The Position of the Bolt on the MC

[Dan O'meara]

Dan, you're being dishonest.... You know that I was making up the part about they planned to kill Lee Oswald on the sixth floor and leave the carcano beside his body....But if he wasn't there, they would leave the rifle hidden along his escape route ......

Lee wasn't on the sixth floor ( he was in the Domino room)

I'm sorry if you don't like that idea..... But Don't be dishonest and say I made up the part about Seymour Weitzman saying that he spotted the rifle when he shined his flashlight beneath the pallet.

You're the one being dishonest Walt.
My post about your theory being "100% fantasy" had nothing to do with Weitzman looking beneath the pallet.

[Walt Cakebread]

You're the one being dishonest Walt.
My post about your theory being "100% fantasy" had nothing to do with Weitzman looking beneath the pallet.

Perhaps I don't know what !00% means..... 

[Zeon Mason]

@Dan: are you aware that your slightly diagonal  green arrow LOS is going THRU a box which is laying on the ground?

So that would an obstruction even along a diagonal line at the ground plane from the Southeast corner side of the pallet to the Northeest corner

If Weitzman was looking instead thru the gap the arrows illustrate , then he  had to be at the south WEST corner of the pallet,, looking directly NORTH and also have his head about at least 3ft above the  floor plane  (it appears to me ) to get a vertical diagonal LOS over a 2nd level high box on the opposite side of that gap to be able to see OVER that box to see that small portion barrel end of the rifle

There was definitely  No LOS possible for Weitzman imo, to any portion of the butt and center portion of the stock of the rifle due to a box in the way at the time Weitzman and Boone discovered the rifle, That box was the one removed later to allow more of the rifle to be photographed.

So, I cannot see how Weitzman could have seen ANY portion of the rifle unless he was basically NOT looking Under the flat , was NOT at the East side of the pallet looking west or even Northwest, and he was actually STANDING at the South WEST corner of the pallet peering OVER that 2nd level box directly opposite the gap he theoretically could have looked thru.

So either Weitzman is  incorrect about his position AT THE INSTANT the he saw the rifle or he meant  he was EARLIER looking “under a flat “ before then changing his position to  the gap and THEN saw the rifle as he stood up and able to look OVER a 2nd level high box to see a portion of the rifle barrel.

So the choice still seems to be either Weitzman was mistaken or he saw the rifle in a different location. If the latter , then Boone had to have seen the rifle in that other location also and then both men opted to participate in a post event fraud.

@Walt: if the rifle  was preplanted then it should not ALL   the rifle be inside the pallet as surely the intent was to make sure the rifle was WELK hidden so not to be inadvertently discovered. Therefore I have to disagree with the idea that any portion of.the rifle would be visibly sticking out of the pallet.

[Dan O'meara]

@Dan: are you aware that your slightly diagonal  green arrow LOS is going THRU a box which is laying on the ground?

So that would an obstruction even along a diagonal line at the ground plane from the Southeast corner side of the pallet to the Northeest corner

If Weitzman was looking instead thru the gap the arrows illustrate , then he  had to be at the south WEST corner of the pallet,, looking directly NORTH and also have his head about at least 3ft above the  floor plane  (it appears to me ) to get a vertical diagonal LOS over a 2nd level high box on the opposite side of that gap to be able to see OVER that box to see that small portion barrel end of the rifle

There was definitely  No LOS possible for Weitzman imo, to any portion of the butt and center portion of the stock of the rifle due to a box in the way at the time Weitzman and Boone discovered the rifle, That box was the one removed later to allow more of the rifle to be photographed.

So, I cannot see how Weitzman could have seen ANY portion of the rifle unless he was basically NOT looking Under the flat , was NOT at the East side of the pallet looking west or even Northwest, and he was actually STANDING at the South WEST corner of the pallet peering OVER that 2nd level box directly opposite the gap he theoretically could have looked thru.

So either Weitzman is  incorrect about his position AT THE INSTANT the he saw the rifle or he meant  he was EARLIER looking “under a flat “ before then changing his position to  the gap and THEN saw the rifle as he stood up and able to look OVER a 2nd level high box to see a portion of the rifle barrel.

So the choice still seems to be either Weitzman was mistaken or he saw the rifle in a different location. If the latter , then Boone had to have seen the rifle in that other location also and then both men opted to participate in a post event fraud.

@Walt: if the rifle  was preplanted then it should not ALL   the rifle be inside the pallet as surely the intent was to make sure the rifle was WELK hidden so not to be inadvertently discovered. Therefore I have to disagree with the idea that any portion of.the rifle would be visibly sticking out of the pallet.

@Dan: are you aware that your slightly diagonal  green arrow LOS is going THRU a box which is laying on the ground?

The arrow isn't going through a box laying on the ground, it's going over some paper laying on the ground.
Weitzman would have had no problem seeing the barrel portion of the rifle whilst looking through the pallet.
The fact that there is a pallet at this location is very telling. Most of the stacks on the 6th floor that I've seen in photos don't have a pallet underneath. In fact, the one near the rifle is the only one I can find. But I've no doubt you could say it's just a coincidence that there was a pallet in a position where someone looking through it could see the rifle or that Weitzman got lucky etc.
Why you would imagine Weitzman made up looking through the pallet is beyond me. I've no doubt you've got some kind of reason for believing that.
However, the actual evidence demonstrates there was a pallet in the location Weitzman described, and that it was possible for him to see the barrel portion of the rifle while looking through it.

