=ACfU3U1FmQs_iXRWOueyJpk2pjef_JJ9_g&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiw4uP6stzoAhUFi6wKHZw9DUUQ6AEwEXoECBAQKQ#v=onepage&q

Offline Jorn Frending

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Re: Lee Oswald--- 4.0 Marine?
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2020, 11:17:09 AM »
Oswald in the Philippines was completely left out in the above timeline.
I wonder why. I went and looked up a couple of reports.That is all that is mentioned in most narratives.
Vincent Bugliosi advances some points in Reclaiming though I wonder if he wasn't the source of some of his own speculation.
There was an incident where a marine [one of Oswald's classmates] while on guard duty was found dead one evening...apparently from an accidental self inflicted gunshot. That is what was ruled.
Bugsie conjectures that there had been a conspiracy theory regarding Oswald being involved. What conspiracy crowd that would "intrigue" completely escapes me.
https://books.google.com/books?id=q1VJAgAAQBAJ&pg=PT775&lpg=PT775&dq=was+oswald+in+the+philippines&source=bl&ots=6BU6S3VBrh&sig=ACfU3U194MaAEDWbzzdBOdjqehM3iWl0mQ&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiw-72PydzoAhUEnq0KHZyjDKs4ChDoATAIegQIDBBA#v=onepage&q=
It would seem that Oswald did not actually physically assault Tech Sgt Miguel Rodriguez [according to Edward Epstein] but rather spilled [on purpose?] a liquid on him in an attempt to provoke a fight. The cause being that the Sgt had relegated Oswald to being a menial mess cook. Is this really our historically mousey Lee Oswald?
The idea of a substitute Oswald [a Harvey and Lee so to speak] did not originate with John Armstrong. It was actually proposed some 20 years earlier in a fictional novel by a fellow called Larry Names....
https://books.google.com/books?id=QTVm0dYh9AcC&pg=PA41&lpg=PA41&dq=was+oswald+in+the+philippines&source=bl&ots=SgZsf8W_oi&sig=ACfU3U1FmQs_iXRWOueyJpk2pjef_JJ9_g&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiw4uP6stzoAhUFi6wKHZw9DUUQ6AEwEXoECBAQKQ#v=onepage&q


One should think that speaking even poor Russian would be quite an achievement for a self-taught Oswald, and even if he had been taught. Of course I don't know if "poor" was the lowest score. In any case studying Russian would most likely be a standard subject for future agents.

Oswald has been reported to have participated in the MK Ultra program and to have trained with Roscoe White in the Philippines. (Roscoe White who for unknown reasons possessed a BY photo in a shoebox under the roof of an aunt)

Well, your timeline shows that Oswald had time to be tested with LSD for three weeks in a Hospital and several month for special training with Roscoe White.

(The score of 4.0 may have been as qualifying for special operations rather than as a marine 😊)

But if you happen to know the score below poor .... ?
« Last Edit: April 12, 2020, 11:27:55 AM by Jorn Frending »

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Re: Lee Oswald--- 4.0 Marine?
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2020, 11:17:09 AM »


Offline Jerry Freeman

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Re: Lee Oswald--- 4.0 Marine?
« Reply #3 on: April 12, 2020, 08:47:35 PM »
One should think that speaking even poor Russian would be quite an achievement for a self-taught Oswald, and even if he had been taught. Of course I don't know if "poor" was the lowest score.
But military tests were written.
Вы знакомы с русским языком?---  That simply asks if you are familiar with Russian. Some people are good at speaking but not necessarily reading or writing Cyrillic languages. Oswald's Russian writing even in 1963 was especially poor.

Offline Jerry Freeman

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Re: Lee Oswald--- 4.0 Marine?
« Reply #4 on: April 12, 2020, 08:51:57 PM »
 

That can't be right because Lee was in the Western Pacific at the time.

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Re: Lee Oswald--- 4.0 Marine?
« Reply #4 on: April 12, 2020, 08:51:57 PM »


Offline Jorn Frending

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Re: Lee Oswald--- 4.0 Marine?
« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2020, 11:21:30 PM »
But military tests were written.
Вы знакомы с русским языком?---  That simply asks if you are familiar with Russian. Some people are good at speaking but not necessarily reading or writing Cyrillic languages. Oswald's Russian writing even in 1963 was especially poor.

Thanks  :)

« Last Edit: April 13, 2020, 05:38:38 PM by Jorn Frending »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Lee Oswald--- 4.0 Marine?
« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2020, 11:21:30 PM »