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Author Topic: Getting Some Facts Straight About the Single-Bullet Theory  (Read 29278 times)

Offline Tim Nickerson

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Re: Getting Some Facts Straight About the Single-Bullet Theory
« Reply #16 on: July 11, 2020, 09:26:19 PM »
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But, before we look at those facts, we first need to remember that the Warren Commission (WC) only cooked up the SBT in desperation after it could no longer ignore the wounding of James Tague.

When did the wounding of James Tague become a problem for the WC? June or July of 1964?

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Re: Getting Some Facts Straight About the Single-Bullet Theory
« Reply #16 on: July 11, 2020, 09:26:19 PM »


Offline Jerry Freeman

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Re: Getting Some Facts Straight About the Single-Bullet Theory
« Reply #17 on: July 11, 2020, 09:31:16 PM »
... no bunch...The bunch ... the bunch.... the bunch tapers ...... one-inch high bunch...
    One-inch on each side of the bunch.

It's all a bunch of it alright. Everybody see where the wound is?--- So get off it.


Offline Tim Nickerson

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Re: Getting Some Facts Straight About the Single-Bullet Theory
« Reply #18 on: July 11, 2020, 09:37:52 PM »
It's all a bunch of it alright. Everybody see where the wound is?--- So get off it.



 Thumb1: About 5.5 cm below a transverse fold in the skin of the neck. 3.5 cm above the exit wound in the throat.

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Re: Getting Some Facts Straight About the Single-Bullet Theory
« Reply #18 on: July 11, 2020, 09:37:52 PM »


Offline John Mytton

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Re: Getting Some Facts Straight About the Single-Bullet Theory
« Reply #19 on: July 12, 2020, 01:59:27 AM »
This is pretty close to the mark. The HSCA PEP concluded that Kennedy was hit at Z188-190, but Alvarez much more credibly concluded that JFK was hit at Z226. JFK's reaction right after Z188 was probably in response to being stung on the back of the head by two fragments from the bullet that struck the curb near the limousine (these fragments are visible on the autopsy skull x-rays--they only penetrated a tiny fraction of an inch into the skull--and the only plausible ballistics and forensic explanation for them is that they separated from a bullet outside the limo before they hit the skull).

Beginning at Z226, Kennedy's body is visibly jolted sharply forward, and the position of his hands and elbows--particularly his elbows--changes dramatically, as they are flung upward and forward. The force and speed of these movements of his arms and elbows are quite startling when one compares frame 226, where they are first discernible, to frame 232 just 1/3-second later. Although the WC, and to a great extent the HSCA, ignored these movements, they are among the most dramatic and visible reactions on JFK's part in the entire Zapruder film.

After carefully studying high-quality blowups of the Zapruder film at Life magazine, Connally himself said the impact of the bullet that struck him occurred at Z234.

If Kennedy was hit at Z186 and Connally at Z234, they were hit 48 frames/2.6 seconds apart. If JFK was hit at Z226 and Connally at Z234, they were hit 8 frames/0.45 seconds apart.

But let's take the longer interval of 2.6 seconds. Even that almost certainly would have been beyond Oswald's ability to do and still score two hits in three shots. Yes, if you just fire the Carcano as rapidly as you can, you can fire at a rate of 1.66 seconds per shot, but not with the degree of accuracy required by the lone-gunman scenario.

Using the alleged murder rifle itself, the three Master-rated riflemen in the WC's rifle test--Miller, Staley, and Hendrix--utterly failed to duplicate Oswald's alleged shooting feat. In the first series, Miller took 4.6 seconds to fire three shots, Staley took 6.75 seconds, and Hendrix took 8.25 seconds. In the second series, Miller took 5.15 seconds, Staley took 6.45 seconds, and Hendrix took 7 seconds. They missed the head and neck area of the target silhouettes 20 out of 21 times, even though they were firing from an elevation of only 30 feet (not 60) and even though the targets were stationary!

Yet, we're supposed to believe that Oswald, who was at best a mediocre shot in the Marines, scored two hits in three shots from 60 feet up on a moving target in only 5.56 seconds.

In the 1980s, some WC apologists began claiming that Oswald would have had 8.4 seconds to fire, not 5.56 seconds. But you can only expand the alleged lone gunman's firing time to 8.4 seconds if you assume that he fired at around Z160 and that he completely missed not only JFK but the entire huge limousine with his first and closest shot, the only shot that he had ample time to aim and fire, a proposition that even the WC admitted was unlikely.


What gives you the right to cite the Zapruder Film of evidence of anything, you keep saying and giving "examples" of the Zapruder film being edited, changed, doesn't match Nix, impossible motion of Brehm's kid, Greer's impossible head turn, missing actions etc etc yet when it suits, you point out Zapruder frame numbers and precise timing of events? WTF, it makes as much sense as if I cited the Star Wars films to calculate the speed of light.



https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,2596.0.html

JohnM
« Last Edit: July 12, 2020, 03:39:09 AM by John Mytton »

Online John Iacoletti

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Re: Getting Some Facts Straight About the Single-Bullet Theory
« Reply #20 on: July 12, 2020, 07:33:13 AM »
Before? How do you know that the back shot hasn't already occurred?

