Did Marina have a reason to claim the MC rifle belonged to Lee?

[John Mytton]

First of all, where would anybody go to dispute that "easily accessible visual evidence"?
And secondly, Ceril Kirk's opinion was not shared by the other photographic specialists on the panel. Cherry pick much?

No. Hidell ordered C20-T750 from Department 358, which is a 36"rifle as advertised in February 1963

You've been told this before, the Dept number is simply a way to track what order comes from what magazine.

Mr. BELIN. Can you just give us one or more of the magazines in which this coupon might have been taken?
Mr. WALDMAN. Well, this coupon was specifically taken from American Rifleman Magazine, issue of February 1963. It's identified by the department number which is shown as--now, if I can read this--shown as Department 358 on the coupon.

First of all, where would anybody go to dispute that "easily accessible visual evidence"?

And secondly, Ceril Kirk's opinion was not shared by the other photographic specialists on the panel.

cite?

JohnM

[John Iacoletti]

You've been told this before, the Dept number is simply a way to track what order comes from what magazine.

Yes, and that magazine offered a 36” rifle for sale.

cite?

“the Panel's forensic photographic specialist considered this mark to be a random patterning sufficient to warrant a positive identification”

Note that it doesn’t say “the Panel considered…”. And Kirk merely said “tilts the scales”

[John Mytton]

“the Panel's forensic photographic specialist considered this mark to be a random patterning sufficient to warrant a positive identification”

Note that it doesn’t say “the Panel considered…”. And Kirk merely said “tilts the scales”

That doesn't support Martin's claim or answer my question.

Btw have you found any photo expert who refutes The HSCA'a photo exhibit 206? Waiting ZZZzzzzzzzzzzz......

And Kirk merely said “tilts the scales”

"yes, indeed it is the same rifle." "yes, indeed it is the same rifle." "yes, indeed it is the same rifle." "yes, indeed it is the same rifle." "yes, indeed it is the same rifle." "yes, indeed it is the same rifle." "yes, indeed it is the same rifle." "yes, indeed it is the same rifle."
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Mr. FITHIAN. I am going to ask Mr. McCamy in just a minute about any analysis he performed on this chip. Did you make measurement analysis and so forth?
Mr. McCAMY. Yes.
Mr. FITHIAN. All right. I will come back to you in just a minute. Do you know, Sergeant, whether or not the FBI at the time of the Warren Commission went through a process that would be the equivalent of yours, plus Mr. McCamy's, or can you shed any light on that?
Sergeant KIRK. The only testimony that I found in the Warren Commission report was relying on the testimony from one agent, Agent Shaneyfelt. There is no indication I could find where it was subjected to the analysis that this committee has on this weapon.
Mr. FITHIAN. Mr. McCamy, can you give us any measurement or photogrammetric process or anything that you did to further nail down this I think vital question.
Mr. McCAMY. Yes. We made measurements, measurements on the rifle, and on the photographs to ascertain that indeed this particular chip was in the right place.
Beyond that, however, I went to the Archives and made 21 photographs of the rifle using a variety of different kinds of illumination. On those photographs, it was possible to see a large number of nicks, scratches and so on, distinguishing marks.
I then went back through all of the photographs I had mentioned to you. In many instances--I believe in 56 different instances--I was able to find markings that appear on this rifle that were on the photographs that were made back there on the day of the assassination.
So, we are very confident that this is indeed the rifle that was carried from the book depository--oh, incidentally, I can carry it farther than that.
I found distinguishing marks of this rifle on a motion picture that was made at the time the police officer picked the rifle up off of the floor of the book depository. So that I think is very convincing evidence that it is the rifle."
https://www.jfk-assassination.net/russ/jfkinfo/kirk3.htm

JohnM

[Richard Smith]

When "Richard" can not present conclusive evidence to support his pathetic claims, he starts attacking the person he is talking to.

Klein's - a mail order business - receives an order for a rifle with a specific address.  Their records confirm that they process this order and even confirm the shipping date and method to that address.  Martin stupidly argues that this doesn't mean they shipped the rifle to that address.

What is stupid is believing that a mail order business would send out merchandise without keeping a shipping document to prove to their customer that the package was actually sent.

