Lee Oswald The Cop Killer

[Martin Weidmann]

I posted this in another thread, but as we have been discussing the DPD radio transcripts and tapes here, it should really be placed her.

Another way to demonstrate that the DPD radio transcripts are unreliable is by demonstrating that they don't even match the actual recordings, as Bill Brown described hearing them at Dale Myers house.

The DPD transcripts have Bowley making his call at 1:17 and Callaway his call at 1:19. The WC puts the time of the shooting at around 1:16

According to Bill Brown, Dale Myers has the actual recording and has determined, by working backwards (from where exactly one can ask!) that the time of the shooting was likely 1:14:30 and that Bowley made his call at 1:17:40 (if I remember correctly!). Apparently, just after the shooting you can hear a sound on the tape that Bill believes is Benavides keying the mic of the patrol car. Bill has given three different durations (1 minute, 1,5 minute and 2 minutes) so for the purpose of this exercise let's go with 1,5 minute.

So now let's make a comparision. If the DPD transcripts are correct and the shooting indeed happened at 1:16 as the WC said, then where has Benavides keying the mic gone? He said he waited in his car until the killer was out of sight, which took about 45 seconds. Add to this 1,5 minutes of keying the mic (or even one minute) and you can never squeeze that between the WC shooting time of 1:16 and Bowley's call at 1:17 even if that call was made at 1:17:40.

Now, if the shooting happened at 1:14:30, as Myers claims, and Bowley indeed made his call at 1:17:40, there is three minutes and ten seconds to fit in the Benavides time of waiting 45 seconds and then keying the mic. However, even if you use Brown's longest estimate of 2 minutes for keying the mic, you still come up short by 25 seconds to fill the time gap between the shooting at 1:14:30 and Bowley's call at 1:17:40, which is strange because Bowley actually took the mic from Benavides, so there should not be a gap at all.

None of this makes any sense, because if the shooting happened at 1:14:30 and Callaway made his call at 1:19 (Brown sometimes speculates it could also have been 1:20) then you have Callaway making his call some 5 minutes after the shooting, when in fact he only needed (IMO) a little less than 3 minutes to get to scene after hearing the shots and those two extra minutes can not be accounted for, at least in a credible manner.

Also, according to Bill Brown three people phoned the police after the shooting, They are Mary Wright, Barbara Davis and L.J. Lewis. The dispatcher, Murray Jackson, would be notified about the calls by way of a time stamped call sheet that was passed on to him on a conveyor belt. Still according to Brown, the dispatcher did not know about Tippit's shooting until he received Bowley's radio call at 1:17:40. Are we really to believe that it took the telephone operator at 3 minutes to pass a call sheet to the radio dispatcher, who was sitting in the same room?

All this justifies the conclusion that the transcript and the actual radio tapes (as decribed by Brown) do not match reality nor do they match eachother.

[Martin Weidmann]

On McAdams DPD tapes pages, you can download a sections of the channel one recording, though it's in Real Audio format. One of those sections covers the period in question. If you listen, you'll notice that the transmission corresponding to the second (after 1:19) "602 code 6" in the transcript doesn't really sound like what is in the transcript. Specifically, the "6" in "code 6" doesn't sounds like someone saying "6". I'll let you decide for yourself, it to me it sounds like someone else tried to break onto the channel and rendered the end of whatever 602 was trying to say unintelligable.

I'm not sure what point you are actually trying to make but earlier in this thread we had the discussion about the ambulance (602) calls. Dan and I believe that the ambulance arrived just as Callaway was making his call. The 602 calls just prior and during Callaway's radio call were not the ambulance leaving but the ambulance driver trying to call in that it was a police officer who had been shot. It is all explained in reply #2220 at the top of this page.

[Mitch Todd]

I'm not sure what point you are actually trying to make but earlier in this thread we had the discussion about the ambulance (602) calls. Dan and I believe that the ambulance arrived just as Callaway was making his call. The 602 calls just prior and during Callaway's radio call were not the ambulance leaving but the ambulance driver trying to call in that it was a police officer who had been shot. It is all explained in reply #2220 at the top of this page.

I was replying to a comment made by Dan in response to what I originally wrote in reply #2183. That's where I explained to him how Callaway's testimony excludes the ambulance arriving before Callaway picked up the microphone. You're way behind me at #2220.

[Martin Weidmann]

I was replying to a comment made by Dan in response to what I originally wrote in reply #2183. That's where I explained to him how Callaway's testimony excludes the ambulance arriving before Callaway picked up the microphone. You're way behind me at #2220.

Sorry about that. My error.

The fact that you agree with the ambulance not arriving before Callaway picked up the mic is duly noted. I agree!