Exactly. So you agree then that Dan’s reference to the Croft photo as being “seconds before he is shot in the back” is unfounded, right?

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Re: Getting Some Facts Straight About the Single-Bullet Theory
« Reply #20 on: July 12, 2020, 07:33:13 AM »


Online John Iacoletti

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Re: Getting Some Facts Straight About the Single-Bullet Theory
« Reply #21 on: July 12, 2020, 07:36:18 AM »
And should we consider the fact that JFK is not sitting back against a seat and that there's no coat over the shirt in this photo?

Nor does he have a back brace on.

Offline Michael T. Griffith

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Re: Getting Some Facts Straight About the Single-Bullet Theory
« Reply #22 on: July 12, 2020, 01:29:52 PM »
Nellie Connally and Jackie both stated that the first shot hit both men, referencing when JBC cried out Oh No No No, which Gov Connally stated he cried out when he was hit.

I'm sorry, but that's just comical. It is well known that Jackie Kennedy did not believe the single-bullet theory, and it is especially well known that Nellie Connally didn't buy the theory. Let's read Nellie's testimony. She said she heard a noise, that she saw Kennedy reach for his neck, and that Gov. Connally was in the process of turning around to look at Kennedy when "the second shot was fired and hit him":

Quote
I heard a noise that I didn't think of as a gunshot. I just heard a disturbing noise and turned to my right from where I thought the noise had come and looked in the back and saw the President clutch his neck with both hands.

He said nothing. He just sort of slumped down in the seat. John had turned to his right also when we heard that first noise and shouted, "no, no, no," and in the process of turning back around so that he could look back and see the President--I don't think he could see him when he turned to his right--the second shot was fired and hit him.

So Nellie Connally most certainly did not say that JFK and her husband were hit by the same shot. And, of course, Gov. Connally himself insisted that he was not hit until Z234, and, after all, he was the one who experienced the hit. He looked at high-quality blowups of the Zapruder film at Life magazine and was adamant that he was not hit by Z224 and that Z234 was the frame of impact of the bullet that hit him.

In defending the idea that the shirt bunched in nearly perfect correspondence with the coat, someone else said (I'm paraphrasing),"We don't know what was going on with the shirt under the coat." Well, true. We don't know, but, gosh can't we use some common sense? When JFK was hit in the back, most of his back was reclined against the seat. Given the nearly perfect alignment of the coat and shirt holes, the shirt would have had to almost perfectly duplicate the bunching of the coat, both vertically and horizontally. You do not have to be a scientist to know that such a scenario is wildly implausible.

Furthermore, I see that SBT defenders are still ignoring the fact that the coat and shirt would have had to bunch from T3 up to and over C7/T1. Just any modest bunching anywhere on the coat will not work. It has to be bunching that would pull the part of the coat that was over T3 and move it to be over C7/T1. The modest bunching that we see in some photos/frames in JFK's coat just before the shot to his back does not even come close to doing that.

Below is a graphic to give you some idea of the vertical difference between a wound at T3 and a wound at C7/T1. The graphic also shows how far down a T3 wound would be based on the white dot that was placed on the back of stand-ins to represent the location of the hole in JFK's coat in some WC reenactments (since the graphic is large, you'll need to scroll over to see the reenactment photos--or you can just click on the link to open the photo in a new window).


https://miketgriffith.com/files/t3vst1c7.jpg




« Last Edit: July 12, 2020, 01:48:29 PM by Michael T. Griffith »

Offline Jack Nessan

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Re: Getting Some Facts Straight About the Single-Bullet Theory
« Reply #23 on: July 12, 2020, 04:48:38 PM »
I'm sorry, but that's just comical. It is well known that Jackie Kennedy did not believe the single-bullet theory, and it is especially well known that Nellie Connally didn't buy the theory. Let's read Nellie's testimony. She said she heard a noise, that she saw Kennedy reach for his neck, and that Gov. Connally was in the process of turning around to look at Kennedy when "the second shot was fired and hit him":

So Nellie Connally most certainly did not say that JFK and her husband were hit by the same shot. And, of course, Gov. Connally himself insisted that he was not hit until Z234, and, after all, he was the one who experienced the hit. He looked at high-quality blowups of the Zapruder film at Life magazine and was adamant that he was not hit by Z224 and that Z234 was the frame of impact of the bullet that hit him.



No, Jackie never said a word about SBT. She believed there was just two shots. Jackie could not believe anything but SBT. Gov Connally screaming is what diverted Jackie's attention from JFK.

Nelly, Jackie, and JBC all reference the same utterance of Oh No No No by JBC. Nelly and Jackie say that is after the first shot and JBC says it was after he was struck by the bullet.

----------------------------------------

How do you explain the bullet wound to Gov Connally's back if the bullet does not first pass through JFK?

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Re: Getting Some Facts Straight About the Single-Bullet Theory
« Reply #23 on: July 12, 2020, 04:48:38 PM »