They did.  Their records confirm they sent him the rifle on March 20 via parcel post.  What is your explanation for such a record if you don't believe they sent him the rifle?  It's unclear to me what you believe happened here.  Klein's - a mail order business - received an order specifying an address to send the rifle. That address was Oswald's PO Box.  Their records indicate that they processed that order and sent a specific rifle with a serial number to Oswald's PO Box.  That same rifle was later found at Oswald's place of employment. But you suggest there is doubt that Klein's sent him this rifle.  Meaning by implication that something else happened. Do you think Klein's was involved in the framing of Oswald and faked these documents?  And that they were IN on it from as early as March 20?  They lied or fabricated all this information for some unknown reason.  If the documents are accurate, they prove that a specific rifle was sent to Oswald and that is the same rifle found at the TSBD.

[Richard Smith]

100% Dunning-Kruger, and you have been schooled on this repeatedly in the past.

There is no verified evidence that Klein's stocked the rifle when it was allegedly shipped.

Game over.

LOL.  Another mysterious first-time poster shows up to "help" Martin.  At least he didn't cite us to a "You Tube" video.  HA HA HA. 

[John Iacoletti]

Btw have you found any photo expert who refutes The HSCA'a photo exhibit 206? Waiting ZZZzzzzzzzzzzz......

You don’t have to refute something that hasn’t been proven in the first place. Next?

"yes, indeed it is the same rifle." "yes, indeed it is the same rifle." "yes, indeed it is the same rifle." "yes, indeed it is the same rifle." "yes, indeed it is the same rifle." "yes, indeed it is the same rifle." "yes, indeed it is the same rifle." "yes, indeed it is the same rifle."

“Tilts the scales” isn’t to the exclusion of all other rifles. It’s not even beyond a reasonable doubt. Next?

"Mr. FITHIAN. I am going to ask Mr. McCamy in just a minute about any analysis he performed on this chip. Did you make measurement analysis and so forth?
Mr. McCAMY. Yes.
Mr. FITHIAN. All right. I will come back to you in just a minute. Do you know, Sergeant, whether or not the FBI at the time of the Warren Commission went through a process that would be the equivalent of yours, plus Mr. McCamy's, or can you shed any light on that?
Sergeant KIRK. The only testimony that I found in the Warren Commission report was relying on the testimony from one agent, Agent Shaneyfelt. There is no indication I could find where it was subjected to the analysis that this committee has on this weapon.

Appeal to ignorance. There was no indication that it wasn’t, either.

Mr. FITHIAN. Mr. McCamy, can you give us any measurement or photogrammetric process or anything that you did to further nail down this I think vital question.
Mr. McCAMY. Yes. We made measurements, measurements on the rifle, and on the photographs to ascertain that indeed this particular chip was in the right place.
Beyond that, however, I went to the Archives and made 21 photographs of the rifle using a variety of different kinds of illumination. On those photographs, it was possible to see a large number of nicks, scratches and so on, distinguishing marks.
I then went back through all of the photographs I had mentioned to you. In many instances--I believe in 56 different instances--I was able to find markings that appear on this rifle that were on the photographs that were made back there on the day of the assassination.
So, we are very confident that this is indeed the rifle that was carried from the book depository--oh, incidentally, I can carry it farther than that.
I found distinguishing marks of this rifle on a motion picture that was made at the time the police officer picked the rifle up off of the floor of the book depository. So that I think is very convincing evidence that it is the rifle."

Red herring, but nice try. There was only one supposedly visible mark in the CE133A photo. This is talking about photos of the rifle being carried outside the TSBD, in the police station, and in the Alyea footage.

[John Iacoletti]

They did.  Their records confirm they sent him the rifle on March 20 via parcel post.  What is your explanation for such a record if you don't believe they sent him the rifle? 

No, their records “confirm” that someone circled “PP” on a form supposedly (but unverifiably) copied from the original microfilm. And nothing else.

It's unclear to me what you believe happened here.

It’s not complicated, “Richard”. What happened here is that there is nothing that shows that any such package went through the postal service, was shipped to Dallas, or that a 5-foot cardboard box labeled “firearm” was ever signed for or handed over to Oswald or anybody else. None.

[John Mytton]

You don’t have to refute something that hasn’t been proven in the first place. Next?

“Tilts the scales” isn’t to the exclusion of all other rifles. It’s not even beyond a reasonable doubt. Next?

Appeal to ignorance. There was no indication that it wasn’t, either.

Red herring, but nice try. There was only one supposedly visible mark in the CE133A photo. This is talking about photos of the rifle being carried outside the TSBD, in the police station, and in the Alyea footage.

More word games. LOL

JohnM