[Dan O'meara]

On McAdams DPD tapes pages, you can download a sections of the channel one recording, though it's in Real Audio format. One of those sections covers the period in question. If you listen, you'll notice that the transmission corresponding to the second (after 1:19) "602 code 6" in the transcript doesn't really sound like what is in the transcript. Specifically, the "6" in "code 6" doesn't sounds like someone saying "6". I'll let you decide for yourself, it to me it sounds like someone else tried to break onto the channel and rendered the end of whatever 602 was trying to say unintelligable.

This was the relevant part of the post in question:

Shortly after Bowley's call on Tippit's radio the Dispatcher puts out this call:

"Attention. Signal 19 [shooting], police officer, 510 E. Jefferson." (Even though Bowley gives 404 Tenth Street as the address of the shooting)

Ambulance 602 responds - "Code 5" [En Route]

Maybe one minute later 602 states - "Code 6" [Arrived] - Meaning the ambulance has reached the East Jefferson address.

Shortly after this 602 asks - "What was that address on Jefferson?" - presumably because there is no sign of anything wrong.
To which the Dispatcher responds - "501 East Tenth."

Shortly after this 602 states - "Code 6" [Arrived] - Meaning they have arrived at the scene of the Tippit shooting at 501 East Tenth Street

Shortly after this 602 tries to get the attention of the Dispatcher but the call is interrupted by Callaway's call.

On the tapes 602 responds to the address 510 E. Jefferson, state when they get there, ask what the address was (as, presumably, there's nothing going on), they are given the correct address (only a few seconds drive from where they are) and they announce they have arrived "Code 6" (whether you can make it out or not it is part of a sequence).
Butler reports that when he gets to the scene Tippit is lying in the street, covered by a blanket (or a coat). They pull it back to discover the victim is a policeman and Butler gets straight back on the radio to call this in. On the tapes, 602 is trying to call at the time of Callaway's call and don't seem to get through. Butler describes this precise sequence of events - arriving at the scene (calling in their arrival), finding the victim is a police officer, getting back on the radio to call "Mayday" but he can't get through and gives up (because Callaway is making his call). It is after this they load Tippit into the ambulance.

It is clear from the transcripts that, although 602 calls "Code 3" before the Callaway call there is not enough time for the ambulance to pull up, for Butler to check on Tippit and then make his aborted call and, then, for Tippit's body to be loaded into the ambulance before Callaway makes his call.

I believe this confirms the timeline Martin puts forward but I don't know what the big deal is as it has zero bearing on Oswald's guilt as far as the Tippit murder is concerned.

[Bill Brown]

If it were an automatic, you'd expect the empty cases to be flung to the right of the shooter. That is, to the east of Tippit's car. The cases that were recovered were well to the west.

Absolutely. The shells were not from an automatic weapon. Thankfully, I haven't seen anyone recently argue in favor of that, however. They're learning, slowly.

[Martin Weidmann]

This was the relevant part of the post in question:

On the tapes 602 responds to the address 510 E. Jefferson, state when they get there, ask what the address was (as, presumably, there's nothing going on), they are given the correct address (only a few seconds drive from where they are) and they announce they have arrived "Code 6" (whether you can make it out or not it is part of a sequence).
Butler reports that when he gets to the scene Tippit is lying in the street, covered by a blanket (or a coat). They pull it back to discover the victim is a policeman and Butler gets straight back on the radio to call this in. On the tapes, 602 is trying to call at the time of Callaway's call and don't seem to get through. Butler describes this precise sequence of events - arriving at the scene (calling in their arrival), finding the victim is a police officer, getting back on the radio to call "Mayday" but he can't get through and gives up (because Callaway is making his call). It is after this they load Tippit into the ambulance.

It is clear from the transcripts that, although 602 calls "Code 3" before the Callaway call there is not enough time for the ambulance to pull up, for Butler to check on Tippit and then make his aborted call and, then, for Tippit's body to be loaded into the ambulance before Callaway makes his call.

I believe this confirms the timeline Martin puts forward but I don't know what the big deal is as it has zero bearing on Oswald's guilt as far as the Tippit murder is concerned.

I believe this confirms the timeline Martin puts forward but I don't know what the big deal is as it has zero bearing on Oswald's guilt as far as the Tippit murder is concerned.

Agreed to some extent, but point well taken. Why fight the obvious time line and defend the DPD radio recordings/transcripts if one is not preoccupied with the possibe consequences?

[Martin Weidmann]

Absolutely. The shells were not from an automatic weapon. Thankfully, I haven't seen anyone recently argue in favor of that, however. They're learning, slowly.

They're learning, slowly.

Get off your high horse! The truck carrying your ego is delayed!