Out of curiosity, why do you believe Weitzman made up a story about looking through a pallet when he saw the rifle?
What purpose does such a story serve?

[Walt Cakebread]

@Dan: are you aware that your slightly diagonal  green arrow LOS is going THRU a box which is laying on the ground?

So that would an obstruction even along a diagonal line at the ground plane from the Southeast corner side of the pallet to the Northeest corner

If Weitzman was looking instead thru the gap the arrows illustrate , then he  had to be at the south WEST corner of the pallet,, looking directly NORTH and also have his head about at least 3ft above the  floor plane  (it appears to me ) to get a vertical diagonal LOS over a 2nd level high box on the opposite side of that gap to be able to see OVER that box to see that small portion barrel end of the rifle

There was definitely  No LOS possible for Weitzman imo, to any portion of the butt and center portion of the stock of the rifle due to a box in the way at the time Weitzman and Boone discovered the rifle, That box was the one removed later to allow more of the rifle to be photographed.

So, I cannot see how Weitzman could have seen ANY portion of the rifle unless he was basically NOT looking Under the flat , was NOT at the East side of the pallet looking west or even Northwest, and he was actually STANDING at the South WEST corner of the pallet peering OVER that 2nd level box directly opposite the gap he theoretically could have looked thru.

So either Weitzman is  incorrect about his position AT THE INSTANT the he saw the rifle or he meant  he was EARLIER looking “under a flat “ before then changing his position to  the gap and THEN saw the rifle as he stood up and able to look OVER a 2nd level high box to see a portion of the rifle barrel.

So the choice still seems to be either Weitzman was mistaken or he saw the rifle in a different location. If the latter , then Boone had to have seen the rifle in that other location also and then both men opted to participate in a post event fraud.

@Walt: if the rifle  was preplanted then it should not ALL   the rifle be inside the pallet as surely the intent was to make sure the rifle was WELK hidden so not to be inadvertently discovered. Therefore I have to disagree with the idea that any portion of.the rifle would be visibly sticking out of the pallet.

WHEN were these photos taken?

Please explain why Tom Alyea's film shows the rifle lying on it's side when Lt Day reaches out to pick up the rifle by the leather strap.





He seems to have misunderstood that Weitzman was on the floor looking through a pallet.
In the graphic the yellow/orange arrows are Jerry's and are part of the original graphic to which I have made some additions.
Ignore the yellow/orange arrows.

The stack of boxes marked with a green "A" in each pic rests on a pallet [it is the same stack seen from different angles]
To the bottom picture I have added a green arrow to give an indication of Weitzman's LoS as he was on the floor looking through the pallet.
It demonstrates that Weitzman could have seen the barrel portion of the rifle from his viewpoint

[Dan O'meara]

WHEN were these photos taken?

Please explain why Tom Alyea's film shows the rifle lying on it's side when Lt Day reaches out to pick up the rifle by the leather strap.





He seems to have misunderstood that Weitzman was on the floor looking through a pallet.
In the graphic the yellow/orange arrows are Jerry's and are part of the original graphic to which I have made some additions.
Ignore the yellow/orange arrows.

The stack of boxes marked with a green "A" in each pic rests on a pallet [it is the same stack seen from different angles]
To the bottom picture I have added a green arrow to give an indication of Weitzman's LoS as he was on the floor looking through the pallet.
It demonstrates that Weitzman could have seen the barrel portion of the rifle from his viewpoint

WHEN were these photos taken?

The top pic is from the Alyea footage so would have been taken on the day.
The bottom pic is a DPD photo taken before the rifle was moved from it's hiding position.
Not sure about the middle one.

Please explain why Tom Alyea's film shows the rifle lying on it's side when Lt Day reaches out to pick up the rifle by the leather strap.

After Day slid the rifle out from it's hiding place it [where it was filmed in the upright position], the rifle fell on it's side, then Day picked it up [as seen in the Alyea footage].
Tom Alyea has this to say about it:

"Still pictures were taken of the positioning of the rifle, then Lt. Day slid it out from its hiding place and held it up for all of us to see."

[Walt Cakebread]

WHEN were these photos taken?

The top pic is from the Alyea footage so would have been taken on the day.
The bottom pic is a DPD photo taken before the rifle was moved from it's hiding position.
Not sure about the middle one.

Please explain why Tom Alyea's film shows the rifle lying on it's side when Lt Day reaches out to pick up the rifle by the leather strap.

After Day slid the rifle out from it's hiding place it [where it was filmed in the upright position], the rifle fell on it's side, then Day picked it up [as seen in the Alyea footage].
Tom Alyea has this to say about it:

"Still pictures were taken of the positioning of the rifle, then Lt. Day slid it out from its hiding place and held it up for all of us to see."

If the stack of boxes are the boxes that were on the pallet.... Then that stack should be about 6 inches higher that the stacks of boxes that were not on pallets around the green "A" stack.... But all the stacks of boxes  look to be the same height

[Dan O'meara]

If the stack of boxes are the boxes that were on the pallet.... Then that stack should be about 6 inches higher that the stacks of boxes that were not on pallets around the green "A" stack.... But all the stacks of boxes  look to be the same height

Check this out for a solution:

Both stacks were on pallets!!

Booom!
#result